Game Thread Breath of the Wild Mafia

[kokirion]

No. I won't outright claim unless I have to, but I'd rather not have to.

Than what was that threat about?

 

[Spiritual Mask Salesman]

Than what was that threat about?

I've just always felt with my role it's best to just lay low and not attract attention to oneself. But I always screw that up. I'm the Cop. I invitigated Flora last night. I figured I'd look at someone besides All Might even though he kind of drove the Tristan wagon. She turned out innocent, but I'm not quite sure how this Lightening Rod thing would influence my results if at all?

 

[Pen]

Day 2 Current Vote Tally:
All Might - 1 (Flora)
Kirino - 1 (A Link In Time)
Spiritual Mask Salesman - 1 (funnier6)
A Link In Time - 1 (Rubik)
Flora - 1 (Kirino)

Not voting - PancakeSamurai, Sadia, YIGAhim, Spiritual Mask Salesman, All Might, Minish_Link, kokirion

With 12 players alive it takes 7 for a majority lynch. Otherwise the day ends on Sunday, July 29th 2018 at 7:00 PM EST. Countdown: https://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/generic?iso=20180729T19&p0=43&msg=End+of+Day+2&font=slab&csz=1

Post count (players not mentioned have already made the required 3 posts):
@PancakeSamurai - 0
@Sadia - 0
@Minish_Link - 1

 

[Morbid Minish]

Nonetheless, I see ALIT’s case as somewhat different from that of Flora and Sadia. Flora focusses only on a specific person, and started with that long before the Tristan bandwagon became a big thing. Sadia was only half involved with defending Tristan, and made a “threat” but did not yet follow up on it. ALIT, at the other hand, very strongly defended Tristan at the time, and seems to be chasing after multiple people who only have in common that they voted for Tristan.

With Tristan flipping town, I don't think ALIT is scummy for strongly defending him and for going after the people on his wagon. To me, scum would be less likely to strongly defend Tristan and more likely to slightly defend him to lay low and gain some town cred from it. And it makes sense to me to look into the Tristan band wagon after he flipped town, since there's a decent chance there's at least one scum on it. I actually think your reasoning for Sadia seems more scummy than your reason for ALIT.

How do you feel about SMS right now?

I went back and read his posts, and quite frankly it seemed like a lot of CWAC. Day 1 he seemed to be just repeating a lot of what was already said. Then he said he wasn't onboard with a Tristan lynch because he wasn't seeing much reasoning for voting him. And that he was a bit suspicious of All Might (I believe for the rvs votes thing) and a little less suspicious of ALIT (which I don't get why?). He then voted for All Might without giving a reason, and that was basically the last thing he did right before eod. Seemed like a safe spot to jump on a wagon as scum and then lay low the rest of the time. Especially since he wasn't on board with a Tristan lynch, but also didn't argue against it when the votes started going that way.

I agreed with All Might's reasoning on the Tristan case.

So you agreed that Tristan should've responded more defensively to the 3 rvs votes on him? Despite town reading All Might now I still think that was really weak reasoning and didn't make much sense. I think scum could easily sheep All Might for his reasoning on Tristan because he was doing most of the pushing and looks townie for it now.

her post in which she threatens everyone on the Tristan bandwagon was very scummy. Att the other hand, I found her other posts on day 1 reminiscent of her usual town play. She did not yet post today, I want to see a bit more activity from Sadia before I can put her on my town or scum list

What exactly would you say looks townie about Sadia's day 1 posts? I've never played with her before, so I don't know what her usual play looks like.

I've already written lots about ALIT. Basically, I find his fixation on people that used to be on the Tristan wagon peculiar. At the other hand, I do like his activity and he is willing to put himself out there. So I do not want to vote for him (yet).

It's kinda weird to me you're focusing on ALIT over the other people who said they would focus on Tristan's wagon. Mostly because you seem to not be scum reading Sadia from that yet, and said you need more activity from her today to get a better read on her. But you're scum reading ALIT for it, while saying you've liked his activity from today.

only posted 4 times. He has not yet directly attacked any players in the game, which could be a scum-tactic to stay out of danger. Most of the contents of his posts concerned set-up related topics, such as whether there was a lightning rod, roleblocker, or doctor last night.
I can imagine him being scum, and consider voting for him today, but I would first like to hear more from him. @Minish_Link , who are currently your prime suspects and why?

