ZD Members Vs. Mods Game Thread

[Pen]

Vote: Extension

I have been looking through the posts of yesterday and the day before that. I think that I might be onto something, or it may be nothing. Anyway, I will be back with some sort of analysis in a moment.

EBWODP:

Might be more than a moment...

 

[Justac00lguy]

Might as well respond just to explain things on my part.

Oh, I definitely believe you about that, trust me. But I already addressed why I think your “pioneering” ways on Fig were particularly strange in light of you wasting the entire day before that messing around with conflicting role-claims. If you had this “conversational” attitude for the entire game, I’d be more inclined to believe you. But you still sat on your hands all day yesterday, doing hardly a thing to help us determine whether Deku or Keith was mafia before everything went down. Your, shall I say, contradictory attitude from day to day, just sticks out like a sore thumb, I’m afraid.

Like I've said quite a few times now, me getting involved with Keith and DekuNut had no benefit for myself whatsoever. I knew what I wanted to do, which was draw attention to myself, getting involved in that debate would have done nothing for me on that front. It's not really a contradictory attitude, so what, I can't play different for one day? It seems like you're holding me down on this one day because it's abnormal to my playstyle. Thing is, this is the problem for me now, I'm stuck to this one playstyle because anything that I do differently people will automatically default it to being suspicious, when in reality I'm just trying out something different - in this case I wanted to protect the Cop. Did I go about it the best way possible? Maybe not necessarily, but it was the safest possible way.

First off, it’s a ridiculous assumption to “put myself in your shoes” when the entire premise of that depends on me actually believing that you got Mandy as a role. Second of all, this doesn’t address, at all, what I find to be just a terrible strategy to draw attention away from the cop. What rule says Mandy has the be the cop, exactly? Is it just because “tracker” is kind of like “cop” to you? Again, this is a ridiculous assumption on the part of the rest of us, something that I’m not willing to take on face-value because of other factors, like the ridiculousness of your yesterday strategy in the first place, that should be taken into account.

I don't see why you can't put yourself in my shoes; it's not that hard (whether you believe me or not). Honestly it's quite pointless discussing this as you obviously don't trust me, so I'll explain at the end of the game. Hopefully you'll get a better insight as to why is softclaimed Mandy.

I’d be willing to accept it as a simple mistake, as we all make them. But the fact remains that this was AFTER your claim of Mandy, so….. Was it really just THAT big of a screw-up on your part? That you thought claiming Mandy wasn’t enough, so you, for some reason, decided to claim what could very well be the lover pair, like, just a few posts later? And you’re expecting me to believe that you of all people screwed that up when your intention was as noble as saving our cop? I’m not a man that believes in coincidence too easily, and coupled with everything else, this whole thing just stinks, I’m sorry.

It wasn't a mistake so to say, but more of an over complication on my own part. I was too busy thinking about Mafia focusing on me. I'd made it very clear I wanted the Cop to lie low and I made it my main prospect. Me claiming Mandy seemed too obvious and I thought Mafia would seem right through me - why would I softclaim Cop when I just told the Cop to lie low? I was trying to claim Cop but while not being too obvious. In hindsight my second soft claim was a bad move. It's hard for me to really justify why I did this as your have to literally be in my mind at the time.

No, no, you misunderstand me. I don’t think this is another slip-up on your part because of your past playstyles. To the contrary, your style is very much the same no matter whose side you’re on, which makes you a very good player. No, my issue is, once again, the timing. I addressed this in the first paragraph in response to you, but I will reiterate; when the post that Fig made, your entire basis for your original vote, happened on the previous day, why not bring this forward at all? You could have, if this was such a strong issue to you, at least put some kind of FOS on him, or at LEAST presented an opposing lynch option when pretty much nothing was there against Keith. But it’s not just that either, it’s the fact, again, that yesterday was a fairly useless day for you. Again, as I said originally, it seems like the mafia being in a very powerful position right now attempting to control the conversation, in comparison to yesterday when they didn’t have to thanks to the Keith bandwagon.

Hmm. I couldn't have voted for Fig the day previous; that would be contradictory of my entire main suspicion I had around him for today. Ok I'll explain:

My main thing with Fig was that I found it awfully convenient that he told the Cop to lie low on Day Three and then the next night the Cop dies. I put two and two together and now I had a possible lead - a Mafia Role Cop could have investigated Alit the night previous, so now it makes sense that Fig would say this if he was scum. Though now it looks like the Role Cop investigated Alit on the same night that they killed Fig, which pretty much clears up my suspicion on Fig. Anyway, my whole reason for voting him was the product of what happened after the Day you're talking about.

