I'm not sure I would've changed my vote, I was quite focussed on Libk. But due to my European timezone, I missed that anyway.I was so goddamn close to switching my vote to Deku last night. After he mentioned the Eclipse thing I felt like that was so ****ing scummy to bring that up at the end of the day like that, but I couldn't bring myself to switch my vote
True. I was. I was focussed 100% on Libk. But the only thing I can say in my defense is that I'm not utterly stupid. If I was mafia I would've also known from the start that Libk is town. Being so focussed on him, it would have been super obvious that in the case he'd die everyone would think I am suspicious. I could have also tried to be on good terms with him. Heck, I made enemies with Libk and Bok. I even motivated you to make that bet to vote against Libk. I'm NOT in a good position, but all of that could have been prevented, had I cared about that.So, here we go:
1. @Ver-go-a-go-go where the **** are you? Seriously, if you are scum and town loses, I'm going to feel a bit cheated because you and your predecessor didn't play for the entire ****ing game, so what are we as town supposed to do? Literally zero posts from either player. ALIT this has to be fixed somehow.
2. kokirion was a major proponent of lynching Libk since day 1, that stands out to me as suspicious now
3. Minish Link changed her vote, yes, but what if she knew Deku was going to come in and vote for Libk immediately afterwards, which is what happened (31 minutes later to be exact). If that was the case...well, then she's scum and looks pretty good right now. So, I'm definitely considering that possibility.
4. Bok does not seem scummy to me, unless he was lead by his scum mates I can't see him making some early moves he did as scum. But not writing anybody off of course.
I'm not sold on Bok being town. But Jamie did convince me to see it in a different light, I don't see him as completely scum either. To be honest, when Libk flipped town, I threw most of my reads away. I don't know. He "could" be scum. But Jamie, who is confirmed town, is really convinced this is his normal playstyle. What gutfeeling to trust?Okay, so my thoughts on our neighborhood:
Bok- He brought up the idea to reveal the huts at the same time as Jamie as soon as the game started. While I could see a more experienced player like Jamie pulling a move like that as scum to gain town cred, I'm not sure an inexperienced player would do the same without the help of scum buddies. He's been pretty active, and found some different evidence in the Mido vote. All of that has a town read for me. However, at the end of the day on the Mido vote he said that he would be taking a closer look at Deku because he still felt suspicious about him, but at the beginning of the next day he says the only inconsistency he can find with Deku is that he originally disagreed with Storm about not revealing the huts, then agreed with Libk about the same. Despite the fact that that wasn't true (which Jamie and Deku both pointed out), there were other suspicious things about Deku at that point for that to be the only thing he could find. It seems like it could have been him casting suspicion on a scum buddy to try and distance themselves, but then also not wanting to throw them under the bus too much.
Kokirion- I'll admit, I've leaned scum for him for most of the game, without really any reason. I guess it's because I was leaning town for Bok and Cslaught/Ver-go hadn't posted at all so that just left him. He has been very active and playing pretty aggressively, which both seem more town like. I like that he proposed that we try to force the mafia to play by our plan as well. However, when there was a ton of suspicion and evidence on Storm/Tristan, he voted for Libk and said that if we were going to choose a neighborhood to focus on first, he wanted it to be his (Libk's). Maybe that was a plan to shift focus from Storm, who was much more obvious as scum, to the neighborhood that would be the hardest to read? If we had started with hut 3, it probably would have given mafia an easier start, because of all the experienced players in that group.
I obviously don't have anything on Cslaught/Ver-go as there aren't really any posts to go off of. The only thing there is stuff that has been pointed out that could have been due to an inactive scum member.
Are you willing to potentially lose the game then?I really have this between koki and Minish_Link and I'd be surprised if other users didn't also have this mindset. I feel, Minish, like you could easily have coordinated your moves with koki. I'm fairly convinced at this point that if bok or vergo are scum, town is losing this game. I would like to see what @kokiron has to say before I cast my vote however.
Okay, so my thoughts on our neighborhood:
Bok- He brought up the idea to reveal the huts at the same time as Jamie as soon as the game started. While I could see a more experienced player like Jamie pulling a move like that as scum to gain town cred, I'm not sure an inexperienced player would do the same without the help of scum buddies. He's been pretty active, and found some different evidence in the Mido vote. All of that has a town read for me. However, at the end of the day on the Mido vote he said that he would be taking a closer look at Deku because he still felt suspicious about him, but at the beginning of the next day he says the only inconsistency he can find with Deku is that he originally disagreed with Storm about not revealing the huts, then agreed with Libk about the same. Despite the fact that that wasn't true (which Jamie and Deku both pointed out), there were other suspicious things about Deku at that point for that to be the only thing he could find. It seems like it could have been him casting suspicion on a scum buddy to try and distance themselves, but then also not wanting to throw them under the bus too much.
I can't confirm or deny your idea of my role because I'd be mod killed but I will say that the asshole is in a precarious position now for the reasons you pointed out.I'm back. All of yesterday and today I've had to move furniture (I'm moving to a new appartment these days), so I'm a little bit late here.