It's not a big deal but *she.

But yeah, I haven't directly went after anyone yet because I had to re-read to get a good feel of anyone. And I think it's a little unfair to say most of the content of my posts concerned set-up stuff when I've only had one post this day phase so far, and I addressed set-up partially in it. My response to Yiga about what happened at night was mostly a critique to try and help him play better since he seems to want to learn how to. And I think discussing the potential lightning rod scenario is pretty important, because if that was the case then certain power roles need to know that their results aren't correct for the person they initially targeted and would instead give them the results of the lightning rod. I think trying to shut down discussion of that is a little scummy because knowing what happened at night helps town figure things out.


As for my prime suspects I'll just post my reads list.

Town
All Might

Spoiler

I've already touched on why I find All Might town. He usually isn't as active as he was day 1, especially not as scum. I feel like his typical scum game is to lurk pretty much through the whole game. Plus he usually softs his role as town, which he did at the beginning of the current day.

funnier

Spoiler

Looks like typical town funnier. Has been aggressively pushing people and seems to be actively scum hunting. I feel like when he's scum he's more reserved/hesitant but has been getting a lot of the discussion going.

ALIT

Spoiler

Kinda surprised to be town reading ALIT when I usually find him so scummy, but his reasoning for stuff has resonated with me a lot this game. He was active day 1 which is unusual for him, and he seems to be a little reckless with his posts, which I don't think he would do as scum. Seems like he's trying to keep discussion active. Plus a lot of the suspicion on him seems to come from the fact that he defended Tristan? Which I don't necessarily get because Tristan did flip town, so it's not like he was defending a scumbud. I mean it's not impossible for scum to defend someone they obviously know is town, but I feel like the biggest defenders are typically townies seeing other townies about to be lynched. Similar to how I was so vocal against a funnier lynch last game and we were both town.

Flora

Spoiler

While I think her reasoning for going after All Might is pretty weak altogether, she seems to have hinted some info that makes me have a decent town read on her. Plus, this does feel like her town play (though I'm not sure if I've seen her as scum before). It seems like she usually sets her sight on someone and is hard to let up on them once she does.

Neutral
Kirino

Spoiler

Kirino's in the neutral pile mostly because I don't really know how to read him yet. However, I'd say I have a bit more of a town lean on him. His vote for Tristan felt like the best one day 1. Due to the fact that Tristan did appear to throw a bit of shade on him for his rvs vote (though it may have been joking) and when Kirino called him out on it and other things Tristan said, he never responded. Plus he's been contributing some great discussion, and has been pushing people which looks good. I'm just a bit hesitant to completely town read him because I know he's a good player, and I don't know if I've seen his scum game.

Pancake

Spoiler

Hasn't been active at all, but that seems to be very NAI for him. He did remove his rvs vote from Tristan when there was a tie between him and All Might, but again I don't really know how much that means seeing as he never said anything about anyone ever day 1.

Rubik

Spoiler

Rubik's kinda the opposite of Kirino for me right now. I don't know how to read him well, but I'd say I have a bit more of a scum lean on him than town. He feels like he's laying a bit low this game, which I'm not sure is AI for him. Day 1 he was originally going after ALIT, saying it was due to having negative vibes from his posts which is a bit weird to me. He also said that All Might's posts gave him positive vibes, but a bit later voted for All Might. His reasoning was so there wouldn't be a no lynch, which is fair, but he never commented on his read on Tristan and could have voted him instead, rather than someone whose posts felt positive to him.

Scum
Sadia

Spoiler

She starting out day 1 looking okay, since she was asking questions and participating in discussion. However, it was towards the end of day 1 when she starts to look particularly scummy to me. This post looks pretty wish-washy to me, kinda like she would've been fine with either lynch. The "I need a vote count to figure out who I should vote!" feels particularly weird to me, as it's best to vote for who you find scummy. Granted that could be a joke, but with the back and forth on the two top wagons at the time after that, I'm not so sure.