Ah, this is convenient indeed. So what you’re telling me is this – you suspend your mafia hunting skills ENTIRELY for one day, just because you’re hoping the mafia kills you. I’m sorry man, but this contradicts every single thing you’ve said to me. If your priority is to always aid town through activity, why on earth stop? If you were fake-claiming cop, why not take it further when some incredibly in-depth analysis on whether or not Keith is mafia. Come on dude, you know playing as mafia as well as I do; target the active members, and target the experienced member. If you truly, really wanted the mafia to kill you….. Act like a hardcore townie. But you didn’t do that. And, again, I think it’s because you were content with just letting that play out because it meant the lynch of a townie no matter what, regardless of your input. This response has only strengthened my resolve on this matter, the more I think about it.

Yeah but the thing was that I had no idea if either Keith or DekuNut were Town or Mafia - I didn't want to put myself at jeopardy of getting lynched as that would be counterproductive to my actual cause. See I'm not sure if you were active the day previous, but I lead Town to lynch Violet because we literally had nothing else to go for, so naturally I was in a few people's sights. I'm a firm believer that when I'm scum hunting, I should be doing just that, hunting, me getting involved purely for the sake of looking "Pro Town" wouldn't have worked out and more likely it would have came off as fake, which is exactly why I don't get involved. I knew people were on edge and the slightest missed step would likely result in a lynch - I was very wary of that, so I had no business in getting involved. Also, I honestly had nothing good to say either, I thought that discussion was pointless and I didn't see either as particularly scummy.

There you go, with the assumptions once more – no one said that Mandy has to be a character in this game. Look at the member names we have so far – the vast, vast majority of them feature members who are active in ZD mafia games. Mine is the same. It’s entirely, ENTIRELY possible that Mandy, as someone who has not been active in a game to my knowledge since I returned late last year, was not a role in favor of someone else. Therefor, it would, indeed, be easy to pull off a claim of a name that doesn’t exist, and a role that you can cleverly hide behind the guise of “not getting results”. The Tracker has a variety of forms that it can take, and flavors that can be added. If anything, it’s EASIER to pull off a fake-claim of it because of this. You claim something that could easily be slightly different to another’s role, or hell, even a direct duplicate (I’ve seen pairs before). An inactive player may have it, or people may have glossed over your claim in the first place. This by no means gives you a free pass in any event, and should you not be lynched tonight, I’ll be keeping a close eye out if I’m still alive tomorrow.

I literally have nothing to say in response here. I hope Heroine has changed you mind, but I can't make you belive me, lol.

---

I'm willing to Unvote and start a new day so to say, are you guys with me?

 

[DekuNut]

I still don't think that telling the cop to lie low is scummy. I would do the same. After all, a role like that doesn't come around often.

 

[Ver-go-a-go-go]

I'm willing to Unvote and start a new day so to say, are you guys with me?

I don't think you're scum right now, so it would make sense for me and Deku to do so, I suppose. But I really would like to hear your input on others (namely exactly what Viral said - Pendio and Atticus) before that, so maybe we should keep the votes on you to make you more motivated? Just to make sure you put those good scum-hunting skills to work.

That's kind of a joke, but I'll go first and see what you think -

If you were lynched and flipped mafia, I was going to look into Pendio immediately. Whereas my suspicions against you were more concrete with what I put together over the course of a few days, Pendio is still playing his "perfect game" that I've witnessed quite a few times now. He's just really, really good at not giving away anything in his posts. I've seen it several times - he plays are more "lay-low" game regardless of his affiliation, so it's difficult to discern anything. Although what I think of this Fig lynch is the same as what I thought about the Keith lynch, which I believe was instigated by Pendio despite what seemed like some incredibly thin reasoning based on what I considered a newbie mistake on Keith's part (this was his first game, as we should keep in mind). He also followed, like, directly after you with the vote on Fig, seemingly just hoping to continue the immediate start of the day bandwagon.

I haven't played with Atticus in enough games to know anything, unfortunately. But, after this many with Pendio, I think the above might be enough to justify an alternative action. Again, this Fig bandwagon stinks - I'd be incredibly surprised if not a single mafia member was on it, currently.

