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Do you think Christmas is a commercial holiday now?

Djinn

and Tonic
Joined
Nov 29, 2010
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The Flying Mobile Opression fortress
I do agree things like gift cards just...suck. It epitomizes the sense of "Here, I passed this place on the way home." Absolutely no thought was put into it, which I think is important. It should be about what you can do for someone and what they would love, not simply checkmarking a name that you got them something then onto the next.

But for a lot of people I know, the holidays are the only time they ever see their families after growing up and spreading out to the winds. People that move many states away never can get the time to go see their folks or communicate much. But lots of people still get back together at Christmas which reminds them all of simpler times before they all left to go live their own lives.
 

Jirohnagi

Braava Braava
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@Misty while I do enjoy a healthy dose of cynicism I think Christmas has its positives.

For most people, it's time off work to spend with your family. It's rare for people to have any free time, most people can only make a few full days where they don't have to do anything at all. So, everyone in the family lines up their "do literally nothing" days together. It's not every day someone can fly thousands of kilometers for example; it's expensive. So people choose to do that for Christmas because they know everyone will be doing it. It's nice to have a day like that.

In terms of the commercialism, I think it's a bit of a shame in some senses. People are right in that we do not really express our love through non-commercial gestures as often now. But I will say for Christmas last year, while it did cost money, my brother and I got a very thoughtful gift for my dad and I think it was very special for him.

Objects are what we as humans use to occupy most of our time, it just so happens that objects cost money. I would love to have given my dad that gift which brought back many great memories for free, but it's impossible.

Buying things like Starbucks gift cards to me, while I do it because of the social obligation, really does seem like just that: an obligatory present with very little thought put into it. It's a shame that things have gotten that way in terms of you being required to give people gifts on a certain day. Perhaps it would be better if Christmas didn't have the gift giving so much involved in it and instead you gave gifts when you felt like it. I don't know. But all in all, I like Christmas.

If i were in work i'd literally not get any time off, i'd the 25th and the 1st off and that's it the rest of the time i'd be expected to be in on time and sober and working. All the shops/stores in the City centre are like it. Kinda sucks because it literally shows that Business is now more important than family.
 

Misty

Ronin
Joined
Feb 14, 2016
Location
The Sea
I think Christmas has its positives.

Nor do I disagree with this, but I'll get to the but a bit later.

For most people, it's time off work to spend with your family. It's rare for people to have any free time, most people can only make a few full days where they don't have to do anything at all.
Which is another offshoot of...commercialism? No, but really, that is the reason people don't have time for the people in their lives. Please see vicious cycle:
1. Ya gotta git a job to get paid so ya can buy da stuff.
2. Due to the demands of dat job and the standards set by businesses of today, you don't have any time for family.
3. Because you don't have time fo family, the only time you get off is the preapproved by big business commercial holidays.*
4. Because you don't have time off, da only way to express your love in a semi genuine fashion, is to buy your family ****.
5. Because you buy your family ****, ya need a job, sucka.

*Please note, that getting time off during holidays is as the kids are saying these days, a

Image.ashx


In fact, most of the working, grunt class will not get the holidays off to be with their family. I know until my junior year of college and from the age of 15, I worked every single Christmas, Christmas Eve, and holiday in the books and didn't get to see my family until the time I usually did (night). And I was just a thirty hour part-time working stiff. The full timers were in an even worse boat. And if you're wondering what I did all the time, I was either a cashier or a sales associate selling overpriced gifts to people in the above card.

So, everyone in the family lines up their "do literally nothing" days together. It's not every day someone can fly thousands of kilometers for example; it's expensive. So people choose to do that for Christmas because they know everyone will be doing it. It's nice to have a day like that.

I do not mean this as an insult, but you sound upper-middle class af. I know many people who will not fly home for Christmas because it isn't in the budget and won't be for a very long time. Not everyone is doing the thing you think they are. And the reason they cannot is the above five step system except with the addition of moving away from their support system so that they can get the job.

It's nice to have a day like that.
Yes, it is. And please keep in mind, the reason all my coworkers and boss will get to have these few days this year, is because I'm covering the phones, hospitals, and house. Otherwise, we'd be having our Christmas at work. And I'm working a job you can only get with a university degree and so are they. I'm not in gruntalicious land anymore and I still don't have the holidays off because someone cannot.

But I will say for Christmas last year, while it did cost money, my brother and I got a very thoughtful gift for my dad and I think it was very special for him.

I was being genuine when I said stuff like this is very lovely. It also reeks of the victory of commercialism that objects are how we express thoughtfulness and love.

Objects are what we as humans use to occupy most of our time, it just so happens that objects cost money. I would love to have given my dad that gift which brought back many great memories for free, but it's impossible.