Spoiler

I need a vote count to figure out who I should vote!

In Tristan's case, I honestly don't even think he's scum. He's way too relaxed at this point and I personally believe his wording was misconstrued and blown out of proportion. On the flip side, the lack of scum hunting and voting makes him slightly suspicious. However, as koko said, there have been multiple players defending him as well as those accusing him, so having his alignment revealed would help with reading all those players further.

I am more suspicious of All Might because like I said, it seemed like he tried to sway the suspicion towards Tristan. However, I wanted to say @Flora s vote on him seems out of nowhere and suspicious to me, making me suddenly nervous to vote All Might for some reason.

Then there's the third option of AliT. Tbh I can kind of relate to him where my activity doesn't usually indicate my alignment, and I kinda want to see him play more so I can get a solid read.

She then said that if Tristan flipped town she would be suspicious of basically everyone on his wagon (besides Rubik for some reason, and Kokirion to a lesser extent which I don't get either). This was after she had been wavering on who to vote as well, so it seems like she wanted to move suspicion from herself and onto others.

Kokirion

Spoiler

Speculated about a possible Tristan/ALIT/funnier scum team fairly early on day 1, which is just weird to me. It's hard to have any info at that point, and there haven't even been any flips so trying to make connections like that looks like it's trying a little hard. When he voted Tristan he said that it wasn't because he particularly thought Tristan was scum, but because Tristan connected funnier and ALIT as well. When Tristan's posts were the main focus and the things being scum read, so it's odd that he associated funnier and ALIT for defending him and then said he didn't necessarily find Tristan scummy. Seemed like a bit of pushing to make his scum team speculation fit. Also something I happened to notice when reading back through is that today he said that he didn't vote Tristan initially because the one post of Tristan's would be really weak reasoning, but when he came back to the game it seemed like All Might was going to be lynched instead so he voted Tristan. However, he had originally voted Tristan before the votes started piling on All Might's wagon but he had forgotten to unvote. So it does look like his vote had came after All Might was potentially going to be lynched, but actually it happened before that.

SMS

Spoiler

I've already explained previously in this quote why I find SMS suspicious, but I'll copy/paste it here for convenience. I went back and read his posts, and quite frankly it seemed like a lot of CWAC. Day 1 he seemed to be just repeating a lot of what was already said. Then he said he wasn't onboard with a Tristan lynch because he wasn't seeing much reasoning for voting him. And that he was a bit suspicious of All Might (I believe for the rvs votes thing) and a little less suspicious of ALIT (which I don't get why?). He then voted for All Might without giving a reason, and that was basically the last thing he did right before eod. Seemed like a safe spot to jump on a wagon as scum and then lay low the rest of the time. Especially since he wasn't on board with a Tristan lynch, but also didn't argue against it when the votes started going that way.

Yiga

Spoiler

I'm sure I've stated in enough games how Yiga always looks scummy to me. However, this game really seems to hit his scum play, in that he has been CWAC. The most contribution I've seen from him is his vote for funnier, which it looked like he was voting him for doing his usual town play? And his speculation about what happened the previous night, which was just confusing and all over the play so it felt like he could be trying to throw town off.

 

[Morbid Minish]

I've just always felt with my role it's best to just lay low and not attract attention to oneself. But I always screw that up. I'm the Cop. I invitigated Flora last night. I figured I'd look at someone besides All Might even though he kind of drove the Tristan wagon. She turned out innocent, but I'm not quite sure how this Lightening Rod thing would influence my results if at all?

GDI, you posted this while I was in the middle of making my reads post. Lol.

Unless someone counters you, this is a pretty believable claim. But I don't know why you claimed yet when you weren't in a ton of danger atm. Especially when your results would be affected by the lightning rod (I assume at least).

Oh yeah, and I forgot to put this at the end of my previous post.

