The Zora Race vs. Hyrule

[Link Floyd]

Recently I watched a video where they discussed the relationship between the Zoras and the other races of Hyrule in each timeline split. The video explained how in the downfall timeline, the Zora's are very hostile towards others while in the other timelines they're very friendly.

I noticed in Breath of the Wild the Zora's seem to be wary of Hylians (mainly the older ones it seems). I was wondering how they became hostile in the first place.

It is explained why they are cautious of Hylians in Botw, but why are they enemies in the downfall timeline games? Are they being controlled by Ganon? Or maybe they're just a different species of Zora and have no relation to the friendly Zoras from OoT at all?

What do you think?

 

[Spirit]

Recently I watched a video where they discussed the relationship between the Zoras and the other races of Hyrule in each timeline split. The video explained how in the downfall timeline, the Zora's are very hostile towards others while in the other timelines they're very friendly.

I noticed in Breath of the Wild the Zora's seem to be wary of Hylians (mainly the older ones it seems). I was wondering how they became hostile in the first place.

It is explained why they are cautious of Hylians in Botw, but why are they enemies in the downfall timeline games? Are they being controlled by Ganon? Or maybe they're just a different species of Zora and have no relation to the friendly Zoras from OoT at all?

What do you think?

I read some translations from the Hyrule Encyclopedia very recently. The info was vague but it mentions that after OoT splits into the Decline Timeline the Zoras go berserk and become wild. There are some Zoras (mostly royalty) who try to reunify the race but it doesnt go well and the majority of the race end up becoming feral.

Not sure the reason. I guess its because the land is in turmoil a lot in that branch.

 

[DragonEleven]

I think the name 'Zora' is actually more of a classification, rather than the name of a specific species, with the River Zora and Sea Zora not actually being directly related to one another (I think the 'Zoran Rito' of WW and 'Avian Rito' of BotW may be another example of this concept).
Sea Zora would be the friendly ones you are referring to, which have appeared in all three timelines (although very little in the downfall timeline), and are always seen to be friendly.
River Zora would be the hostile ones you're referring to, which actually make an appearance in the child timeline in addition to the downfall timeline... but as Spirit mentioned, not all of them are hostile... I think it may actually just be an instinctive response to attack anyone who seems like a threat, rather than intentionally wanting to harm Link, as they only seem to do this when in already dangerous areas.

 

[River Zora]

According to Hyrule Historia, released this year, the Sea Zora and River Zora are directly related to each other, the latter evolving from the former. It also reiterated that Rito evolved from Zora. So, yeah.

 

[DragonEleven]

According to Hyrule Historia, released this year, the Sea Zora and River Zora are directly related to each other, the latter evolving from the former. It also reiterated that Rito evolved from Zora. So, yeah.

Hyrule Historia was released over 5 years ago... I'm guessing you mean the Hyrule Encyclopedia.
What the encyclopedia actually says is still rather unclear without a proper translation, and I don't trust the fan translations you get floating around, as they often twist lines to match their own ideas, rather than stating it as it is.
What I can decipher of it for myself appears to group River Zora and Sea Zora together as the same race (share similar features, not necessarily directly related) not species, with the 'Zoran Rito' having evolved from that race (it doesn't contain any information about BotW, hence why there is no mention of the 'Avian Rito')... while also talking about the division of River Zora into their regular (green) variety, and the animalistic (blue) variety within the downfall timeline.

 

[River Zora]

Aye, I meant Encyclopaedia.

Well the 'Avian Rito' as you call them share Medli in their history and also have the same theme tune as the 'Zoran Rito' (Dragon Roost Island theme) so I'd say intention as it stands is that they are one and the same.

 

[DragonEleven]

Well the 'Avian Rito' as you call them share Medli in their history and also have the same theme tune as the 'Zoran Rito' (Dragon Roost Island theme) so I'd say intention as it stands is that they are one and the same.

I haven't been to the Rito in my game yet, but I hadn't heard any mention of Medli being referred to by name, only the assumption that she was the namesake of Vah Medoh, which would more likely be a nod to the character by the developers, rather than part of the lore of the series.
But even if the name is mentioned, I doubt it would be referring to the same character, as that would essentially confirm BotW as being in the existing adult timeline, which I believe everyone has accepted as being impossible.
And the theme tune could be considered representative of the race, not the individual species.