I don't think just money is the key problem, honestly. It's the objects at all. The objects probably made with the blood of Taiwanese children and suicides of Chinese workers. It is an impersonal object being given personality by the givers. It's a conduit for their feelings to be expressed, rather than in and of itself being an expression. I realize it isn't very fun-spirited, but there is something fundamentally awful seeming about that.

Buying things like Starbucks gift cards to me, while I do it because of the social obligation, really does seem like just that: an obligatory present with very little thought put into it.
Yes, and truly with no condescension involved, what does that say about you and society, that there is an obligation to give **** to people you don't like because merry christmas? Because to me, that also tarnishes the heartfelt gifts. If you're giving gifts to everyone, then the only thing that's different is your inner feelings and efforts. Which are great no doubt. But honestly, that implies you're also obligated to give gifts to those you really like. Certainly, you enjoy doing so, but you are obligated.
 

Jirohnagi

Braava Braava
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my biggest peeve currently is how easy it is to check the pricing on something bought, i know the exact cost of all the gifts my family will get me and they know the costs of the presents i got them and arguments will always breakout because i got something more costly than they got.
 

Jamie

Till the roof comes off, till the lights go out...
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@Misty but the problem you're pointing out seems to be capitalism in general and not specifically Christmas. In that regard, I completely agree.
 

Dio

~ It's me, Dio!~
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Yes Christmas is a commercial holiday now. It has been that way a long time before I was even born so I have never known a non commercial Christmas.

Is that bad? Not necessarily. It seems to be bad for some especially those with financial troubles who feel obligated to get their children as many presents as the rich parents and therefore feel stressed out at Christmas time. For others the gift giving and receiving is fun.

I'm one of those that find the gift giving and recieving fun. I don't give gifts to a lot of people, only to ones I like and that way I can spend a bit more if I have to and I don't worry about spending the same on everyone. A cheap and thoughtful gift can be as good as an expensive one.

I don't buy Christmas cards because I think they are a waste of money. I'd sooner make something myself than buy one from a store. For those people I do give to I like to get them something they will actually enjoy and not throw away.

I also love giving joke gifts such as wrapping up a potato and making it really hard for the person to get in only for them to struggle and then find out what was really inside.
 

Misty

Ronin
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Location
The Sea
Probably is in most places, but I don't give a ****, it's bloody awesome! Love Christmas environment.

And you say I'm not interested in your level of intellectualism...how apt your statement was. :P

@Misty but the problem you're pointing out seems to be capitalism in general and not specifically Christmas. In that regard, I completely agree.

It's commercialism. I acknowledge they often end up hand in hand, but the culture of commercialism is what is responsible for this, not capitalism. The idea you have to buy **** to express love is not a capitalistic one, it is a commercial one. Capitalists often use it to their benefit thus making them seem as if no distinction exists, but one can have capitalism without this commercial culture and vice versa.
 

Misty

Ronin
Joined
Feb 14, 2016
Location
The Sea
my biggest peeve currently is how easy it is to check the pricing on something bought, i know the exact cost of all the gifts my family will get me and they know the costs of the presents i got them and arguments will always breakout because i got something more costly than they got.

Yeah, didn't you know. When we live in a commercialist society and love is expressed by money, it becomes a business transaction. And as you know, business transactions are entirely equal. Therefore, it is proper and fitting that love be equal and the expression of that love be entirely equal that way nobody can feel anything about it.
 
Joined
Nov 20, 2016
You can always do as my grandfather and buy at a serious discount, remove the sale tag and keep the original (much higher) tag attached. His wife was very shallow and he got away with it for quite some time.

edit: I appologize that shiro felt this to be off topic but it seemed to be a prime example of commercialization at it's finest:
1) the price of the gift matters more than the gift itself
2) we all have to deal with petty individuals and it takes a lot of creativity to keep family gatherings civil
 
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Jirohnagi

Braava Braava
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Gender
Geosexual
You can always do as my grandfather and buy at a serious discount, remove the sale tag and keep the original (much higher) tag attached. His wife was very shallow and he got away with it for quite some time.

we aren't speaking about ways to get around it. Please read the damn title fermian
 
Joined
Nov 20, 2016
we aren't speaking about ways to get around it. Please read the damn title fermian

There *isn't* a way around it, it's just the way the world works. We all get jelous of the cousin who gets "more" and an equal share is quite hard to do. As I said in a higher post, the well known Charlie Brown Christmas special from the mid 60's discusses this, so it isn't a new phenominon. The only thing that has changed is the very many catalogs were replaced with the internet and I fully admit my ten year old self was deep in the official lego catalog minutes after opening my goodies inan attempt to determine my "worth". It was shallow without a doubt, but we are all equally guilty in wanting to know how others "value" us just we are all equally guilty in wanting to give the "best" gift.
 
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