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@First part of post about geography: Fair enough. True, however LA did much the same with LttP, AoL, and LoZ. Either enemies are evidence, or they aren't. That's the NoA version. NoA pulls stupid stuff like that, especially before Bill Trinen came around. The ONLY part of the NoJ manual that...

Use this map instead: Biased comparison is biased and leaves out obvious things. You're forgetting the lost woods to the north-west, the lake in the exact same spot to the north-east, the Biggoron dude is in the same spot as the egg, stream of water coming from the mountains leading to the...

The geography fits (I hate geography as I don't think it matters, but OoS does have a map that's very similar to Koholint), and fits the backstory of LA. There really isn't much more potential kinds of evidence. A few things that are shared between OoX and LA that LttP/LA doesn't have (I'm...

You mean when I said "but it's more difficult to know whether or not any of that evidence actually means anything, or whether it's just Capcom being wierd."? In my opinion, Capcom was intending to connect OoX to LA, but I have no idea if that's what Nintendo's intent is in the timeline. We know...

That's pretty circular. "was" was be a better word here. There are alternatives now with MORE proof than LttP/LA ever had. Why does it matter which one he resembles? Of course he's going to resemble LttP Ganon, do you expect it to resemble a Ganon that wasn't seen for like 7 years after the...

Not exactly the opposite. The OoT=SW isn't completely disproven, as the same bull**** theory Lex has been spewing out is still possible, except now there is absolutely no reason to believe OoT=SW. Still possible, but now it's clearly just fanfic. By definitively disproving something, I mean...

And it doesn't mean that the interview based on completely different and impossible things is evidence for the order of those two games. I'd just like to mention that very, very rarely is something definitively disproven. The SW is a perfect example of this. There is seriously no real reason to...

Oh, yay, I think this is the debate I've gotten the most warnings and infractions for cursing and such! :P Well OoX is the obvious contender to be a prequel to LA (if LttP isn't the prequel to LA). I'm 100% convinced that Capcom was intending to connect OoX to LA, but I'm unsure if that's what...

Fair enough, that hasn't happened (as a fact). Look at the ingame evidence that went along with that intent. That ingame evidence is gone. Of course it went that way because the developers said so, but why did the developers say so? It definitely went along with in-game evidence. Then that...

Besides the SW, like what? Do I need more than one example that fits the situation perfectly and answers your original question? I really think this example is conclusive enough to answer your original question. It does affect LttP-LoZ, by destroying all of the in-game evidence that supported...

That all of the evidence that the 1998 quote was based on is DESTROYED AND NO MORE. Everything that the 1998 quote was based on is gone due to TWW. If all of the evidence that a quote was based on is destroyed by a later release, that is a clear sign of that quote being outdated and no longer...

They've done that sort of thing in the past. Because there are alternatives now. Once again, I'm NOT saying that the alternatives are true, I'm saying that the 1998 interview is NOT proof of anything due to it being outdated because all of the evidence those quotes were based upon are gone...

I'm not saying it does (maybe I didn't make that clear enough :P). I'm just saying that the 1998 interview is NOT proof for current intent. I don't put LttP and LoZ on seperate timelines, hell if ever I make a timeline I'll probably put LoZ after LttP. I just want to get rid of the idea that a...

@Pinecove: Okay, fair enough, LoZ-LttP is very unlikely. However my point about the 1998 interview no longer being proof for LttP-LoZ still stands. It has nothing to do with the SW directly. However, it was always because of the SW that it couldn't be before LttP in 1991 and 1998 (when those...

I think he's talking about the box. I haven't denied that. I'm saying that the in-game evidence that those things were based upon (IE the in-game reasons for WHY it had to go LttP-LoZ) were destroyed by TWW, which means that alternatives (like LoZ-LttP) were then possible, due to those quotes...

