Super Smash Mafia 2: Originals vs Clones - Game Thread

[Eduarda]

And I'll try and be more active, but literally telling people kind of becomes annoying. You can't force people to play at a certain pace. If this was Mafia a few years ago then maybe, but inactivity is pretty common now so making things move incredibly fast promotes more inactivity because people just feel left behind.

Apologies. I won't try to promote discussion anymore and I won't encourage inactives to talk so that town can have more posts to decide their alignment. I'll let them just be big question marks for the rest of the game. I won't try to annoy anyone either because that would make them focus on me and want to lynch me and that would put me in danger and I obviously want to survive to the endgame.

 

[Justac00lguy]

But I'm not dancing around it. I'm specifically pointing you out, I'm not avoiding the question at all.

You weren't even going to say anything. My post was just one post aimed at Eduarda being 3rd party and my lack of trust. I have plenty to say, I'm catching up on the game. I don't avoid discussions because 'I don't have a lot to say'. It just annoys me when people try to insinuate that others are standing back when they themselves are standing back. Because let's face it, you're standing back.

Like I just said, I would have outright said I had nothing to offer up, while you completely ignored the question entirely. I guess you're going to specifically target me now for noticing something like that.

Ignored the question? Have you read the thread? She asked me to post more. And no I'm not going to target you specifically, but when people are shying out of discussions and accuse others of doing the same, you're damn straight I'm going to point it out and now I'm suspicious of you.

 

[ectoBiologist]

Ah. I'll admit I didn't look there. I only looked at the rules of the first post in this thread.

@Toxic_Snowman my bad dude. Either way, I'm still suspicious of the whole you just saying you would vote for him. With Doc attacking, the chances of Sooshi dying would have been pretty high, right? Again sorry about the rule thing.

It's alright. And well, like you said, we didn't know the defense of Sooshi yet, so if he didn't die from the attack by Doc (whether his damage passed his defense or not, I was likely going to attack to increase the damage of Sooshi, and hopefully then he would die. If not for the mistake and the confusion on the attack parameters, I would have likely followed that plan.

 

[Justac00lguy]

Apologies. I won't try to promote discussion anymore and I won't encourage inactives to talk so that town can have more posts to decide their alignment. I'll let them just be big question marks for the rest of the game. I won't try to annoy anyone either because that would make them focus on me and want to lynch me and that would put me in danger and I obviously want to survive to the endgame.

I appreciate you trying to promote activity, but sometimes you come off as you're literally forcing people to play at a certain pace and not everyone can keep up. Most of the time in fact it has the opposite effect and people fall even further behind. That's not exactly what I'm concerned with though, I just don't want a 3rd Party attacking people because they're inactive. Surely you can see why I'm slightly paranoid about this considering I've been in an almost identical situation to you before. I'm happy to work with you, I would just rather you be less trigger happy.

 

[Justac00lguy]

On the topic of being attacks, I'm not actually sure how you guys played the last game. What exactly happened? Where there a lot of attacks? I might actually look through the game to see how people acted and see which tactic (aggressive/passive) was more successful I'm regards to attacks.

 

[Johnny Sooshi]

I also recieved an item, if that helps any.

Wow! This is super insightful and is gonna help us nail the the scum team for sure!

I'm sorry for coming off as passive aggressive, but what's the point of making this statement and not actually contributing to the discussion?

I didn't know how high your defense was, and, so far, Eduarda has had relatively small damage. I figured it was going to take at least two people get you damaged enough. At least with the assumption that your defense was closer to 100%. As to why I jumped on so early, I trusted Eduarda and her reasoning. You attacking her was the only scenario I saw that made sense.

And like I said before, there's still no justification. You both jumped on and hammered away. I'm forced to accept Eduarda's claim because Jamie basically confirmed it. On the flip side you haven't done much to address why you'd trust her or establish reasoning on your own for why i was a good choice. Yeah, I get it, it sucks what happened cause it out you in a bad spot, but you gotta justify it.

holy ****ing scum post friendo. I was suspicious of your earlier post, but this is scummy af. Maybe if you left out that last bit, but even still, this is suspicious. That last sentence just makes that suspicion skyrocket.

eh, I'm not sure I buy it. I've always found it scummy to say "I know I'm suspicious, so I get why y'all are questioning me, it's ok to be suspicious because it's valid ". Once again, something I've done several times in the past as scum, and I've seen many others do it too. It's one thing to say that you understand the suspicion, but when that's the basis for your entire defense is when it really becomes sketchy.

