General Modern Motion Controls, What Happened?

[JuicieJ]

Well there was one problem with SS that I didn't like. The cursor didn't have point and click mechanics like every other wii game. It was kind of like the sensor bar wasn't even utilized. While it wasn't a problem I still think the sensor bar should have been used.

That's because the Wii MotionPlus is independent of the sensor bar. Were it to rely on it, it wouldn't be capable of having the dynamic features it does.

 

[Spiritual Mask Salesman]

That's because the Wii MotionPlus is independent of the sensor bar. Were it to rely on it, it wouldn't be capable of having the dynamic features it does.

Really, I didn't know that.

 

[mαrkαsscoρ]

so the definition of flawless ties into skyward sword how again?

 

[Farore's Chosen]

so the definition of flawless ties into skyward sword how again?

In the dreams of the developers...and in the dreams of the rest of us who have to suffer with crappy control problems

 

[JuicieJ]

so the definition of flawless ties into skyward sword how again?

The functionality of the Wii MotionPlus controls. The game itself is far from flawless.

 

[Iridescence]

Motion controls were just not meant for Zelda. Aunoma released a detailed 10-page report on the development of Twilight Princess and his biggest obstacle was getting the motion controls to be intuitive. Just because motion controls work for Wii Sports, doesn't mean they will work for an action-adventure game. Miyamoto fell in love with his idea, plain and simple, and forced it on Zelda.

 

[Spiritual Mask Salesman]

Motion controls were just not meant for Zelda. Aunoma released a detailed 10-page report on the development of Twilight Princess and his biggest obstacle was getting the motion controls to be intuitive. Just because motion controls work for Wii Sports, doesn't mean they will work for an action-adventure game. Miyamoto fell in love with his idea, plain and simple, and forced it on Zelda.

Well motion controls did add a bit to the game, just not as much as we all expected I think. Like I said when I wrote this thread, I also think that motion controls were a fad, just like the whole touch screen thing is sort of a fad right now, people move on, everybody is looking for the next new thing. Touch screen controls implemented into a home console hasn't served nintendo well so far, the next new thing is something old, button controls are just becoming more dominate again.

If you look at the Xbox one and the Playstation 4 they both have one thing in common, the hard core games made for those consoles have stuck to button controls through everything. This seems to appeal to the general public because those consoles are outselling the Wii U, those consoles must be doing something right. What does this mean for nintendo? Maybe they need to cut the gimmicks in the future, it seems to serve other companies well.

 

[Riddle]

I'm still stuck at the part where you have to gather music notes under water.

 

[JuicieJ]

Motion controls were just not meant for Zelda. Aunoma released a detailed 10-page report on the development of Twilight Princess and his biggest obstacle was getting the motion controls to be intuitive.

That's a pretty bad example. Twilight Princess wasn't DESIGNED for motion, so naturally it would be difficult to make it adapt properly. He was also very proud of the Wii MotionPlus controls in Skyward Sword.

 

[DarkestLink]

I'm going to have to side with JuicieJ on this one. Whatever you thought of SS's controls, the Wii version of TP was a port and wasn't made for motion controls.

 

[Spiritual Mask Salesman]

I'm going to have to side with JuicieJ on this one. Whatever you thought of SS's controls, the Wii version of TP was a port and wasn't made for motion controls.

Yep TP was orginally made for gamecube, but it also got adapted for Wii towards the end of its production.

 

[Farore's Chosen]

I'm going to have to side with JuicieJ on this one. Whatever you thought of SS's controls, the Wii version of TP was a port and wasn't made for motion controls.

So? TP controls worked very well whereas SS controls don't, I know which way I want the sword to move, I shouldn't hafta recalibrate because I moved, I shouldn't hafta hold my arm and wrist at a painful position to work the stinkin beetle and don't get me started on Link's fancy dolphin tricks when he needs to jump over a barrier in the water. They're Clunky controls and they are forced on the player when they shouldn't have been, SS controls do not complement the gameplay. They are an exercise in frustration.