Vote: Sadia

 

[Lily]

While I think her reasoning for going after All Might is pretty weak altogether, she seems to have hinted some info that makes me have a decent town read on her. Plus, this does feel like her town play (though I'm not sure if I've seen her as scum before). It seems like she usually sets her sight on someone and is hard to let up on them once she does.

Close enough. My playstyle is a fixated one, I prefer to consistently observe one specific person above the rest, and that includes the votes and talk about them. It just happens to be All Might this game. As much as I found the situation All Might was in with kokirion suspicious, everyone else is clearing him, so for the time being i'll loosen up a bit.

Unvote

 

[Lily]

Though there is an elephant in the room we need to address, and as much as kokirion hates it, it needs to be done. We agree that the Lightning Rod attracts all night actions to it correct? All Might "watched" funnier last night, and SMS "cop checked" me last night. Two night actions on two different people shouldn't have been possible.

 

[Spiritual Mask Salesman]

GDI, you posted this while I was in the middle of making my reads post. Lol.

Unless someone counters you, this is a pretty believable claim. But I don't know why you claimed yet when you weren't in a ton of danger atm. Especially when your results would be affected by the lightning rod (I assume at least).

Oh yeah, and I forgot to put this at the end of my previous post.

Vote: Sadia

Last game I was accused of waiting too long to claim. Plus I feel like if I claimed my role after votes had piled up on me it'd be twisted as a last ditch effort to survive.

 

[funnier6]

@funnier6 kokirion included me, you, and Tristan in that scum team theory, not Kirino.

Yeah I just looked back and must’ve assumed from what you said about kokirion that you were voting him. Luckily most of my argument still makes sense.

The only negative thing about his posts is that he seems to be so focussed on talking about the possible lightning rod thingy today, which I think is really a waste of time. The notion of it being a possible explanation for what happened tonight was interesting and useful information for nearly everyone, but no further discussion on the topic is going to deliver any more to us. We should really focuss on debating a possible new lynch instead.

I don’t recall you replying to anything I said to you. And if you’d read the wall posts instead of the short and sweet ones you’d se I’ve been talking about a lot more than lightning rods.

I thought he was rather inactive, but I found out he posted more than me so far when I checked his activity. Kirino was one of the first to call out on Tristan's post, he defended All Might with solid reasoning and later accused Flora. What I like about Kirino is that his posts have had content and he has not shun away from having unpopular opinions or from entering discussions that could also endanger himself. He seems townish to me.

Possibly I’m losing my mind, but didn’t you find Kirino suspicious before? What changed?

Neutral
- Flora

See if you’d paid attention to the lightning rod stuff this wouldn’t happen

her post in which she threatens everyone on the Tristan bandwagon was very scummy. Att the other hand, I found her other posts on day 1 reminiscent of her usual town play. She did not yet post today, I want to see a bit more activity from Sadia before I can put her on my town or scum list

What exactly is town/scum Sadia like to you?

I won't vote for Rubik, I am not THAT convinced that he is scum

Do you really have to be that convinced in order to vote someone? Out of your four suspects who are you going to vote?

only posted 4 times. He has not yet directly attacked any players in the game, which could be a scum-tactic to stay out of danger. Most of the contents of his posts concerned set-up related topics, such as whether there was a lightning rod, roleblocker, or doctor last night.
I can imagine him being scum, and consider voting for him today, but I would first like to hear more from him. @Minish_Link , who are currently your prime suspects and why

Lol Minish is a girl.

That’s just her playstyle though, I’m a bit biased to find her town all the time though. Still want to see more this is scummy, thus scum, not might be scum, thus this is scummy.

I've just always felt with my role it's best to just lay low and not attract attention to oneself. But I always screw that up. I'm the Cop. I invitigated Flora last night. I figured I'd look at someone besides All Might even though he kind of drove the Tristan wagon. She turned out innocent, but I'm not quite sure how this Lightening Rod thing would influence my results if at all?

Just FYI you can claim cop whenever since it’s probably the most believable claim there is though if I were you I would’ve had to be much more desperate to claim on day two.

As for my prime suspects I'll just post my reads list.

Idk if you just copied Kokirions or if I need to refresh but those spoilers were empty for me.