I never ruled out that Deku could have been scum, BUT, I honestly honestly honestly believed Libk was scum. I feel a tad embarrassed there. I expected a misplaced bandwagon on me this morning, and I felt very unmotivated to keep defending me.
Having said that, I'm not going to move heaven and earth to stay alive today. I already feel stupid enough over that last lynch.
But I did decide to come back to post today. Jamie survived the night. After Deku's flip and the eclipse I did not even think that would happen.
The only way Dekunut died is because you are the Town Asshole, Jamie. But that is good. There is no role left to counter that. And the question is whether the mafia is willing to risk hitting you again. Even if you don't hide behind the mafia member, a random townie will be killed (and probably one who has been seen as very suspicious, limiting the amount of persons the actual mafia could be). It will be better to kill that random townie by choice than by risking to kill themselves.
With 5 alive, we'll have 2 days left, instead of 1. And the final day (if we don't kill mafia today) will be a fight between 3 people, what probably isn't favourable for the mafia. The other reason I came back to play is because it actually isn't 100% clear WHO the real mafia player is.... I'm not dead yet so I will not give up. Not until I'm killed. Lynched or nightkilled. And even in that case I can still contribute to catching the real mafia member.
I'm not sure I would've changed my vote, I was quite focussed on Libk. But due to my European timezone, I missed that anyway.
True. I was. I was focussed 100% on Libk. But the only thing I can say in my defense is that I'm not utterly stupid. If I was mafia I would've also known from the start that Libk is town. Being so focussed on him, it would have been super obvious that in the case he'd die everyone would think I am suspicious. I could have also tried to be on good terms with him. Heck, I made enemies with Libk and Bok. I even motivated you to make that bet to vote against Libk. I'm NOT in a good position, but all of that could have been prevented, had I cared about that.
I'm not sold on Bok being town. But Jamie did convince me to see it in a different light, I don't see him as completely scum either. To be honest, when Libk flipped town, I threw most of my reads away. I don't know. He "could" be scum. But Jamie, who is confirmed town, is really convinced this is his normal playstyle. What gutfeeling to trust?
And about me not voting for Storm. Firstly, I have a personal mafia policy to not vote for Storm on day 1. He is almost always the first to be accused, and as you can see in all of my games, I almost never join in to vote for him. Not because he isn't suspicious, oh yes he is! But he is so goddamn unpredictable, and I dislike to always lynch that townie whose usual behaviour is always scummy. I figured that if he is scum he will flip so much in the upcoming days even the philosopher's stone is not alive.
And if I were mafia, I would start with targeting people in Storm's neighbourhood. He was gonna die anyway, and even if he didn't get so many votes on him on day 1, knowing Storm he is hard to keep alive anyway. So why would I first start with a different neighbourhood, that just means it will be harder and harder to keep him alive. I would start with his neighbourhood. First lynch someone other than him in his neighbourhood, then on day 2 vote for him and throw him under the bus. I might get some town credit because of it and I wiped out the entire neighbourhood (if I would then also have killed the remaining player there of course), so would have lost nothing.
Are you willing to potentially lose the game then?
I think Vergo is town. He is just too honest. He is town, he is not lying.
I really always believed Minish was town. Now I am reconsidering. I promised Bok to analyse all her posts today. I will. Later tonight.
I'm not going to decide between voting for Bok or Minish before finishing that analysis
I agree, especially given the downsides of the role, that talking about it can only be a negative."Town Asshole" huh? We can very much use that to our advantage in these final days, but I'll let the player them self decide that. Talking about it more seems detrimental to the town and I find it strange that such a powerful town role was talked about in these final stages. Seems like something that only scum would want to talk about in the open.
@Prophecies About Bok Choy How many games have you played on this forum before?
"Town Asshole" huh? We can very much use that to our advantage in these final days, but I'll let the player them self decide that. Talking about it more seems detrimental to the town and I find it strange that such a powerful town role was talked about in these final stages. Seems like something that only scum would want to talk about in the open.
@Prophecies About Bok Choy How many games have you played on this forum before?
I really have this between koki and Minish_Link and I'd be surprised if other users didn't also have this mindset. I feel, Minish, like you could easily have coordinated your moves with koki. I'm fairly convinced at this point that if bok or vergo are scum, town is losing this game. I would like to see what @kokiron has to say before I cast my vote however.
I'm back. All of yesterday and today I've had to move furniture (I'm moving to a new appartment these days), so I'm a little bit late here.
I never ruled out that Deku could have been scum, BUT, I honestly honestly honestly believed Libk was scum. I feel a tad embarrassed there. I expected a misplaced bandwagon on me this morning, and I felt very unmotivated to keep defending me.
Having said that, I'm not going to move heaven and earth to stay alive today. I already feel stupid enough over that last lynch.
But I did decide to come back to post today. Jamie survived the night. After Deku's flip and the eclipse I did not even think that would happen.
