Team Fortress 2: Mann vs. Machine

[Johnny Sooshi]

I'll take some time today to look at who found me suspicious and put together a list. I can guarantee you, at least one mafia member is already voting for me. This way, since my lynch is imminent, town will have my thoughts still.

 

[Soul]

Yeah, I'm there with you. Johnny is doing the exact same thing that I pointed out earlier with his second reply there:



I can't remember having played with you before (again, last game was late 2014), but you're coming off as more desperate than ever right now, ferociously trying to get attention to anywhere else. Again, I understand having to play offense when you've been forced into defense for an entire day (I've had to do it many times and have felt the same frustration), but your second reply just really rubs me the wrong way after you made some sense before that.

I find it difficult to believe that Frozen Chosen would be scum and wound hinge so much on trying to get a townie lynched this early. I don't see the logic in a mafia member fakeclaiming so early, then sacrificing his life by lying about someone (because if you're town, he's next tomorrow). This is the kind of play you make towards the end of the game when the mafia has the numbers to just throw one their own out there, not on day two with only a single townie dead.

My only other theory is that Frozen is trying to pull what Soul inadvertently caused yesterday - he wants the really tracker/whatever to come out and counter-claim, so at the end of it all, you're either dead or the tracker is out in the open. It seems somewhat likely.



Perhaps Frozen has an ulterior motive for wanting Johnny dead, which would explain his apparent fixation as you said. Again though, it would make sense that Frozen would target Johnny with his night-role given his fixation on day one. It makes sense.

Regardless, I haven't voted because I don't like the situation either way. Although the pieces put together make sense, I can't help be uneasy and let some doubt creep in. Although again, I've never played with Johnny before; I don't know if this is his usual reaction or not.

When does day end?

I believe you were talking about Storm, not me, right? I don't remember making anyone roleclaim.

Anyway, your post gave me another idea. I don't know how likely it is, but could Frozen Chosen potentially be a Lyncher? I've never played with one, but given how little we know about the roles in the game at this stage, it's possible. I don't know about any Team Fortress 2 characters that would fit this role, however. Tracker/Watcher would work as a Spy, but apparently that's not FC's role, according to his own statement.

If it's not that, then I don't have any ideas right now. I think I'd like to know a little more about why you think Johnny might be scum, @Frozen Chosen. In particular, you haven't answered my question of why you think he can't be a vanilla townie. Don't roleclaim please, but quite a few people have questioned your motives, so I think a little more information is in order. What I'd like to know is this: Do you have a suspicion, or are you sure about Johnny's alignment?

For the time being,

Unvote

Unless I messed up the time zones, there's still eight hours left before night starts. I'd like to know a bit more before that.

 

[kokirion]

Frozen. Please eleborare on your evidence.

Also: Vote for extension

 

[Frozen Chosen]

Is everyone else alright with me showing my evidence? Sooshi (rightfully so), Tristan, and Kokirion want to hear but I want it to be a majority decision.

Do you have a suspicion, or are you sure about Johnny's alignment?

Okay, to clarify, I have a suspicion based on him probably not being a Vanilla Townie.

 

[Pen]

I don't know how likely it is, but could Frozen Chosen potentially be a Lyncher?

The same thought crossed my mind a while ago actually, however, the Lyncher role is incredibly rare. Unless I have a very good reason to suspect there is one in the game, I am not going to assume there is one. I am pretty sure I have played in more Mafia games here on ZD than any other member, and I cannot remember ever playing in a game that had a Lyncher in it. Sure I could be wrong, but either way I would say it is extremely rarely seen.

What I'd like to know is this: Do you [Frozen Chosen] have a suspicion, or are you sure about Johnny's alignment?

This is one things that really bugs me about FC right now to be honest. According to the information that he has given there is an enormously high probability for Johnny to be scum. However, despite this FC has still not voted for Johnny himself. I would love to hear from him why he has not voted.