Way to pick apart my post, and quote it without its original context thus changing the meaning of the quote entirely... Where the hell are you getting that? Which release has done ANYTHING to retcon all of the in-game proof for a split timeline to possibly indicate a retcon? That's not the...

We don't have anything that indicates that the alternative (LoZ-LttP) is true because of TWW, BUT think about what supported LttP-LoZ. In 1991 it was because LoZ could not fit as the first game in the timeline, so the only alternative would've been LttP-LoZ (reinforced by the box). In 1998 LoZ...

^LoZ only had to be after LttP because it didn't fit as the first game in the timeline. Then OoT came out, so it could feasibly be before LttP, except LttP had deep ties to OoT and had to be right after it (using in-game evidence). With those ties removed, pretty much all of the intent behind...

It didn't necessarily add evidence to OoT-LoZ-LttP, more like it took evidence away from OoT-LttP-LoZ. TWW absolutely destroyed the connections between OoT and LttP (while OoT=SW was still possible, everything that the confirmations were based upon were completely destroyed). The things that...

^I'd say that the release of TWW would retcon any of the intent behind OoT-LttP-LoZ, atleast to the extent of its 1998 confirmation (if that confirmation turns out to be true (which it looks like it is)) no longer being evidence.

^I'm so glad that the Miyamoto order as we know it may have never, ever even been stated. Now I can live without thinking that Miyamoto was insane lol.

Hmm fair enough. Maybe. Maybe not. The syllable "ri" just doesn't really seem like conclusive evidence to support the Picori being the same as the Kokiri. And didn't the Deku Tree say that he created the Kokiri (I'm not sure on this I could be wrong, I'll have to look it up)?

The only people who call them the picori are uninformed humans. The Minish actually refer to themselves as Minish. Why would an incorrect name be evidence of anything? Oh and in Japan... the lumberjacks from LttP are called Kikori. So, using your logic, the lumberjacks come from the...

You know, you guys could just read Impossible's document anyways... it's still a really good read regardless. Anyways taken directly from his document: You can go check the source if you want, I'm too lazy to find an exact link to the source. So if you want to find it I guess just google it...

I think he's not elaborating because he knows that if he does, he'll derail this whole damn thread with ANOTHER redundant original intent debate that won't accomplish anything... Oh and TWW introduced another debate topic... the friggin SW debates......

Pinecove... you know what I'm talking about. Remember when we had that wierd Skype debate that we never finished and I was arguing about how TMC explained a lot of origins and used the Trinen interview as evidence? I'm sure you remember... If you really need to find it you could read...

^Pinecove, you're on ZD. Forget developer intent when you're at ZD, no one here thinks it means anything (unless, of course, it benifits their own timeline...). Except the box isn't evidence of how much Miyamoto knows about what he's talking about. Way too easily retconned.

'Cept I can solve a Rubik's cube in like a minute, whereas the timeline is still one big ****ing mystery lol Anyways, it's probably because the timeline is the most intriguing part of theorizing to most people. I find it more interesting, anyway, but I never have done much non-timeline...

Why the hell would the box matter as evidence at any time past 1991, when any conflicting evidence would just indicate a retcon? And it's not like the box is actually needed to prove the timeline went LttP-LoZ in 1991, I mean the story was just blatantly impossible with LoZ-LttP (in 1991), anyways.

WOW None of us EVER guessed that LttP took place after OoT, especially with the backstory of LttP blatantly making the alternatives impossible, and the multiple confirmations of it!

It can coexist with TWW just fine, we just have to assume that the intent behind the backstory of LttP is completely different from what it was in 1998 (regardless of your SW opinions).

Christ, I don't come here in months because of how bad this place is, look at the most recent topics and see it's just as bad, if not worse..... well w/e I have spare time for this. Meh "thinking it comes first because it's all peaceful" really isn't evidence of anything. I mean if that was...

@Smertios: Originally, yes. Now since the split has been confirmed canon? Maybe not. EDIT: Damn Locke and I posted in the exact same minute.

