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Skyward Sword Skyward Sword is the Best Zelda Game of All Time: Agree or Disagree

JuicieJ

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It appears you quoted that statement completely out of context without paying heed to the fact that I addressed several of these points in my last post. Additionally, as I noted before, the circumstances surrounding the Zelda franchise and the state of the Wii meant any of Skyward Sword's flaws, even if seemingly trivial, would be nitpicked beyond the point of exhaustion.

That literally has nothing to do with anything. You explicitly said that it "failed to improve upon the shortcomings of its predecessors," when that's factually incorrect. Don't try to dodge the point.

The trailers may have been problems in themselves since they revealed large portions of the game, including important story elements. A better analogy would have been that Aonuma learned from the hype heand crew generated from Skyward Sword, so he showed comparatively way less footage for A Link Between Worlds.

A lot of footage was shown, yes -- probably too much -- but that even further proves my point about the press and fans hyping the game up beyond belief. They looked into things way too much, so much that they treated the theories they created as if they were confirmed fact.

2011 was a big year for sequels, trequels, and other continuations of franchises, and among many gamers and gaming sites, the general consensus was the Skyward Sword was a great game, but not on par with the likes of Skyrim, Arkham City, or Portal 2. At the end of the day, it was Skyrim that hailed as the Adventure game of the year and a template for future projects in the genre. Many Zelda fans and even Aonuma himself have drawn more comparisons towards Skyrim during the Zelda Wii U conception phase than Skyward Sword.

Oblivion was also heralded as a masterpiece during its day, and now many people look back on it and realize just how flawed of a game it was. The same has already begun to happen with Skyrim. Skyrim also got outvoted by Skyward Sword in pretty much every major poll, such as IGN's Player's Choice, Screw Attack's Top 10 Games of 2011, and even G4's Death Match, so the general consensus among the core gaming audience was actually that Skyrim was a game of lesser quality. Gaming sites tended to herald the latter as a flawless masterpiece, but is that really surprising when they did the same thing for the mess that was Oblivion?

You must not be aware that Aonuma clarified he never said he was using Skyrim as a template for anything. He merely said that he enjoyed playing the game and picked it up out of curiosity because of the similar name to Skyward Sword.
 

Jamie

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I realize I haven't actually responded to the OP yet. My apologies.

I completely disagree with the proposition. Skyward Sword in my eyes is quite possibly the worst 3D Zelda in the entire franchise. The WiiM+ was interesting but it felt really forced as you needed to use it to do everything, including doing stuff like crossing ropes which just became tedious.

The enemies all felt the same, and because of the WM+ felt really awkward. Some of the ways they held their swords/shields just looked kind of silly. The bosses were interesting, but really easy. Ditto for the dungeon designs.

Overall, I did not like Skyward Sword. Nintendo should attempt to go back a little closer to its roots. Look how well OoT sold. Look how well TP sold (which is regarded as an OoT "clone" by many). Zelda games should be more like those 2 IMO.
 
JuicieJ said:
That literally has nothing to do with anything. You explicitly said that it "failed to improve upon the shortcomings of its predecessors," when that's factually incorrect. Don't try to dodge the point.

In my first post of the thread, I pointed out the limited scope of the overworld as an area of regression. The structure of the overworld also hindered exploration. It's easier to figure out puzzles or find secrets when the overworld features a similar schematic as dungeons requiring travel from "Point A" to "Point B" to solve "X" obstacle. Skyward Sword offered a less streamlined story, was more ambitious in its controls, and offered more weapon variety, but there is no denying it furthered itself from some of the series' fundamental tenements. Aonuma himself has admitted the linearity was a flaw, something that was corrected in A Link Between Worlds and has become a major point of contention in Zelda Wii U.

JuicieJ said:
You must not be aware that Aonuma clarified he never said he was using Skyrim as a template for anything. He merely said that he enjoyed playing the game and picked it up out of curiosity because of the similar name to Skyward Sword.

I stand corrected there, but what Aonuma claims may be different than what is put into the final game, and by all degrees, the vague hints we've heard stray away from the more constricted type of world we saw in Skyward Sword.
 

JuicieJ

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In my first post of the thread, I pointed out the limited scope of the overworld as an area of regression. The structure of the overworld also hindered exploration. It's easier to figure out puzzles or find secrets when the overworld features a similar schematic as dungeons requiring travel from "Point A" to "Point B" to solve "X" obstacle. Skyward Sword offered a less streamlined story, was more ambitious in its controls, and offered more weapon variety, but there is no denying it furthered itself from some of the series' fundamental tenements. Aonuma himself has admitted the linearity was a flaw, something that was corrected in A Link Between Worlds and has become a major point of contention in Zelda Wii U.

1) Skyward Sword's overworld is actually a lot larger than people give it credit for. One glance at the World Map is all that's needed to see that, contrary to popular belief, it's notably larger than that of Twilight Princess. Not sure about The Wind Waker's, but certainly TP's.

2) I never said linearity wasn't a problem, but if you think SS was any more linear than most other modern Zelda titles, specifically TP and PH... then I don't know what to say.

3) The fact remains that you said it didn't improve on past shortcomings. No matter what the context, you said that, and I called you out on it. This is what's most important, so stop dancing around it.
 
JuicieJ said:
3) The fact remains that you said it didn't improve on past shortcomings. No matter what the context, you said that, and I called you out on it. This is what's most important, so stop dancing around it.