It can be an okay defense, provided follow up info is shared as to why others are more suspicious, but considering the previous statement, it definitely makes Toxic look too hesitant about his position.

I don't know if this post has any use, but here ya'll go.

---

Right now I'm going to look into Frozen and ALIT's interaction. Though ALIT is scum, I think that their interactions are note worthy and possibly indicative of Frozen's alignment. But most of this is just speculation. Just something to keep in mind as a possibility. So I don't think this in itself should be reasons for attacking Frozen just yet.

Spoiler

Here is ALIT's first post mentioning something substantial on Frozen. I'm going to put the times he mentioned Johnny too, because how closely related ALIT made them. At this point of time, obviously, there's no pressure whatsoever on ALIT.

From this post we can say that Johnny isn't sitting too well with ALIT. That's all good and dandy. Frozen he feels good about but he's keeping a bit of a watch on him. It's important to note that ALIT doesn't put much genuine suspicion on Frozen. He mostly fills that part in with "but I'm always suspicious of him so it could just be nothing". A safe move if both of them are scum. If Frozen flips, he can point out he was suspicious of him. But while Frozen's under attack ALIT can point out that the suspicion isn't much.


Here, ALIT expresses that he feels best about Frozen. I believe it can be safely assumed that this is out of the whole town. Now obviously an experienced Mafia player wouldn't want to say they think their scum bud is most town-like. You can take this statement both ways. The way ALIT shifts any possible focus slightly off of Frozen to counter his statement before. But also him even mentioning Frozen with such a positive light indicating Frozen may not be associated with him.

I included the first part of the quote because here, again, ALIT brings up that his past games may have caused him to have a more biased view on a few people. I feel like by him saying this, he's implying for people to take all of his suspicions with a grain of salt. It also gives him a good cushion to fall back to if someone agrees with his suspicions on a scum bud.

---

Now, after this part, ALIT slips up and is under suspicion. It's important to note his stance changes on players at this point.


I haven't player TF2 so sorry if I misinterpreted this post but from what I gathered, you're saying that though you noticed the slip up, it's possible that ALIT could simply have been VT and made this slip up?

Either way this whole post is really just one big blob of speculation, but if my interpretation of your post is right, you seem to be providing a pretty logical excuse as to why ALIT might have slipped. Fair enough. Others did that too. But something to keep in mind.


Now this is the big giant thing. Frozen was the first to vote for ALIT. When I first saw this I was surprised. There were still over 2 days to go for the end of the day. But I thought maybe his opinion on waiting was different.

So is he town going for a good lynch or scum washing his hands off? I didn't confirm him as townie just because he was the first to vote ALIT. I've seen in many cases in the scum QT, when a scum gets caught in their net, they encourage their fellow members to go for them. In Avengers, when Frozen was caught in a net, Viral, Frozen's scumbud, voted for him immediately without a second thought. Of course, Frozen could have taken a page off of Viral's book.

It's also note worthy that at the time of his vote, both I and Sadia expressed willingness to vote for ALIT. So it was pretty obvious that at one point there was going to be a bandwagon on ALIT. And since people again and again say the person at the beginning of a scum wagon is most likely to be town and the person at the end of a scum wagon is most likely to be Mafia, it would be a great opportunity for scum to jump first on a wagon that they can smell happening from miles away.

Also noteworthy that Frozen had not been convinced of ALIT's guilt before this, and in fact offered a reason as to why he might be innocent. And it didn't work.


I don't have anything to comment on this. But it's another interaction so you guys can make your own conclusions from it.



FroCho had changed his stance much before ALIT expressed his opinion that he thinks FroCho is likely to be town. So it isn't something new that was brought up. And there had literally been only two pages of day 2. So how can ALIT conclude Frozen is playing follower this game day? This new opinion which only appeared after ALIT was pressured seems to be directly opposite from ALIT's opinion from before he was pressured. He seems to be singling out FroCho.

Now this interaction right here has me confused. For one, he's still saying "oh but my suspicions could be invalid so nevermind but this shows im totally not associated with him" but at the same time, I can see a Mafia doing this to a town, too. FroCho was the first to vote ALIT so obviously ALIT would focus on FroCho more under this new pressure.