 

[Évariste]

I thought the WM+ controls for Skyward Sword were very well done. I agree wholly with those saying that sword attack errors are caused almost wholly by player error. I would get frustrated at the game sometimes, but it was a good kind of frustration that I deal with when trying to adapt to something. I think, in general, that player error is part of the game and should not be considered as detracting from the game's quality.

On the other hand, while this kind of frustration is good, it doesn't feel as much like "Zelda" to me if I am struggling even a little to perform basic movements like running, jumping, sword-swinging, and shooting. While I really enjoy the gameplay in Skyward Sword, I feel the focus on part of the developers and on part of the player is no longer 100% exploration/thinking/NPC-interaction and 0% movement, but rather 60% exploration/thinking/NPC-interaction and 40% movement. For Zelda, I would rather see the innovation be more focused on how to emphasize the exploration/interaction aspects in different ways (e.g. 3-day system in Majora's Mask).

Well motion controls did add a bit to the game, just not as much as we all expected I think. Like I said when I wrote this thread, I also think that motion controls were a fad, just like the whole touch screen thing is sort of a fad right now, people move on, everybody is looking for the next new thing. Touch screen controls implemented into a home console hasn't served nintendo well so far, the next new thing is something old, button controls are just becoming more dominate again.

If you look at the Xbox one and the Playstation 4 they both have one thing in common, the hard core games made for those consoles have stuck to button controls through everything. This seems to appeal to the general public because those consoles are outselling the Wii U, those consoles must be doing something right. What does this mean for nintendo? Maybe they need to cut the gimmicks in the future, it seems to serve other companies well.

I'm not so sure if motion controls are a fad. No one is really pushing motion controls like the Wii did: Wii U's message is more power than the Wii and Gamepad, One has Kinect but Kinect's potential use in gaming is limited, and PS4 has no serious effort in motion controls. How do you know no one wants motion controls in games when there are few opportunities to gauge their popularity?

 

[JuicieJ]

So? TP controls worked very well whereas SS controls don't, I know which way I want the sword to move, I shouldn't hafta recalibrate because I moved, I shouldn't hafta hold my arm and wrist at a painful position to work the stinkin beetle and don't get me started on Link's fancy dolphin tricks when he needs to jump over a barrier in the water. They're Clunky controls and they are forced on the player when they shouldn't have been, SS controls do not complement the gameplay. They are an exercise in frustration.

I find it incredible that I'm actually posting these videos again in the same thread.

[video=youtube;QEge_2Vuft0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QEge_2Vuft0[/video]
[video=youtube;p_aGjL1bwN0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_aGjL1bwN0[/video]

As you can see, the controls work just fine.

On the other hand, while this kind of frustration is good, it doesn't feel as much like "Zelda" to me if I am struggling even a little to perform basic movements like running, jumping, sword-swinging, and shooting. While I really enjoy the gameplay in Skyward Sword, I feel the focus on part of the developers and on part of the player is no longer 100% exploration/thinking/NPC-interaction and 0% movement, but rather 60% exploration/thinking/NPC-interaction and 40% movement. For Zelda, I would rather see the innovation be more focused on how to emphasize the exploration/interaction aspects in different ways (e.g. 3-day system in Majora's Mask).

It's funny, though. Aonuma actually wanted Skyward Sword to be more like this new Zelda in terms of open-ended exploration, but the team wound up not being able to do that, and I'm willing to bet that it was because of the Wii MotionPlus. I don't blame this on the developers or the tech, though -- I blame it on the fact that Nintendo didn't launch the Wii WITH the WM+ tech. Had they done that, Aonuma and crew would have been much more familiar with it, and therefore would have been able to construct the game he wanted.

Regardless, he's finally able to try and recapture the spirit of the older games, and he's also out on a mission to break away from Zelda's normal conventions, so I'm sure we'll see the kind of things you're asking for -- even if the WM+ returns (which I think it will), as they've already gotten the hang of that with the release of SS.

 

[DarkestLink]

I find it incredible that I'm actually posting these videos again in the same thread.

In this case though, he doesn't seem to be arguing about the accuracy, but more so the position he has to hold the control to make it accurate.