We agree that the Lightning Rod attracts all night actions to it correct? All Might "watched" funnier last night, and SMS "cop checked" me last night. Two night actions on two different people shouldn't have been possible.

He just attempted to target me is what I’m seeing.

Last game I was accused of waiting too long to claim. Plus I feel like if I claimed my role after votes had piled up on me it'd be twisted as a last ditch effort to survive.

Yeah, nobody likes to lynch the cop so you’d have been fine.

Oh,

Unvote

Yeah probably should do that.

 

[Morbid Minish]

Though there is an elephant in the room we need to address, and as much as kokirion hates it, it needs to be done. We agree that the Lightning Rod attracts all night actions to it correct? All Might "watched" funnier last night, and SMS "cop checked" me last night. Two night actions on two different people shouldn't have been possible.

I don't think they would be notified if their target changed due to a lightning rod. So All Might originally tried to target funnier and SMS originally tried to target you and got the results of whoever the lightning rod is.

Last game I was accused of waiting too long to claim. Plus I feel like if I claimed my role after votes had piled up on me it'd be twisted as a last ditch effort to survive.

I don't think you were necessarily accused of waiting too long, I think you just happened to be one of the last town not to claim. And that was in a limitless claim game, whereas this one is a one claim per day. So bit different circumstances. But typically no one's gonna lynch a claimed cop unless there's a counter, so you would've been fine to wait and see if the votes did pile up on you. Not so great to have mafia know who the cop is day 2.

Idk if you just copied Kokirions or if I need to refresh but those spoilers were empty for me.

Nah, I dunno what's going on there. If anyone else can't see what's in the spoilers it's showing for me so I can repost if needed.

 

[Lily]

I don't think they would be notified if their target changed due to a lightning rod. So All Might originally tried to target funnier and SMS originally tried to target you and got the results of whoever the lightning rod is.

I didn't think about that possibility.

Nah, I dunno what's going on there. If anyone else can't see what's in the spoilers it's showing for me so I can repost if needed.

I had the same issue and had to change my background to see it, otherwise you should be able to highlight the blank spoiler to see the text.

 

[funnier6]

though I'm not sure if I've seen her as scum before).

She was mafia in anime and subbed out night 2 I think?

I'm just a bit hesitant to completely town read him because I know he's a good player, and I don't know if I've seen his scum game.

This is really true, I haven’t been watching him as closely as I should’ve.

I'm sure I've stated in enough games how Yiga always looks scummy to me. However, this game really seems to hit his scum play, in that he has been CWAC. The most contribution I've seen from him is his vote for funnier, which it looked like he was voting him for doing his usual town play? And his speculation about what happened the previous night, which was just confusing and all over the play so it felt like he could be trying to throw town off.

An I internesting difference to me is when he’s scum he tries to look like he’s contributing when he actually isn’t but right now he’s blatantly trying to contribute as little as possible and has said as much. He seems a little weird altogether but I haven’t seen anything that particularly brings his scum play to mind.

Speculated about a possible Tristan/ALIT/funnier scum team fairly early on day 1, which is just weird to me. It's hard to have any info at that point, and there haven't even been any flips so trying to make connections like that looks like it's trying a little hard. When he voted Tristan he said that it wasn't because he particularly thought Tristan was scum, but because Tristan connected funnier and ALIT as well. When Tristan's posts were the main focus and the things being scum read, so it's odd that he associated funnier and ALIT for defending him and then said he didn't necessarily find Tristan scummy. Seemed like a bit of pushing to make his scum team speculation fit. Also something I happened to notice when reading back through is that today he said that he didn't vote Tristan initially because the one post of Tristan's would be really weak reasoning, but when he came back to the game it seemed like All Might was going to be lynched instead so he voted Tristan. However, he had originally voted Tristan before the votes started piling on All Might's wagon but he had forgotten to unvote. So it does look like his vote had came after All Might was potentially going to be lynched, but actually it happened before that.

How do you feel about all his reasonings about what might be scum play and might not and his reluctance to actually vote?

Nah, I dunno what's going on there. If anyone else can't see what's in the spoilers it's showing for me so I can repost if needed.