But the sudden switch really doesn't sit well with me. This post has such a huge WIFOM associated with it, it's kinda useless to try to unravel. But we can't ignore that ALIT may be trying to put distance from him and Frozen, the same as Frozen did with his vote against ALIT. Is Frozen the Godfather?


Not a good reason in my opinion. There was so much more time to wait for. But I can see his reasoning so I won't push him for this. Just another thing to note in case if Frozen's scum. Attacking ALIT first would be great for him.


This again seems like a good defense. I think Frozen defended himself well here. But again we can't ignore it's really weird he attacked ALIT so quickly. I tried to go back to see if Frozen gave his opinion on a quick KO earlier or not, but he didn't say anything along those lines so there's nothing to compare his actions with.


This is a good post. To me, it's working in Frozen's favour. If he's scum, pointing out that his scum bud's death would confirm me may not be too helpful to Mafia. He could have also shown suspicion towards me but he chose not to. I guess it's also worthy to note that he had a bit of heat on him himself at this point with two people questioning his attack. So as Mafia, he would probably have tried to do whatever seemed the most town. Gummy and him were the only ones arguing to not knock me out. Going against the flow might not have been seen as very town. But I know he's a good player as scum so I'm still taking this with a grain of salt.



This is another good post which works in Frozen's favour. He sticks to his initial reasoning. Town trying to convince everyone to vote for ALIT, or scum trying to defend his position more to get people off his case? Unsure.

---

Now here, ALIT is about to die. He starts giving that last big push to try to survive. This huge thing is just a mess but I'll throw the posts together and see if there's anything at all to conclude from them.





I didn't want to get into this territory. But we already pretty much know one person's alignment out of the three ALIT brought up (Johnny). He brought up Frozen, Johnny, and Bryant. I want to say that within these 3 people, one of them is scum and 2 are town. Cushioning one scum within two town would be a good idea. It might clear off that scum since they have been thrown in a group with 2 town. And out of the three, I think Johnny and Byrant were brought under the most fire. It would be good to bring up town members who are most likely to get lynched earlier than the scum so others can look back at this group and assume everyone here is town.

Again this is just a huge speculation. There's way too many variables in this whole post. It's just something I've been meaning to look into since ALIT's death. But I've put some thoughts together and hopefully you guys can make your own minds about it. I'm going to look into someone else now. But a bit later.

I quoted this but after scrolling through I realized I'd need to devote a single response to all the info in here. Tagging it for myself so I can be held accountable.

 

[Eduarda]

I appreciate you trying to promote activity, but sometimes you come off as you're literally forcing people to play at a certain pace and not everyone can keep up. Most of the time in fact it has the opposite effect and people fall even further behind. That's not exactly what I'm concerned with though, I just don't want a 3rd Party attacking people because they're inactive. Surely you can see why I'm slightly paranoid about this considering I've been in an almost identical situation to you before. I'm happy to work with you, I would just rather you be less trigger happy.

Hmm.

Sorry for being so rude. I was ignoring you on purpose to see if you'll try to start a lynch on me. That's the safest route for the Mafia to go. If they NK me, they will end up revealing another one of their own. I'll answer your points properly, now.

I do see your point about people falling behind. But for someone who's trying to actively bring the game forward, it's pretty annoying to see people posting "I'll post later. Still at page 4." I understand if someone fell behind for a few days. Hero of Legend was far behind in the game and kept saying he'll catch up later. I called him out on it and now he's on top of everything. Considering this is his second game, I'm very happy with his activity now. He's actively trying to help out in the discussion and has contributed more than some other inexperienced players. But for people who've been behind for almost the whole game so far? If I don't prod them, they won't bother to catch up. Heroine of Time forgot she was even in the game before people started tagging her.

Eh, why call out all these people only to attack one? I get you want to help, but randomly attacking people who are inactive isn't going to help anything. Chances are, you're going to hit Town more than scum and you're just going to end up making people unnecessarily vulnerable.

I thought my real intention was obvious. I agreed with the suspicion on Toxic. And out or Sadia and Toxic, I'd be more likely to attack Toxic. Sadia is already at a high 60s damage while Toxic was at 11% when the day started. Both of them would obviously not be Mafia kills. They are high suspects. So weakening them a bit doesn't seem like a big deal. Vig kill? I wouldn't mind. I wanted to get him talking. And when I attacked him, he finished up his post soon after and has been more active so far. All which is good. And I feel like his latest posts help his case a lot. His defense point makes a lot of sense. If doctor would like, they can heal Toxic and undo any damage on him. Not to mention my damage parameters seem tiny compared to everyone else's. Even my highest damage seems low.