I've already explained how so in three separate posts. The examples I've provided already speak for themselves, but I'll offer another that's already been expressed in this thread: Loftwing travel. This was a convenient excuse for Nintendo to partition the overworld into discontinuous areas removing connectors that could have offered more gameplay. In Twilight Princess, the Bridge of Eldin was an important gameplay and story element enriching the experience of travelling from Eldin to Lanayru Province. It was strange for Nintendo to not return to an idea that had already been previously executed successfully, instead opting to copy Phantom Hourglass and Spirit Tracks, games that had been criticized for their approach to the overworld.
 
Serious question, here. Do you understand the concept of making a blanket statement and that statement not being 100% accurate? Because I don't think you do.

As I responded on Skype, "I thought it was clear from the context of my first post what I was saying. But you continue to quote one line without regard to its supporting arguments."

I'm not here for a wording debate because no matter how I explain my position you always return to that so I'll just reiterate a point from my first post that Skyward Sword is not a culmination of the previous games' strengths, but rather a transition title as Aonuma experiments how to reach the same revolutionary standard and awe posed by Ocarina of Time.
 

JuicieJ

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As I responded on Skype, "I thought it was clear from the context of my first post what I was saying. But you continue to quote one line without regard to its supporting arguments."

I'm not here for a wording debate because no matter how I explain my position you always return to that so I'll just reiterate a point from my first post that Skyward Sword is not a culmination of the previous games' strengths, but rather a transition title as Aonuma experiments how to reach the same revolutionary standard and awe posed by Ocarina of Time.

Wording is everything. You failed to build upon what you previously argued by saying something completely different. Had the words "some of" been in your sentence, you wouldn't have failed in this. Like I said, wording is everything, and excluding those two words changing what you said entirely is proof of this.

Also, I think the things I pointed out say otherwise regarding the "culmination of previous games' strengths" thing. It certainly failed to bring back the open-ended exploration of old, but it was without a doubt both a refinement of many existing elements and a breakthrough in modern gaming.
 

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At its core, Skyward Sword offered many innovative and intriguing features as a whole. Chief among them was the new motion control system, which involved swinging the Wiimote like a sword, demonstrating immense promise for revolutionizing the series formula to all new heights. Other features included a real-time menu, weapon upgrades, and dowsing, all of which were exciting in their own ways at first. However, as the game wore on, several of these features--key to the core gameplay--gradually began to feel lackluster and overused. The motion controls lost their initial flare as I took out scores of selfsame enemies in one sitting, and oftentimes I found it hard to concentrate on getting the timing right.

Throughout the game, the main plot itself suffered from a ridiculous amount of rehashed objectives necessary to advance to the next stage, consisting of numerous fetchquests and repeated enemy encounters which served no purpose in moving the story in an effective manner. Despite there being a four to five year development period on a purportedly sensational project, the dev team instead focused on a cinematic experience, taking an edge off of the commonplace adventure of Zelda. Needlessly lengthy cutscenes and long-winded dialogues without the ability to quickly skip weighed any level of enjoyment down like a heavy burden; dying forced you to watch the introduction cutscene in full (thanks, Imprisoned) due to this useless incapacity.

Adding to the list of insufficient presentations--incapacitating to a should-be successful game--are the corridor-like paths that inhibit the boundless freedom of past titles. Although it was Nintendo's goal to make the "overworld" feel like a Dungeon, the concept soon became jaded as I discovered that I was running around in circles in many cases just to figure out what to do. Backtracking had never been a problem in Zelda for me until that point (trying to get the lay of the land without dowsing), leaving me stranded in a suffocating series of hallways and/or otherwise linear routes. On the brighter side of things, solving puzzles to open new areas was cool, but again, since each Province and even Skyloft was built like a Dungeon, the overall design scheme was consistently the same.

All in all, Skyward Sword felt incomplete and lacked impact in many regards, thereby disqualifying it as the "best Zelda game of all time". Majora's Mask pulled off the intriguing sequence of events and item-wielding aspects, whereas Twilight Princess achieved limitless liberation of exploration and uncovering secrets, and together these two form my strongest ideals of how a Zelda game ought to be made. I'd also argue that Skyward Sword isn't the greatest game on the Wii, and nor is it the weakest; the most fulfilling adventure game would either be Okami (example of effective Wiimote usage) or Xenoblade (an engaging, open-field escapade), depending on your tastes.
 
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Favourite ever is a very subjective term. And for everyone person that agrees you'll have others that disagree.
Like all Zelda games it does some things right and some wrong. it's a nice game but not my favourite of the series.
 

Justac00lguy

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Wording is everything. You failed to build upon what you previously argued by saying something completely different. Had the words "some of" been in your sentence, you wouldn't have failed in this. Like I said, wording is everything, and excluding those two words changing what you said entirely is proof of this.

Also, I think the things I pointed out say otherwise regarding the "culmination of previous games' strengths" thing. It certainly failed to bring back the open-ended exploration of old, but it was without a doubt both a refinement of many existing elements and a breakthrough in modern gaming.
How so was it a "breakthrough" in modern gaming?
 

Spiritual Mask Salesman

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Wording is everything. You failed to build upon what you previously argued by saying something completely different. Had the words "some of" been in your sentence, you wouldn't have failed in this. Like I said, wording is everything, and excluding those two words changing what you said entirely is proof of this.

Also, I think the things I pointed out say otherwise regarding the "culmination of previous games' strengths" thing. It certainly failed to bring back the open-ended exploration of old, but it was without a doubt both a refinement of many existing elements and a breakthrough in modern gaming.

You are right that it failed to bring back the open-ended exploration of old, honestly I'm not sure if we will ever see that again. Let me ask you all this, even if zelda games were to reach that height again, would it be enough? No, in the end we all will always want more.
 

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