I still don't think that telling the cop to lie low is scummy. I would do the same. After all, a role like that doesn't come around often.

I don't think it is either, and I think it's a reasonable assumption to make. "The cop shouldn't claim after the doctor is dead" is something that seems like a given regardless of anything else.

 

[Justac00lguy]

That's kind of a joke, but I'll go first and see what you think -

Okay... (?) lol.

If you were lynched and flipped mafia, I was going to look into Pendio immediately. Whereas my suspicions against you were more concrete with what I put together over the course of a few days, Pendio is still playing his "perfect game" that I've witnessed quite a few times now. He's just really, really good at not giving away anything in his posts. I've seen it several times - he plays are more "lay-low" game regardless of his affiliation, so it's difficult to discern anything. Although what I think of this Fig lynch is the same as what I thought about the Keith lynch, which I believe was instigated by Pendio despite what seemed like some incredibly thin reasoning based on what I considered a newbie mistake on Keith's part (this was his first game, as we should keep in mind). He also followed, like, directly after you with the vote on Fig, seemingly just hoping to continue the immediate start of the day bandwagon.

Honestly I felt the same about that lynch in a way, Pendio seemed so sure of something that no one seemed to get (except for DekuNut). I don't know though, Pendio plays very tactical and quite careful at times (mostly when he's scum, which is most of the time, lol). I just don't se the why he would spearhead that lynch... unless...

Wait let me think, who died night two? I think it was Findexma, who died on night (correct me if I'm wrong). See the thing is that we have extra information - now we have confirmation that Mafia has a Role Cop and that this variation can target a player and get that information back within the same night. What irks me about their choice of kill on night two is that she had a role that could potentially cause a lot of confusion for Town, so I think Mafia would prefer to keep her in the game. This basically clears up them investigating Findexma as it doesn't make sense to kill her given her potentially troublesome role.

Anyway, if their role cop isn't a one shot, then we can potentially discuss who they may have targeted night two. I actually might look back the day previous to gather some evidence, but I have an inkling and it relates to your suspicion, Vergo. Do you think it's possible that Mafia investigated Keith on night two, found out he was a cult member, and then proceeded to lynch him to earn some town credibility? This would kind of explains why Pendio made such a risky move (if he was scum) as he knew the target he was pursuing was 3rd party.

Thoughts?

 

[Ver-go-a-go-go]

Wait let me think, who died night two? I think it was Findexma, who died on night (correct me if I'm wrong). See the thing is that we have extra information - now we have confirmation that Mafia has a Role Cop and that this variation can target a player and get that information back within the same night. What irks me about their choice of kill on night two is that she had a role that could potentially cause a lot of confusion for Town, so I think Mafia would prefer to keep her in the game. This basically clears up them investigating Findexma as it doesn't make sense to kill her given her potentially troublesome role.

Indeed, it was Findexma, someone that I know absolutely nothing about. The kill didn’t make sense… especially in light of the doctor already being dead. As mafia, it’s common to be careful when deciding who to lynch early in the game; going after a well-established and active member off the bat is risky, as these players are hot targets for the doctor. As mafia, I often suggest we go after people like Findexma first, someone who is a fairly unlikely protection candidate. It’s also a very stupid move for the mafia to eliminate the Miller, if they knew that Findexma was exactly that. Thus, I conclude this lynch was just a shot in the dark to burn a nightkill, and Findexma wasn’t a role cop target at all. Unless…. The Miller role that Findexma DID possess someone threw their investigation results off, and the results themselves made Findexma out to be something they weren’t, such as the actual town cop. Unlikely, but it would explain a good deal.

Anyway, if their role cop isn't a one shot, then we can potentially discuss who they may have targeted night two. I actually might look back the day previous to gather some evidence, but I have an inkling and it relates to your suspicion, Vergo. Do you think it's possible that Mafia investigated Keith on night two, found out he was a cult member, and then proceeded to lynch him to earn some town credibility? This would kind of explains why Pendio made such a risky move (if he was scum) as he knew the target he was pursuing was 3rd party.