So why did I state it that way? To see if anyone would comment on it. Or to see if it would cause a more aggressive response from Toxic.

Plus I'm not trusting your statement that "you don't want to win". I can fully relate to your situation and I was in a much more vulnerable position than you were and I still had a plan to win. If you keep attacking people because of inactivity then honestly I would rather kill you. I think your plan is to be super aggressive and force people to follow you while damaging both Town and Scum as the days go on. If I was in your situation then I would do the same.

I do admit that I attacked too fast. I stated myself yesterday that I won't attack until 24 hours are left of the day. But it seemed that our course was set for Toxic and then Sadia. And with that information, we can deduct others further. I have no intention of attacking someone just because they are inactive. It's a bit hard to find slips when pressure voting isn't a possibility. I'm trying to do whatever I can to add any sort of pressure or get any sort of response. Being someone with such a low attack, I think I can be allowed to pressure attack others. I may as well state my parameters. 3-13%. Not a lot. But I won't attack someone just because of inactivity if they have nothing else on them.

 

[Mellow Ezlo]

@Eduarda I think I know who your character is based on your ability and your low damage parameters. Not relevant at all, I just wanted to say that

Also, I just want to make clear that while you have my trust and you're being very helpful, since your ultimate goal is to survive with the winning team, I can see you turning the tables and helping the mafia when/if it looks like they have a high chance of winning. So while it's good for us to keep you alive now, I hope you understand that the time may come when it's in the town's best interest to kill you. Makes sense, right? For now though, I'm willing to believe that you are sincere. Just wanted to throw that out there, that you are ultimately anti-town when it comes down to it and we will kill you if we have to. Keeping third party alive, no matter how helpful and trustworthy they may be, is never without risk.

@Toxic_Snowman I'll respond to your posts in a bit, I'm walking home rn.

 

[Eduarda]

@Eduarda I think I know who your character is based on your ability and your low damage parameters. Not relevant at all, I just wanted to say that

I've never played Smash so I have no clue how much my character relates to my role and parameters

Also, I just want to make clear that while you have my trust and you're being very helpful, since your ultimate goal is to survive with the winning team, I can see you turning the tables and helping the mafia when/if it looks like they have a high chance of winning. So while it's good for us to keep you alive now, I hope you understand that the time may come when it's in the town's best interest to kill you. Makes sense, right? For now though, I'm willing to believe that you are sincere. Just wanted to throw that out there, that you are ultimately anti-town when it comes down to it and we will kill you if we have to. Keeping third party alive, no matter how helpful and trustworthy they may be, is never without risk.

But if you're so scared I'll turn my back on the town why don't you lynch me right now? Why risk the chance of me using my town leader role to help the Mafia near end game?

 

[Mellow Ezlo]

I've never played Smash so I have no clue how much my character relates to my role and parameters


But if you're so scared I'll turn my back on the town why don't you lynch me right now? Why risk the chance of me using my town leader role to help the Mafia near end game?

Because you're being really helpful, and I said that you seem sincere for now. I was just pointing out that keeping third party alive is risky, and that we would kill you if the need arises. The need hasn't arose yet, so there's no point killing you. And as long as you're helping, I'd rather keep you alive.

 

[Eduarda]

Because you're being really helpful, and I said that you seem sincere for now. I was just pointing out that keeping third party alive is risky, and that we would kill you if the need arises. The need hasn't arose yet, so there's no point killing you. And as long as you're helping, I'd rather keep you alive.

And if I take advantage of that trust during lylo? Or what if I go inactive for a while or not post as much?

 

[Justac00lguy]

Hmm.

orry for being so rude. I was ignoring you on purpose to see if you'll try to start a lynch on me. That's the safest route for the Mafia to go. If they NK me, they will end up revealing another one of their own. I'll answer your points properly, now.

Nah you weren't being rude so don't worry.

Yeah that's why I think Mafia will most likely be kissing your ass. Right now they will just wait till the trust between us an you goes down and bandwagon. This is what I'm going to look our for and partly why my post was quite attacking towards you because Mafia will take any opportunity.

This does make me wonder though, why is it that you reveled your role so early? You could have used the anonymity to work to you favour if you thought Mafia targeted you in the night.