 

[Frozen Chosen]

This is one things that really bugs me about FC right now to be honest. According to the information that he has given there is an enormously high probability for Johnny to be scum. However, despite this FC has still not voted for Johnny himself. I would love to hear from him why he has not voted.

The reason I haven't voted for him yet is because I don't know if he is scum. The possibility is likely, but perhaps he has town role that didn't know about the odd/even situation. It was the only lead I had so I've gone with it. I'm still leaning towards him being scum, but I'm not sure.

 

[kokirion]

The reason I haven't voted for him yet is because I don't know if he is scum. The possibility is likely, but perhaps he has town role that didn't know about the odd/even situation. It was the only lead I had so I've gone with it. I'm still leaning towards him being scum, but I'm not sure.

Right now only 1 vote on Johnny is left. I'm gonna be honest, if you've not going to reveal your evidence I will assume it's non-existent and am willing to vote you last minute to prevent Johnny's lynch.

 

[Soul]

The reason I haven't voted for him yet is because I don't know if he is scum. The possibility is likely, but perhaps he has town role that didn't know about the odd/even situation. It was the only lead I had so I've gone with it. I'm still leaning towards him being scum, but I'm not sure.

I've done a lot of thinking now, and I think I have a pretty good idea what's going on. That said, many players haven't contributed yet, and I'd like to hear their thoughts before I vote again. If needed, I'll vote for an extension.

I'd like to hear what @A Link In Time, @Malon, @Viral Maze and @Toxic_Snowman think.

 

[A Link In Time]

I've done a lot of thinking now, and I think I have a pretty good idea what's going on. That said, many players haven't contributed yet, and I'd like to hear their thoughts before I vote again. If needed, I'll vote for an extension.

I'd like to hear what @A Link In Time, @Malon, @Viral Maze and @Toxic_Snowman think.

Before I realized you were scum hunting when you asked about the odd/even night roles, I thought Johnny had a higher probability of being a power role himself and tried to show a sign that he knew of the set up without revealing it to the mafia. Now that it's been revealed that Johnny himself was not aware of the set up, I think the probability of him being either a VT or scum increases. That said, I'll refrain from voting for now if there is a possibility that Frozen Chosen is a lyncher. I would also like to see Frozen produce some hard evidence against Johnny.

 

[Mellow Ezlo]

The reason I haven't voted for him yet is because I don't know if he is scum. The possibility is likely, but perhaps he has town role that didn't know about the odd/even situation. It was the only lead I had so I've gone with it. I'm still leaning towards him being scum, but I'm not sure.

You don't know that he's scum yet you keep going after him as though he is. You're telling everybody that he's a likely candidate without going through with it yourself. On top of that, you're not revealing the so-called evidence that you have against him. Until you show what you know, people are blindly voting for Johnny on your order while you're not doing so yourself. All we want right now is for you to give us a good explanation as to why we should lynch Johnny. Personally, I'm about 50/50 on him so I'm fine either way, but I don't want to vote for him on your word alone.

Honestly, you're making yourself look really suspicious right now. I'm having a hard time believing that there's any evidence at all and that your just using johnny's lack of knowledge on the setup as a way to try to get him lynched. Any mafia member would be able to manipulate that against Johnny quite easily. The fact that you're not voting yourself is even more suspicious because, as mafia, you'd know Johnny is either town or third party, and so you may try to lead his lynch without actually voting for him so that when he flips town, you could try to make yourself look good the next day by saying "I wasn't sure he was scum so I didn't vote, I just let it happen". I've seen scum do that before and it's what it looks like to me rn.

Although, one thing that crossed my mind is what if Johnny is a Serial Killer? I don't know much about TF2 as I've said before, is there any character that may fit this role? Could Grey Mann be a SK as we know the robots are the mafia? This could make sense, especially if FroCho is, for instance, a mafia role cop and investigated him, the mafia would want to get him out of the way quickly. Thoughts?