LttP and LoZ can be on different timelines. Just sayin'

OoX... hard to place? What problems are there with placing it after LoZ/AoL? Hell LttP screws stuff up more than OoX.

Who was it who said this? Was it NoA's Dan Owsen? He's that guy who created this series and the Mario series. You might have heard of them. Actually the LoZ, AoL, and LttP manuals are probably the worst to rely on for info in the NoA version; because NoA sucks. I disagree with you. Recent...

Eiji never said that OoT went first. FSA has a Ganondorf origin, too; it can take place before OoT. Bill Trinen stated that TMC is the origin of Link's hat. The Japanese version of TMC calls it the end of the first adventure of Link. One of the sword guys teaches you the hurricane spin...

^Impossible of LA (LegendsAlliance) follows that same timeline and sums up his reasoning in his document that you can get from this...

Don't make me get into it, I can go on for hours. It's not confirmed AT ALL. Both OoX/LA and LttP/LA are very, very logical placements that only change due to personal preference.

Are you talking about force gems/force? If-so those are just made from life force, and can appear anywhere. How long you've been playing Zelda doesn't make much of a difference in theorizing... I've been playing OoT since I was 3 :P Oh and welcome Evil Space Fish, btw :P I also recommend you...

You can die standing up. It's called a Cadaveric Spasm. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cadaveric_spasm Well that only happened because they didn't have the time to use Zelda as the vessel. That was a really good post, Zemen. From now on when someone doubts that Ganondorf died in TP, I'm just...

He's stabbed in the stomach and the Triforce fades after Zant does the neck snapping thing. The intention is obvious; he's dead. And how the hell could he be sealed? Ganon doesn't "return" though. A new Ganondorf appears and takes the trident and becomes the Yami no Maou. It always held...

...lol a merge. Who do you think you are, Humulos? So two completely seperate Link's become one? Two Hyrule's become one? Two histories come together? Here's what I think when I think of a merge: "Ahh that was a lot of rain yesterday", "what rain?", "the rain that hit Hyrule castle...", "there...

Daphnes specifically said in the Japanese version of TWW to "erase" the land of Hyrule in his wish. Old Hyrule is GONE. Erased from a wish on the Triforce, there's no resurfacing. No I'd say it's more of a story that got ****ed by every single game released after AoL (LttP screws it over if...

Too bad ST has COMPLETELY ORIGINAL town names. I have trouble believing that they would suddenly just remember the sages and change the names of all of their towns. It was said to have happened long ago. It happened long enough ago that an ENTIRE language died out and NO ONE can read it...

He is both Ganon and Ganondorf in LttP. Japanese LttP: It's pretty clear in LttP that Ganon was supposed to be Ganondorf before he got the Triforce. Thank you FSA for ****ing that up... It was Ganondorf who got the trident, and he then became Ganon upon getting it. Yeah it can cover all of...

Here's an example: I'm playing Marth in SSBB against a Meta Knight. He stuffs my first aerial approach with a Shuttle Loop. I believe that the next time I appraoch him in the air, he will stuff me with Shuttle Loop again, so I air dodge into him, instead. He expects the air dodge, I get...

Something doesn't have to happen more than once for people to pray it happens again. I could give a million examples that prove you wrong, if you so wish.

It contains more references to OoX. List some for LttP, OoX likely has just as many or more of the same kind. 1) There was intent for the timeline *glances at LttP box* 2) And, no, the retcons don't make it fit better. It makes it much more ambiguous, and FSA ****s it up even worse. Not...

Ganondorf stealing the Triforce pre-LttP is impossible unless FSA is not attached to LttP. Just sayin' Ganon is dead after LoZ, OoX, and LttP. It's practically impossible to have a Ganon that makes sense in the timeline unless you go with something like: ----TWW/PH-TMC-FS/FSA-LoZ/AoL(-OoX) OoT...