I do see your point about people falling behind. But for someone who's trying to actively bring the game forward, it's pretty annoying to see people posting "I'll post later. Still at page 4." I understand if someone fell behind for a few days. Hero of Legend was far behind in the game and kept saying he'll catch up later. I called him out on it and now he's on top of everything. Considering this is his second game, I'm very happy with his activity now. He's actively trying to help out in the discussion and has contributed more than some other inexperienced players. But for people who've been behind for almost the whole game so far? If I don't prod them, they won't bother to catch up. Heroine of Time forgot she was even in the game before people started tagging her.

Fair enough, I understand.

I thought my real intention was obvious. I agreed with the suspicion on Toxic. And out or Sadia and Toxic, I'd be more likely to attack Toxic. Sadia is already at a high 60s damage while Toxic was at 11% when the day started. Both of them would obviously not be Mafia kills. They are high suspects. So weakening them a bit doesn't seem like a big deal. Vig kill? I wouldn't mind. I wanted to get him talking.

Sure, but from my perspective you're a 3rd Party who has just attacked a player for being inactive. I'm already quite suspicious of you trying to manipulate Town and win the game, so this was just me wanting to maintain a bit of order.

And when I attacked him, he finished up his post soon after and has been more active so far. All which is good. And I feel like his latest posts help his case a lot. His defense point makes a lot of sense. If doctor would like, they can heal Toxic and undo any damage on him. Not to mention my damage parameters seem tiny compared to everyone else's. Even my highest damage seems low.

A question, can't we find another way to pressure people instead of attacking? Like I can see if they're activity is literally hurting Town. But I've always thought, even though I hate having inactive Townies (mainly because it's hard to determine if they're scum or not), that there's strength in numbers and that can be a big difference late game. And I've seen a lot of early inactive (even new players) have a big impact late game whether it's a role or, again, strength in numbers. My only problem is that if we treat every FoS or pressure vote as an attack then late game we're all going to be incredibly vulnerable.

I do admit that I attacked too fast. I stated myself yesterday that I won't attack until 24 hours are left of the day. But it seemed that our course was set for Toxic and then Sadia. And with that information, we can deduct others further. I have no intention of attacking someone just because they are inactive.

I actually don't think you do want to kill someone. My point is about slowly weakening a wide variety of players leaving everybody vulnerable.

It's a bit hard to find slips when pressure voting isn't a possibility. I'm trying to do whatever I can to add any sort of pressure or get any sort of response. Being someone with such a low attack, I think I can be allowed to pressure attack others. I may as well state my parameters. 3-13%. Not a lot. But I won't attack someone just because of inactivity if they have nothing else on them.

I can see that line of thinking due to the fact that an attack creates a big amount of paranoia because it's actually permanent (unless Doctor heals). Though saying that, don't you think a Town response might be more aggressive than a Mafia response? Mafia will most likely try to act cool because while Town don't have that guilty conscious mindset.

 

[Eduarda]

Yeah that's why I think Mafia will most likely be kissing your ass. Right now they will just wait till the trust between us an you goes down and bandwagon. This is what I'm going to look our for and partly why my post was quite attacking towards you because Mafia will take any opportunity.

This is a great observation. Your actions against me were very smart, then.

This does make me wonder though, why is it that you reveled your role so early? You could have used the anonymity to work to you favour if you thought Mafia targeted you in the night.

Because I have 75% damage on me right now. One more hit and I'm dead. There was two routes I could have taken. Claim or not claim. Claiming would give the town a Mafia member (I thought I had caught the person who attacked me at that point) and would also have given the town a reason to not target me to prevent further damage, something I was paranoid of as soon as I got my role PM. I was planning to claim as soon as I got an attempted NK on me because of how dangerous my role was to the town, added on with my playstyle. Not claiming would let me throw flimsy excuses to vote for Johnny which people may or may not believe and I'll be dead the next day and they won't have my parameters to follow my logic.

If you meant by revealing I'm 3rd party, I wanted to clear up the SK thing. I had information that town didn't. And either way, with the way my role works it was pretty obvious I'd likely be 3rd party. Hiding this information only for it to be figured out later wouldn't be helping anyone.

Sure, but from my perspective you're a 3rd Party who has just attacked a player for being inactive. I'm already quite suspicious of you trying to manipulate Town and win the game, so this was just me wanting to maintain a bit of order.

But I didn't attack him because he was inactive? I understand why you would think that. I myself made it seem that way. But that wasn't my actual intention.