Turns out I couldn’t see it on my theme. S’all good now though.

Surprised two people have made reads lists without me yelling at them. (You’re welcome @All Might ) I’m not feeling like making one right now (kinda wanna go back to sleep) but might do one later.

 

[A Link In Time]

Hmm, I'll take SMS's claim to be true if there is no counter claim.

Unvote

Vote: kokirion

I still do not trust koki after his statement about thinking Tristan, funnier, and I were a scum team. And his scum list is all people who I think are mostly town. Rubik and YIGA are the only two uncertains for me there. I think Rubik is more likely just a tunneling townie in this situation, though.

I still want to know whether or not there is a lightning rod, but I decided to target koki myself last night as I thought there was a pretty good chance he would be the one doing the factional kill as mafia if he were one as he maintained a pretty low profile yesterday but still stood out to me as a possible suspect. If there isn't some kind of redirect in place, I feel pretty confident I tampered with his kill. All Might saying I targeted funnier is bizarre, but perhaps it was kokirion who was redirected, and I followed him because I used my action on him originally. I wanted to hold off with saying this, but it's also another reason why I suspect Kirino as he seems pretty cozy with koki right now.

 

[A Link In Time]

I will try to post a full reads list sometime tonight, but I feel the following people are town in no particular order: Minish, Sadia, All Might, SMS, Flora. Kokirion and Kirino are my two mafia reads right now.

 

[Kirino]

So, from what I understand, Flora is the lightning rod, All Might is the watcher, and SMS is the cop. All Might claimed to have watched funnier, though, and SMS to have investigated Flora; the former wouldn't make sense considering that all night actions are redirected to Flora, but the most likely explanation of this is that players with night abilities aren't informed of the redirection of their targets, such that All Might actually targeted Flora, but still thought he targeted funnier.

I have no reason to doubt any of the roleclaims/softclaims, especially given that SMS apparently received an innocent result on Flora, so I'm now obligated to town read all of these people.

Something else catches my interest: All Might also asked ALIT and Koki if they targeted funnier last night, with both saying no. Presumably, both of them actually targeted Flora, the lightning rod, with All Might merely thinking that they targeted funnier. It's interesting that All Might only asked these two, though, while refusing to say if any others targeted the one he watched, because if there weren't any others, it would mean that someone is lying. Despite his previous reticence, I think it's important that @All Might answer this, at least by the end of the day. It would also help determine who among those targeting Flora is scum.

I figure I should post a rudimentary read list as well:

Town: All Might, Flora, SMS, funnier, ALIT
Scum: Sadia, kokirion
Null, or too weak to place definitively: everyone else

The reason for the reversal between my reads of ALIT and kokirion is based on the information provided by All Might and others: Flora is apparently the lightning rod, and was targeted by ALIT, Kokirion, All Might, and SMS. All Might and SMS are essentially cleared, leaving the Mafia factional kill to have likely been carried out by either ALIT or kokirion: out of these two, ALIT has lightly softclaimed twice and has shown interest in this turn of events, including asking for more information; by contrast, kokirion has largely ignored all of the softclaims and roleclaim in the past few pages, perhaps because he sees it as a threat to him.

This isn't that solid of a read yet, as it's possible there are other who targeted Flora that haven't been listed, which is why I think it's important that All Might answered the question asked of him, even if only subtly so as to avoid roleclaiming.

Also, given my newfound town reads on ALIT and Flora:

Unvote

Vote: Sadia

If Sadia flips town, then it'd be more likely that ALIT is scum, and if ALIT is town, it'd be more likely that Sadia is scum. If koki flips town, then it'd be likely that ALIT is scum, and if ALIT is town, it'd be more likely that koki is scum. Killing any of these players, therefore, would result in important information.

I wanted to hold off with saying this, but it's also another reason why I suspect Kirino as he seems pretty cozy with koki right now.

Do you think I would associate with him so openly if I were scum? I can't help but find your reasoning overly simplistic. I understand that my current reads seem like an attempt to distance myself, but knowing how suspicious that would look right after being suspected for my connection to him, why would I do that either?