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General Modern Do We REALLY Need a "Darker" Zelda?

Justac00lguy

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JuicieJ said:
Quit bringing up critical reception. Games like Super Mario Sunshine and Resident Evil 4 were also critically acclaimed, and they didn't deserve the praise they received at all.
So wait do I go with a majority of people whos expertise it is to review said games and to go on an average to even further the validity or of one persons views who generally rates Twilight Princess as the worst game in the series?I'm sorry but you are no Zelda genius or a top reviewer so I will continue to bring up critical reception as its more fair to bring up than one persons views.
 

JuicieJ

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So wait do I go with a majority of people whos expertise it is to review said games and to go on an average to even further the validity or of one persons views who generally rates Twilight Princess as the worst game in the series?I'm sorry but you are no Zelda genius or a top reviewer so I will continue to bring up critical reception as its more fair to bring up than one persons views.

You are aware that reviewers are just people giving their opinions, right? Their word isn't magically law. I also guarantee you that the fact that TP was a Zelda game played a roll in all those perfect scores. Just look at Darksiders for an example. It's a good game -- debatable whether or not it's better than TP -- but also a heavily flawed one, and it got the critical reception one would most likely expect it to get. And not surprisingly. There was no prior nostalgia to live off of going into it, unlike with TP. You're talking to a guy who initially praised TP left and right after playing it for the first time, as well as a guy who once said SS was the best Zelda (and no longer does). I know what it's like to go into a Zelda game and have a sort of honeymoon phase due to being such a huge fan, letting personal feelings get in the way rather than looking at things from a distance. You can't just dismiss me because I don't work for IGN, Machinima, or some other big name company. That's shallow and unreasonable, and in all honesty, somewhat laughable.

I also don't claim that TP is the worst in the series, just one of the worst. That also doesn't automatically mean I hate the game, nor does it mean I consider it to be poor. I even made a frickin' thread praising its strengths. Or did you forget about that already?

Edit: There's also the factor of none of this having to do with what I was saying. I said Twilight Princess took a route that didn't fit the fantasy vibe the series is supposed to have. That doesn't really have anything to do with critical reception.
 
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Justac00lguy

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You are aware that reviewers are just people giving their opinions, right? Their word isn't magically law. I also guarantee you that the fact that TP was a Zelda game played a roll in all those perfect scores. Just look at Darksiders for an example. It's a good game -- debatable whether or not it's better than TP -- but also a heavily flawed one, and it got the critical reception one would most likely expect it to get. And not surprisingly. There was no prior nostalgia to live off of going into it, unlike with TP. You're talking to a guy who initially praised TP left and right after playing it for the first time, as well as a guy who once said SS was the best Zelda (and no longer does). I know what it's like to go into a Zelda game and have a sort of honeymoon phase due to being such a huge fan, letting personal feelings get in the way rather than looking at things from a distance. You can't just dismiss me because I don't work for IGN, Machinima, or some other big name company. That's shallow and unreasonable, and in all honesty, somewhat laughable.

I also don't claim that TP is the worst in the series, just one of the worst. That also doesn't automatically mean I hate the game, nor does it mean I consider it to be poor. I even made a frickin' thread praising its strengths. Or did you forget about that already?
I'm just saying your opinion isn't the be all and all contrary to what you think... You said not to go off such reviews/critical reception however that would further prove the point that I shouldn't go off your opinion. Not that I would I am perfectly fine to take in other peoples opinions however basing one opinion on the overall success of a game is wrong. It's like voting for a president if you asked one person, it's simply not fair, this thread or my post was simply referring to the general consensus of how a game that featured a darker theme and more realistic outcomes can be successful as you it seemed you were stating that is wasn't.
 

Justac00lguy

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JuicieJ said:
There's also the factor of none of this having to do with what I was saying. I said Twilight Princess took a route that didn't fit the fantasy vibe the series is supposed to have. That doesn't really have anything to do with critical reception.
Thought I would go off this as it's more on topic...