A question, can't we find another way to pressure people instead of attacking? Like I can see if they're activity is literally hurting Town. But I've always thought, even though I hate having inactive Townies (mainly because it's hard to determine if they're scum or not), that there's strength in numbers and that can be a big difference late game. And I've seen a lot of early inactive (even new players) have a big impact late game whether it's a role or, again, strength in numbers. My only problem is that if we treat every FoS or pressure vote as an attack then late game we're all going to be incredibly vulnerable.

We've had this discussion during Day 1. We agreed that weakening everyone is a bad idea, but we should chose a target and only attack them. Today's target seems to be Toxic. A few people already started attacking him. Toxic was online for hours but didn't respond to anything anyone brought up. I thought me attacking would give him that push to respond. I would have disagreed with anyone attacking after me. But I feel even we change our mind on the person we're attacking, and ask the doctor to heal them, we'll still get valuable information. Right now we have a lot of potential leads. But without them responding to anything, we're on a standstill. No one is willing to damage everyone too much so we aren't spreading it out over all of those people.

If you have another suggestion on how to add pressure, I'd like to hear it.

I actually don't think you do want to kill someone. My point is about slowly weakening a wide variety of players leaving everybody vulnerable.

Look at above. There seemed to be a consensus that Toxic would be a good person to go after. So I assumed he became our next group target.

I can see that line of thinking due to the fact that an attack creates a big amount of paranoia because it's actually permanent (unless Doctor heals). Though saying that, don't you think a Town response might be more aggressive than a Mafia response? Mafia will most likely try to act cool because while Town don't have that guilty conscious mindset.

This is really the big thing about every game, even in normal ones How to react to someone's pressure response. You need to look at it in a case to case basis. I would generally expect a newer player to be more aggressive when pressured as Mafia. But if you look at what happened with ALIT, his play completely changed when he was close to death. So I didn't have a set answer to look for. In this case, I don't think that Toxic's calm response says much. I do admit it makes me feel better about him. But his clarification is what mostly makes me think backing off would be good.

 

[Eduarda]

Now Tristan. Yeah, you didn't got after Heroine but your actions during Day 2 seems really odd. Now this can easily slip into town behaviour as well as Mafia behaviour. But if we look at it as both you and ALIT being Mafia, if your scum bud gets caught in the net the smartest move would be to go after them early. Clear your own name. But if someone else becomes the target, the smartest move would be to focus on that new target instead. But kinda hint that you aren't letting your scum bud go. To not look flippy floppy. You did all of that.

This is valid. And there's not much I can really say about that because I have in fact done that very thing as mafia before. All I can say is that, in this case, it was town behaviour.
[...]

I already said that if you guys want to question me, and make me the target of Day 3, I'd be okay for it. Whatever it takes to prove my innocence. I know I was avid about my distaste for an ALiT lynch, and I realize now that it was a mistake. If you guys feel like that's suspicious, alright, but I'm not sure how me being sort of nonchalant about the reveal is suspicious, too. I mean, it's shocking, but we have to worry about this upcoming Night and Day 3. I didn't want to dwell on it for so long. Just because I didn't post much about it, it doesn't mean I didn't recognize my mistake.

eh, I'm not sure I buy it. I've always found it scummy to say "I know I'm suspicious, so I get why y'all are questioning me, it's ok to be suspicious because it's valid ". Once again, something I've done several times in the past as scum, and I've seen many others do it too. It's one thing to say that you understand the suspicion, but when that's the basis for your entire defense is when it really becomes sketchy.

Isn't this exactly what you just did though, Tristan?

 

[Mellow Ezlo]

1. I was mostly saying that just to gain some information before making a hasty decision. I had full intentions to attack unless I disagreed with the reasoning. I wasn't really trying to protect him.

tbh, there's not much other than this that you could really say in response to that post, regardless of alignment, so I can't say much on this. That's not the post that really made me suspicious of you though, it was mostly a "hmm this is strange, I'll keep an eye on him".

2. I'm not sure in what way this statement is scummy, I was just agreeing my Eduarda and jumping onto the bandwagon. In my big post I had saved up that was deleted for some reason, I mentioned that I asked the question to get some idea of why we were attacking, used the answer to go back and analyze things he said and did that were contradictory and scummy, and then came back with the intent to attack. It wasn't on a whim. Also, you stated how the last part was incredibly scummy, when I tried to place that in there to not seem as scummy. To you it may look like a Mafia member who was trying to act worried, but in reality I was just voicing how I hoped he was really Mafia and not Town. I can kinda see why you perceived it as a scummy thing to do, but it was genuine.