 

[River Zora]

"Everyone has accepted as being impossible" - AT is perhaps the most popular placement I've seen amongst ZU and GameFAQs. A very vocal CT minority, but in terms of actual evidence, the AT seems to have the bulk of it.
>Rock Salt being found everywhere with the comment 'left over from the ancient sea'
>Rito and Koroks being around
>No reference to the Triforce, only a magic golden power in the Princess' blood a la PH and ST
>References in Zora's domain to the AT/DT sages and the Hero of Time's success against Ganon and sealing him
>Darunia, Medli, Nabooru and Ruto with divine Beast namesakes.

I reckon a 'Dragon Break' is most likely, but certainly it's not 'impossible' for the AT. It's not 'impossible' for any of the lines.

 

[DragonEleven]

We know that there was an ancient sea from SS.
Rito are far too different to be the same ones from WW, and Koroks can appear in any timeline.
Other games have featured the Triforce without referring to it by name in other timelines... TP for example... but Zelda's 'golden power' is clearly what remains of her power as Hylia, which exists in every timeline (the fact that she bathes in the springs in an attempt to active this power, akin to SS is evidence of this).
The references to Ruto only debunk the child timeline theory, they don't specifically support the existing adult timeline... and there's no mention of the Hero of Time succeeding, only that he fought Ganon and then Ganon was sealed away, which happened in both DT and AT... it doesn't say he survived.
Darunia, Nabooru, and Ruto are the same as my last point, and as far as I'm aware, Medli being Vah Medoh's namesake is only an assumption, and isn't stated in game.

Plus, there's the fact that the Zora essentially went extinct when they became the Rito.
Hyrule was washed away at the end of WW, so there wouldn't be as many remains from OoT and earlier games as we're seeing.
After settling in New Hyrule, there would have been no reason for them to move the entire kingdom back to the old Hyrule.
And there's no evidence of New Hyrule in BotW (no mention of it, and no sign of steam trains).

To be clear... I have been saying 'existing adult timeline' for a reason... there's evidence for and against all of the existing timelines, so I don't think it's any of them... I think it's a new timeline, most likely splitting off at the start of the adult timeline.

 

[River Zora]

Who's to say this is old Hyrule? This land could be New Hyrule, 10,000 years into the future. Landmarks and geographic features are seldom important in the game - and if we are to consider them, it's as close to New Hyrule as old. It has an Icy mountain range in the top left, a volcano in the top right, references to an ancient technologically advanced Hyrule.

And Darunia isn't mentioned by name. But Medoh is literally the first two syllables of Medli in Japanese. To say that the Rito beast is the only one not linked to the Rito sage is ridiculous.

In addition, we know the River Zora evolved from Hyrule's Zoras whilst the old style Zora carried on fine in Labrynna. There is precedent therefore for this happening here. Hyrule's Zoras became Rito, whilst other Zora living elsewhere (say, Labrynna) continued.

There is no reference to the Hero of Time in any DT game, whether released before or after OoT. There are whole islands dedicated to his memory and keeping his clothes alive for every boy as they reach age on the AT.

And yes, in SS there was an ancient sea in the desert. But Rock Salt found all the way up to the base of Death Mountain?

And the Gerudo's design changed too - originally key GErudo features were round ears and yellow eyes. Now they're pointy eared and green eyed. The design of everything's changed - Bokoblins, Moblins etc. and they're still the same beasts.

They are called Rito. They have Dragon Roost Island as their theme. Their beast is named after Medli.

These ARE Rito. And Rito are evolved Zoras.

They COULD be something else, but at the moment that's just speculation and fanfic.

 

[el :BeoWolf:]

I'm pretty certain BotW isn't in the AT. Aonuma said it takes place after OoT, in a timeline where Ganon has appeared multiple times. This pretty much rules out the AT, and points to the DT. Personally I'm still hoping for a CT placement.

 

[River Zora]

Aonuma has said a lot of things. He also said TFH wasn't in the timeline at all!

 

[River Zora]

Besides, CT Ganon attacks- two. TP and FSA.
DT Ganon attacks- three. OoT, aLttP, LoZ. Plus one failed resurrection (OoX) and one Yuga Ganon (aLBW)
AT Ganon attacks- three. OoT, tWW backstory, tWW.

 

[DragonEleven]

BotW also adds an additional two past attacks to whichever timeline it's in... one 10,000 years before BotW, and one 100 years before BotW... so what Aonuma said is technically true from that alone.

 

[River Zora]

Perzackerly.

Also I'm more and more convinced that his nudge wink "lots of times" means actually "all of the times" #dragonbreak