Can I question something? Where do you get this idea that Zelda is supposed to be? This is a franchise that highly differentiates with most releases, the way the series is set up allows fur such change. Unless you can get me some sort of statement/quote explicitly stating that Zelda is bound to this set path then I disagree.
 

JuicieJ

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Thought I would go off this as it's more on topic...

Can I question something? Where do you get this idea that Zelda is supposed to be? This is a franchise that highly differentiates with most releases, the way the series is set up allows fur such change. Unless you can get me some sort of statement/quote explicitly stating that Zelda is bound to this set path then I disagree.

Zelda started out as a whimsical fantasy series and has been such in nearly every game. Even Majora's Mask wasn't a dark and brooding game. It had more mature themes to it, but it was a Gothic Fantasy game, which still has elements of whimsy. Honestly, the only Zelda game that hasn't been high fantasy is Twilight Princess, and it actually started out as a sequel to The Wind Waker. Nintendo only made it darker to make up for the lack of sales The Wind Waker had because of its cartoony style (again, mainstream Western fans <_<). And, in case you didn't notice, all three games succeeding TP have been whimsical.

If that's not proof of what I'm saying, I don't know what is.
 

Random Person

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Think the key thing here is semantics and diction. I try not to say the series needs a darker game, but that a more serious game would really improve its standings. Some people relate the words "dark" and "serious" together, so one just has to be careful how they say things. Now if one believes that serious just isn't the way to go... well, then I just straight up disagree.
 

Justac00lguy

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Zelda started out as a whimsical fantasy series and has been such in nearly every game. Even Majora's Mask wasn't a dark and brooding game. It had more mature themes to it, but it was a Gothic Fantasy game, which still has elements of whimsy. Honestly, the only Zelda game that hasn't been high fantasy is Twilight Princess, and it actually started out as a sequel to The Wind Waker. Nintendo only made it darker to make up for the lack of sales The Wind Waker had because of its cartoony style (again, mainstream Western fans <_<). And, in case you didn't notice, all three games succeeding TP have been whimsical.

If that's not proof of what I'm saying, I don't know what is.
This still doesn't mean that Zelda "has" to follow a set path, there is no supposed to be when it comes to Zelda, it's a highly flexible franchise that can make changes without drastically hurting the franchise as a whole. Limiting it to a set path limits the franchise on where it can go and achieve.
 

JuicieJ

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Think the key thing here is semantics and diction. I try not to say the series needs a darker game, but that a more serious game would really improve its standings. Some people relate the words "dark" and "serious" together, so one just has to be careful how they say things. Now if one believes that serious just isn't the way to go... well, then I just straight up disagree.

Very solid point to bring up. Seriousness is significantly different from dark. But Zelda has always had serious elements. Even The Wind Waker deals with some pretty serious issues, although not in great detail. Majora's Mask would be the proper example of handling serious issues. So the situation isn't that Zelda should adopt tackling serious stuff, it's that it should be more expressive about them. It could easily do that while managing to keep the whimsy and charm it's known for, unlike with going for a darker tone.

This still doesn't mean that Zelda "has" to follow a set path, there is no supposed to be when it comes to Zelda, it's a highly flexible franchise that can make changes without drastically hurting the franchise as a whole. Limiting it to a set path limits the franchise on where it can go and achieve.

You can keep to whimsy without having the same tone every time, and Zelda has proven that time and time again. It could use more detail in its stories, but each game has its own specific tone, even without going for a darker tone.
 
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Just a quick question but what exactly makes a game "dark" per say? I am sure that "death" is not necessary as I do not consider the Assassin's Creed franchise to be a dark series.
 

CynicalSquid

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Some people might want a darker Zelda game. That's just their opinion.
 

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But seriously, lighthearted games are fun but there are segments of the fanbase (such as myself) like to sit down and play a darker, more serious game.
 
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