Well, it was the wording of the post that really stood out to me, but I forgot to mention how strange it was that you attacked Alit immediately after saying you weren't suspicious of him. You only attacked him because someone else did, so you just blindly trusted someone into attacking? You also attacked quite late on his bandwagon, being the last attack needed before someone (me) could come in and KO him. He was as good as dead by that point, so you might as well attack him, right? I know it seems hypocritical for me to say this, seeing as my attack was ultimately the one that KO'd him (or at least put him over his parameter), but I at least presented suspicion on Alit beforehand. You had not. So it's shady.

Also, you see why the statement you meant at the end is shady, right? Town wouldn't need to say something like that. It's implied every time you help lynch someone that you'll regret it if they're town, that's part of the game, and so saying you don't want to regret it is redundant. No reason for anyone other than mafia to say something like that.

3. This statement wasn't meant to be a nonchalant response to being wrong. I understood I was wrong about ALiT initially, and I posted that on a whim to sum up my thoughts. Like I stated before, I had a big post saved up, lost it all. A lot of this was to be responded to in that, but I don't have it anymore, so this will have to do. Essentially, I get it can seen as scummy if viewed in a certain way, but why attack me without me answering your questions first? I would have seen it as a more logical and patient approach.

Except this post was made long before the one where you said you lost a bunch of stuff. In fact you made this post during Day 1, while your other aforementioned post was made during Day 2. I understand it can be hard to find the right words to talk about the death, but these were the wrong ones. It read like you weren't surprised at all, or weren't overly excited about it.

I attacked you because of everything you said, and for pressure. Since we can't vote, and FoS's don't really apply adequate pressure, attacking would get you talking. Which it did. And you're still suspicious. Besides, my attack parameters aren't overly high, mid at best, so it wouldn't be a huge deal for me to attack you.

4. I was mostly trying to say that if suspicions are arose about me, I'm okay with being questioned, I just didn't expect it to be so sudden, and for everyone to view my posts as scummy. Sorry.

People say things like that as any alignment tbh, so it doesn't make you town, nor does it make you scum. I was just pointing out that people often say that as scum, and seeing as I was suspicious of you anyway, I think it was fair to assume it was a scum post.

5. Well, she was trying to aid the Town, her story matched up, so I thought she was more concerned with the Town's safety than her own. Or maybe she was a third-party role who was Town-aligned. I wasn't sure, I just thought that if she would stick her neck out to help the Town, she should be trusted. Also, on attacking Johnny, I didn't want to waste my attack, so I waited until the attack tally came so I could see if he died or not, and if he didn't, then I could attack. I didn't want to use my attack if I didn't have to. I was also a bit confused on how the attacking works, as evident from my response to Frozen Chosen. I think I was off on how it worked :/

But was it right to say she was 100% Town-friendly? I remember last time you used the phrasing of "100%", you were scum. Could it not be the same case here? Also, your lack of an attack on Johnny isn't inherently scummy, but the way you worded it is. Maybe if you had said from the beginning that you simply didn't want to waste an attack if it didn't kill Johnny, rather than simply saying that you'd attack if he didn't die. It sounded like you were trying to avoid having to attack while still presenting suspicion, which reads as trying to gain town cred.

It's alright. And well, like you said, we didn't know the defense of Sooshi yet, so if he didn't die from the attack by Doc (whether his damage passed his defense or not, I was likely going to attack to increase the damage of Sooshi, and hopefully then he would die. If not for the mistake and the confusion on the attack parameters, I would have likely followed that plan.

I have to ask, would you have voted for Johnny if voting was in this game? Or would you have waited to see how he reacted to the votes already on him? Also, why were you so clearly willing to attack Johnny when there were other possibilities for why he targeted Eduarda that don't automatically make him scum? Doc did the same, which I noted.

Wow! This is super insightful and is gonna help us nail the the scum team for sure!

legit lol'd

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And if I take advantage of that trust during lylo? Or what if I go inactive for a while or not post as much?

That's why I said it's risky. But it's a risk I'm willing to take. I'm sure you understand why it's risky, yes?

Also, you're making it sound as though you're planning to betray the town. Not saying you are, but I do think the town should remain skeptical.