Unfortunately, this could go either way, as I’ve been mafia in games with both a limited shot cop, and an unlimited shot one. However, there’s a clear distinction to be made – limited shot cops were always more prevalent in role madness games. And, in a way, this makes sense; unlimited shot in role madness WOULD be slightly OP…. but Pirates 2 was just that, and featured an unlimited shot cop. So it’s hard to say, either way. Blame it on dumb luck, but the preciseness of the nightkills up to this point does in fact, to me, point towards the mafia’s role cop having unlimited potential.

The second possibility there is interesting…. But it depends on a number of things falling into place. It’s probably safe to assume that the Cult Leader has at least attempted to recruit every night, as there’s no real advantage to NOT do that. In fact, that raises a very interesting possibility… From what I understand, it’s very common for cult recruitments just to fail whenever they attempt to recruit mafia. Because of the one-sided nature of this game, perhaps the cult leader has something to share regarding whether or not his/her recruitment failed? But eh, the more I think about it, the more I realize that the Cult Leader probably has nothing to gain by revealing anything to the rest of us on the chance of being found out, but it’s just a thought in case they have a change of heart.

But, back on track, it depends on whether or not Keith was recruited that night, or on a night before that. If he was recruited on a previous night, it’s very possible that your theory is true. If he was recruited on the night prior to his lynch, it’s tough to say – would the mafia cop read his previous role, or the one he had just gained that night? It comes down to an order of operations that we’re not sure of regarding what goes on during the night. But even if they DID get a result back confirming him being part of the cult, I don’t see why they would prioritize that. From “Big Octo’s” small description there on the death list, it doesn’t look like he had any special powers. With Kybyrian just sitting there as a confirmed townie, why not go after him, but instead the newbie, power-less Keith? It doesn’t seem likely to me. If there was, indeed, a mafia member on the Keith bandwagon, I don’t think it’s because they investigated Keith and zeroed in on him.


On a side note.... A LOT of you people immediately jumped right after the "extension" was offered. Like, just mere moments after it. And the lack of activity since then today is very, very surprising after that. Just pop in, approve of the extension, and then pop right out. Maybe I'm a bit paranoid here, but I'm kind of uneasy about this.

 

[Justac00lguy]

On a side note.... A LOT of you people immediately jumped right after the "extension" was offered. Like, just mere moments after it. And the lack of activity since then today is very, very surprising after that. Just pop in, approve of the extension, and then pop right out. Maybe I'm a bit paranoid here, but I'm kind of uneasy about this.

Me too, it proves that these people are well up do date with events, but have no intention of engaging in any activity, which nails in the fact that they're just going with the flow.

---

Also about what Viral said last night. He could be right, I would argue that at least one scum is siting on that lynch with the possibility of lynching not one but two Townies being too good of an opportunity to pass up. However, @icus was the last person on the lynch at that time, right? Now either she didn't acknowledged Fig's claim, or she simply forgot, but would Mafia allow this move to happen (one of their teammates potentially dying?) The day was literally about to end, which, if she was Mafia, she would have died. So wouldn't Mafia attempt to stop this by voting for me, or stopping the Fig lynch somehow? Hmm just a thought. I also didn't like the way Bo didn't make a decision, just seemed to comment within any clinical decision.

At the moment I'm leaning more towards Pendio than @icus, but both could potentially be scum.

 

[Ver-go-a-go-go]

However, @icus was the last person on the lynch at that time, right? Now either she didn't acknowledged Fig's claim, or she simply forgot, but would Mafia allow this move to happen (one of their teammates potentially dying?) The day was literally about to end, which, if she was Mafia, she would have died. So wouldn't Mafia attempt to stop this by voting for me, or stopping the Fig lynch somehow? Hmm just a thought.

I doubt it, for two main reasons. 1.) Fig's claim both lacks sufficient evidence and a commanding presence. I've yet to see a ZD mafia game that featured a vengeful townie, which is evidence towards it being an uncommon role. It would be easy to pull of a subtle fake-claim of this for those two reasons coupled with the fact that no one seemed to really care about the hints Fig dropped. It's incredibly possible that he just claimed under pressure, as the "vengeful townie" claim is pretty much the best defensive claim you could possibly come up with at this stage in the game. 2.) The votes at the time don't match up. Until Fig voted for you, which wasn't until right before the extension, there was really no need to abandon the Fig lynch as he was going to die or had a chance to die even if Atticus un-voted. Those two together make me seriously doubt there was a mafia back-pedal at the last second, unless you think I'm the sole mafia member on your bandwagon attempting to save Atticus from an unlikely vengeful townie death, as Deku is confirmed town. To cover myself on that one, I'll point out that it was possible that the votes needed to achieve the extension in the first place were very close to not even being reached without my approval. If I really wanted you dead, and I knew the mafia could take losing a single member, I would have left well-enough alone right there.