The only way Dekunut died is because you are the Town Asshole, Jamie. But that is good. There is no role left to counter that. And the question is whether the mafia is willing to risk hitting you again. Even if you don't hide behind the mafia member, a random townie will be killed (and probably one who has been seen as very suspicious, limiting the amount of persons the actual mafia could be). It will be better to kill that random townie by choice than by risking to kill themselves.
With 5 alive, we'll have 2 days left, instead of 1. And the final day (if we don't kill mafia today) will be a fight between 3 people, what probably isn't favourable for the mafia. The other reason I came back to play is because it actually isn't 100% clear WHO the real mafia player is.... I'm not dead yet so I will not give up. Not until I'm killed. Lynched or nightkilled. And even in that case I can still contribute to catching the real mafia member.
I'm not sure I would've changed my vote, I was quite focussed on Libk. But due to my European timezone, I missed that anyway.
True. I was. I was focussed 100% on Libk. But the only thing I can say in my defense is that I'm not utterly stupid. If I was mafia I would've also known from the start that Libk is town. Being so focussed on him, it would have been super obvious that in the case he'd die everyone would think I am suspicious. I could have also tried to be on good terms with him. Heck, I made enemies with Libk and Bok. I even motivated you to make that bet to vote against Libk. I'm NOT in a good position, but all of that could have been prevented, had I cared about that.
I'm not sold on Bok being town. But Jamie did convince me to see it in a different light, I don't see him as completely scum either. To be honest, when Libk flipped town, I threw most of my reads away. I don't know. He "could" be scum. But Jamie, who is confirmed town, is really convinced this is his normal playstyle. What gutfeeling to trust?
And about me not voting for Storm. Firstly, I have a personal mafia policy to not vote for Storm on day 1. He is almost always the first to be accused, and as you can see in all of my games, I almost never join in to vote for him. Not because he isn't suspicious, oh yes he is! But he is so goddamn unpredictable, and I dislike to always lynch that townie whose usual behaviour is always scummy. I figured that if he is scum he will flip so much in the upcoming days even the philosopher's stone is not alive.
And if I were mafia, I would start with targeting people in Storm's neighbourhood. He was gonna die anyway, and even if he didn't get so many votes on him on day 1, knowing Storm he is hard to keep alive anyway. So why would I first start with a different neighbourhood, that just means it will be harder and harder to keep him alive. I would start with his neighbourhood. First lynch someone other than him in his neighbourhood, then on day 2 vote for him and throw him under the bus. I might get some town credit because of it and I wiped out the entire neighbourhood (if I would then also have killed the remaining player there of course), so would have lost nothing.
Are you willing to potentially lose the game then?
I think Vergo is town. He is just too honest. He is town, he is not lying.
I really always believed Minish was town. Now I am reconsidering. I promised Bok to analyse all her posts today. I will. Later tonight.
I'm not going to decide between voting for Bok or Minish before finishing that analysis
I feel like it's either you or Ver-go as the last scum, and I'm not really sure why Ver-go got a sudden town read even though there's not much to go off of yet. I do like that you've been playing really aggressively and making a lot of posts with lots of thoughts/evidence behind them. However, since there's not a lot to go off of for Ver-go and I'm reading Bok as town, I do feel like you could be scum.
If we're in agreement that Bok seems to be town (which I'm willing to believe after reading some of his posts and knowing about his experience), then the best course of action seems to be to lynch kokirion today, and if the game is still going tomorrow, the last two players should lynch Minish Link.
It comes down to 1.) If Bok has done a good job of fooling all of us and he probably deserves to win if he's mafia, or 2.) If something bad happens during the night.
I don't think a mafia member would fail to post for an entire game, and I don't think Link in Time would allow for his replacement to not post for an extended period either. I've already apologized for not jumping into the game immediately, I obviously don't have anything else to say in my defense other than if I was mafia, it would be a hollow and worthless victory due to the game not even being fair.
Alright.
To discuss the first. It might seem a strange question, but Dekunut and Storm know each other very well, outside the forum even. I have been in a mafia team with them in a far away game, having learned that they know each other in real life. There was time between everyone receiving their roles and the start of the game. If they are teammates I would find it hard to believe that they would never talk about the game. Storm made a vital mistake by opposing to reveal the neighbourhoods. If they were a team, why didn't Deku stop him? Why didn't Deku try to influence Storm in such a way that he would survive day 1? Let's face it. IF Deku has truly made that Pendio-mistake on purpose, then he is a damn good strategist. Wouldn't he then also have been clever enough to notice Storm was heading towards a cliff, and to then have act on that?
This was just a mistake, Libk being tired. I believe that.
What I DO find interesting is the eagerness to vote for Jamie when seeing just a tiny tiny crack. All that Libk mistakenly thought was that Jamie said that he talked in his neighbourhood whereas he didn't. My question is whether that would be scummy at all. And if you compare Jamie's town- and scumtells this game, such a tiny tiny scum tell against his doesn't warrant an immediate vote. At most a confrontation with Jamie that what he said was not true.
So why was Libk so eager to vote for Jamie?