 

[Soul]

You don't know that he's scum yet you keep going after him as though he is. You're telling everybody that he's a likely candidate without going through with it yourself. On top of that, you're not revealing the so-called evidence that you have against him. Until you show what you know, people are blindly voting for Johnny on your order while you're not doing so yourself. All we want right now is for you to give us a good explanation as to why we should lynch Johnny. Personally, I'm about 50/50 on him so I'm fine either way, but I don't want to vote for him on your word alone.

Honestly, you're making yourself look really suspicious right now. I'm having a hard time believing that there's any evidence at all and that your just using johnny's lack of knowledge on the setup as a way to try to get him lynched. Any mafia member would be able to manipulate that against Johnny quite easily. The fact that you're not voting yourself is even more suspicious because, as mafia, you'd know Johnny is either town or third party, and so you may try to lead his lynch without actually voting for him so that when he flips town, you could try to make yourself look good the next day by saying "I wasn't sure he was scum so I didn't vote, I just let it happen". I've seen scum do that before and it's what it looks like to me rn.

Although, one thing that crossed my mind is what if Johnny is a Serial Killer? I don't know much about TF2 as I've said before, is there any character that may fit this role? Could Grey Mann be a SK as we know the robots are the mafia? This could make sense, especially if FroCho is, for instance, a mafia role cop and investigated him, the mafia would want to get him out of the way quickly. Thoughts?

I think if he was the Serial Killer, they wouldn't bother with such a risky play and just nightkill him instead. Frozen Chosen's play in general seems way too risky this early in the game to be something a scum member would do. I just can't imagine it.

That said, I do agree that lynching Johnny on suspicion from FC without backup alone is rather unfair. I do have a pretty good idea what his role probably is, and everything he said makes perfect sense if it's true.

It's pretty much out in the open that he's got some kind of powerrole anyway, so he might aswell roleclaim at this point. The chance he'll be nightkilled if not doctor-protected is rather high, and I'm fairly certain he's truthful.

 

[Frozen Chosen]

Fine. I wanted to hide my role or lack of one in order to confuse the mafia. But since you guys want to see my evidence, I'll tell you.

I am the Blu Vanilla Townie. I was trying to hint at it without making sound obvious. I thought Soul may have gotten it, but it looks like no one else got it.

Anywho, Johnny can't be VT so I thought he must be something anti-town like a mafia member. But he could be some other role that is third party. That's why I haven't voted for him.

Hope this clears things up.

 

[Johnny Sooshi]

It's pretty much out in the open that he's got some kind of powerrole anyway, so he might aswell roleclaim at this point. The chance he'll be nightkilled if not doctor-protected is rather high, and I'm fairly certain he's truthful.

I don't m8. I've hinted and stated at my role multiple times.

 

[Johnny Sooshi]

Fine. I wanted to hide my role or lack of one in order to confuse the mafia. But since you guys want to see my evidence, I'll tell you.

I am the Blu Vanilla Townie. I was trying to hint at it without making sound obvious. I thought Soul may have gotten it, but it looks like no one else got it.

Anywho, Johnny can't be VT so I thought he must be something anti-town like a mafia member. But he could be some other role that is third party. That's why I haven't voted for him.

Hope this clears things up.

Nope. You can't be that. That's my role. This is the dumbest lie I have ever seen used in mafia. Frozen Chosen confirmed Godfather. If a cop investigates him he'll turn up innocent. Why would you claim this?

 

[Viral Maze]

I've done a lot of thinking now, and I think I have a pretty good idea what's going on. That said, many players haven't contributed yet, and I'd like to hear their thoughts before I vote again. If needed, I'll vote for an extension.

I'd like to hear what @A Link In Time, @Malon, @Viral Maze and @Toxic_Snowman think.

Let me catch up Soul, I'll post in a few minutes. Only a handful of pages behind.