At the moment I'm leaning more towards Pendio than @icus, but both could potentially be scum.

Same. "Don't trust Pendio" is a popular joke around here, but it exists for a reason.

 

[Justac00lguy]

So, what you're saying essentially is that you think Fig's claim was a desperate attempt survive? Hmm, so you're not buying Viral's theory of sorts either?

 

[DekuNut]

Pendio seemed so sure of something that no one seemed to get (except for DekuNut).

What's that?

But, back on track, it depends on whether or not Keith was recruited that night, or on a night before that. If he was recruited on a previous night, it’s very possible that your theory is true.

On a side note.... A LOT of you people immediately jumped right after the "extension" was offered. Like, just mere moments after it. And the lack of activity since then today is very, very surprising after that. Just pop in, approve of the extension, and then pop right out. Maybe I'm a bit paranoid here, but I'm kind of uneasy about this.

1) You're one night off.
2) I can see why. After all, nobody has any idea who to vote for right now.

The votes at the time don't match up. Until Fig voted for you, which wasn't until right before the extension, there was really no need to abandon the Fig lynch as he was going to die or had a chance to die even if Atticus un-voted. Those two together make me seriously doubt there was a mafia back-pedal at the last second, unless you think I'm the sole mafia member on your bandwagon attempting to save Atticus from an unlikely vengeful townie death, as Deku is confirmed town. To cover myself on that one, I'll point out that it was possible that the votes needed to achieve the extension in the first place were very close to not even being reached without my approval. If I really wanted you dead, and I knew the mafia could take losing a single member, I would have left well-enough alone right there.

I see your logic here, and so I think it's safe to say that this wasn't a scum hammer. We pretty much talked Fig into voting here, and, as Ver said, I'm all but confirmed, and that leaves only one other person, Ver. Far from a scum hammer I think.



Same. "Don't trust Pendio" is a popular joke around here, but it exists for a reason.[/QUOTE]

EBWODP:

So, what you're saying essentially is that you think Fig's claim was a desperate attempt survive? Hmm, so you're not buying Viral's theory of sorts either?

I would agree with this statement myself. Not to say it proves him either way, but it makes the most sense.

EBWO?P:
Well, Double-Voter, Double-Poster, both with a quote fail and I forgot to mention that quote. Oh well.
Never trust Pendio.

 

[Ver-go-a-go-go]

So, what you're saying essentially is that you think Fig's claim was a desperate attempt survive? Hmm, so you're not buying Viral's theory of sorts either?

It’s not that I’m not buying Viral’s theory as much as it is me thinking that Fig’s “defense” was rather lack-luster and was dripping with both annoyance and desperation. I think it’s entirely possible that it was just a claim to attempt to get heat off himself when the entire day was focused on him. We may be putting too much stock into this mafia cop, as they would be quite amazing if they investigated Keith, ALIT, and Fig, and then very nearly successfully implemented actions to dispose of them. Fig doesn’t seem like a good investigation candidate to me.

1) You're one night off.

2) I can see why. After all, nobody has any idea who to vote for right now.

1) Not really sure what you mean by that.

2.) I thought Viral had put forth an incredibly likely idea that there’s at least one mafia member on the current Fig bandwagon, isolating either Pendio or Atticus. There’s been, quite literally, no conversation except me and JC about this, despite the mass approval for the extension directly following its suggestion.

Also, DekuNut, you hold a lot of power over who’s going to eventually be lynched today. Hearing your in-depth thoughts on the Fig bandwagon would be especially useful.

 

[Pen]

I have now been rereading day 2 and day 3, trying to uncover the Cult Leader. It was on day 2 that I posted my first suspicions on Keith. At that time I was not extremely suspicious of him, but I did at least put some sort of pressure on him. Later on that day Mido exposed Keith to further accusations, and even placed a vote on him before day 2 ended (however I do believe that was the only vote placed on Keith that day). When day 3 started I had gotten more suspicious on Keith, partly by combining Mido's suspicions with my own. Mido also revoted on day 3, and eventually the Keith lynch had succeeded. We had killed our first Cultist.

We know for a fact that Keith was recruited into the Cult on either night 1 or night 2. However, according to my little theory, the Cult Leader must have recruited Keith on night 1 (which was before Keith had started being accused). I see no reason for the Cult Leader to have recruited Keith night 2 because of all the accusations he had received from both Mido and myself. If my theory is correct (which, logically, it should be), this means that Keith was a Cultist on both day 2 and day 3, which in turn would have given the Cult Leader reason to somehow protect his Cultist on both day 2 and day 3. This is why I have chosen to reread the posts from those two days in particular.

That being said, onto my humble analysis. Thareous and Big Octo were both quick to comment on the suspicions I shared. None of them wanted to choose a side at that point though. Although, Bocto stated in his post that "we have bigger fish to fry". That day ended with the baseless Violet lynch. I would like to know who you had in mind, Bocto, when you wrote that. Later on in the game Atticus was the first to question the Keith lynch. She did this in a very short post where she also asked to be updated on what had happened in the game (ALIT pointed this post out as "unnerving"). Atticus' absence in this game has bothered me to a small degree. She contributes less than usual, and she is almost impossible to read because of it. Anyway, after this Vergo appeared to strongly oppose the Keith lynch, saying that the suspicions on Keith were weak. Sure they may not have been the best, but they were probably stronger than any other suspicions we had had in the game up to that point. Were there even any suspicions at all involved in the Violet lynch on day 2? Thar also appeared later on, protecting Keith by saying that he thought that Keith's reaction was natural. While this could indeed have been his honest opinion, it is still interesting to me now that we know that Keith was with the Cult. Thereafter Vergo reappeared and kept on criticizing the Keith lynch (he thought the whole thing had started to stink). Bocto also returned to say that he understood why people were suspicious of Keith, but he swiftly changed the subject, which to me is not a good sign.

So, basically the players who I currently suspect for being the Cult Leader (or at least a Cultist) are, Bocto, Atticus, Vergo and Thar (order from most to least suspicious).

I have acknowledged JC's and Vergo's recent suspicions towards me. I just do not know how to reply to them due to the shape of the suspicions.

And for the record, personally I am still suspicious of Fig, therefore I am keeping my vote on him today.

 

[Fig]

On a side note.... A LOT of you people immediately jumped right after the "extension" was offered. Like, just mere moments after it. And the lack of activity since then today is very, very surprising after that. Just pop in, approve of the extension, and then pop right out. Maybe I'm a bit paranoid here, but I'm kind of uneasy about this.

Yes, I would like to apologize for not contributing as I had to go and help out the TexPREP staff earlier today but I'm here right now but I'm here now. I think the main reason why most people including myself didn't post with the extension is that really there wasn't anything, at least in my ways, that wasn't covered and I believe it would have been the same cycle that we are currently stuck on. This also due to how many players are playing this game and basically in general in mafia games as of late. The players that I have the most suspicions on are those that post for a few times to none, whether their post was in-depth or not, because it just seems they post just to post and then coincidentally post on the following day. Thus I think that Atts and Go_Dark are leaning non-town for me.

 

[Big Octo]

Although, Bocto stated in his post that "we have bigger fish to fry". That day ended with the baseless Violet lynch. I would like to know who you had in mind, Bocto, when you wrote that.

You know, now that I look back on it, I don't think I had exactly anything on the mind, but rather, I thought that what was going on between you and Keith at the time was a minor issue (which it, of course, turned out not to be) and that we might have better luck scumhunting elsewhere. Where? Well, Day 2 was a while ago so I don't remember exactly what I had in mind, lol. In hindsight, I shouldn't have taken what was going on between you and Keith lightly, but I couldn't have known then.

 

[DekuNut]

1) Not really sure what you mean by that.

2.) I thought Viral had put forth an incredibly likely idea that there’s at least one mafia member on the current Fig bandwagon, isolating either Pendio or Atticus. There’s been, quite literally, no conversation except me and JC about this, despite the mass approval for the extension directly following its suggestion.

Also, DekuNut, you hold a lot of power over who’s going to eventually be lynched today. Hearing your in-depth thoughts on the Fig bandwagon would be especially useful.

1) You asked if Keith was changed "last night" when he'd been lynched the day before.
2) I think that it is very likely that there is at least one scum on the wagon, and I understand your theories on both of them.
3) I'll get my thoughts together, all of them, for the Fig bandwagon now then.