General Zelda Removing Heart Containes

[Justac00lguy]

Now just to clear up any confusion here, heart containers are the item that we typically obtain after the completion of a dungeon. I'm not saying that we get rid of the current life system, just the appearance of Heart containers within dungeons.

Heart Containers/Pieces are the source of Link's health and life in a Zelda game, they have been apparent in some shape or form within all the canon installments and is one of the most noticeable staples. It's a pretty effective system however I wanted discuss something within the current system itself.

Now each game is different in its own right but the way we obtain both heart containers and heart pieces is rather similar. You will start of with the typical three heart containers and as you advance through specific you get a heart container, therefore raising Link's life and the duration of damage he can withstand. However we also gave heart pieces, these are usually scattered throughout the world or are gifted to Link by completing a certain quest/mini-game. It typically takes a total of four heart pieces to complete a full heart container so their importance is slightly less significant than "A" heart container.

Now as we advance through the game not only do we get more experienced but we also gain more items, upgrades as well as heart containers, as these are staples within dungeons. Now on average we have around 6-8 dungeons within each game and, most of the time, these gift Link with an extra heart container. So essentially as the game is meant to follow a difficulty curvehthe, the game is actually getting easier as we are just being handed heart containers for simply progressing.

Now what I essentially want to do here is take out heart containers completely or in a lighter way, take them out of compulsory dungeons. This would mean that us, the player, would have to work harder or go out of the way in order upgrade Link's life capacity and generally it could raise difficulty as well as more emphasis and motives of exploration. So how do you feel about this idea? Do you think it could be welcomed or do you like the current system?

 

[Mercedes]

It could work and encouraging players to travel and find them would be fun but there's a problem I think, with having an increase in hearts being completely optional. The main problem being, with how Zelda works right now, when you get to a certain dungeon, the game expects you to have a certain amount of heart containers already. So, it can be a bit harder knowing you're a bit tougher, with all your hearts and items. If the finding of additional heart containers was a completely optional activity that could be done, every dungeon would have to cater for players only having the default heart counter amount, which would be more than you'd think. So, they'd either have to make the enemies quite easy so as not to just kill you quickly, and this would make anyone who does find lots of heart containers too powerful to really be hurt, or, they'd be too hard. And not every player will go out and search for hearts.

I'd rather them stick to how current heart containers work, or, at least have them very easily accessible in the main dungeons of the game. Keeping them quite hidden off in the side-missions of the game could upset the balance and the difficulty curve.

 

[Salem]

I was gonna sugest something similar to this, I like the idea.

I sugest the game have something like 8 dungeons before the final one, you get one full heart container for every two dungeons completed, so you have about 7 hearts for the final dungeons instead of 11, that is assuming you didn't get any optional heart pieces

It could work and encouraging players to travel and find them would be fun but there's a problem I think, with having an increase in hearts being completely optional. The main problem being, with how Zelda works right now, when you get to a certain dungeon, the game expects you to have a certain amount of heart containers already. So, it can be a bit harder knowing you're a bit tougher, with all your hearts and items. If the finding of additional heart containers was a completely optional activity that could be done, every dungeon would have to cater for players only having the default heart counter amount, which would be more than you'd think. So, they'd either have to make the enemies quite easy so as not to just kill you quickly, and this would make anyone who does find lots of heart containers too powerful to really be hurt, or, they'd be too hard. And not every player will go out and search for hearts.

I'd rather them stick to how current heart containers work, or, at least have them very easily accessible in the main dungeons of the game. Keeping them quite hidden off in the side-missions of the game could upset the balance and the difficulty curve.

Well, it would be more like the game would be designed around having fewer max hearts.

 

[Spirit]

I dont do sidequests or heart piece collecting unless i really need to (which is rarely ever) or not until after i have completed the game itself, so getting heart containers after dungeon bosses are the only times i can upgrade Link's health at all so i'd like them to stay. Also they're optional anyway you don't need to pick them up in the 3D games so i think theyre pretty harmless whether theyre in or not since we have the choice.

 

[Ventus]

I love this idea a lot, really tells the player to go out and search for things instead of just plowing through the mainquest knowing they'll have either enough or too much health to the point where they're going to win. People will shout "wel lwhy don't you just skip the heart containers, do a 3 heart run" but I say, Link's physical capacities should not increase at the end of each dungeon; ideally he would be weakened after defeating a boss and no quick fix would exist for that. :I

 

[Skittles]

It might be interesting...but I think if it were done, we should get more heats at the beginning because some harder enemies take away like two hearts. Though, I guess making us look for heart containers also might encourages the creators to add more interesting side quests (like in MM) and other things so that we might find the experience of collecting just as thrilling as beating the dungeons. Now, that would be pretty cool, it might, in the end, be a win-win for both players and developers... ;P

 

[HylianHero]

I would love to have a game with only heart containers, where the heart containers not in main dungeons would be in optional side-dungeons that would have their own bosses and everything.

 

[Ventus]

It might be interesting...but I think if it were done, we should get more heats at the beginning because some harder enemies take away like two hearts.

This is exactly what I do not want to happen. No offense to anyone, and I'm not saying my experience was the same as yours, but the whole increased health thing that Skyward Sword offered felt like the devs were just dumbing the game down. I'm a Zelda veteran since Ocarina of Time days (so, like 15ish years), so I can take preemptive measures against a majority of puzzles and foes in the series. I personally do not like having more health than I need in most games; I like being challenged throughout areas. Adding more health at the start just makes it seem like the game is easier even if damage ratios are dead even with normal heart container counts. So...meh, IDK.

Remove heart containers but DO NOT add more hearts at start is my way.

 

[Skittles]

This is exactly what I do not want to happen. No offense to anyone, and I'm not saying my experience was the same as yours, but the whole increased health thing that Skyward Sword offered felt like the devs were just dumbing the game down. I'm a Zelda veteran since Ocarina of Time days (so, like 15ish years), so I can take preemptive measures against a majority of puzzles and foes in the series. I personally do not like having more health than I need in most games; I like being challenged throughout areas. Adding more health at the start just makes it seem like the game is easier even if damage ratios are dead even with normal heart container counts. So...meh, IDK.

Remove heart containers but DO NOT add more hearts at start is my way.

How about a compromise? You can choose to start with anywhere from 5 to 3 hearts (for example) and still can collect (then combined) up to 15 full heart containers in the game. It might not be perfect (and listen, I've played Zelda since I was a little kid to, back on OoT), but the games have to be somewhat accessible to new players as well as the old... Perhaps, if you really want something fun and hard you can have Hero's Mode right away with just three hearts. Demise kills you in one swing. xD

 

[Ventus]

How about a compromise? You can choose to start with anywhere from 5 to 3 hearts (for example) and still can collect (then combined) up to 15 full heart containers in the game. It might not be perfect (and listen, I've played Zelda since I was a little kid to, back on OoT), but the games have to be somewhat accessible to new players as well as the old... Perhaps, if you really want something fun and hard you can have Hero's Mode right away with just three hearts. Demise kills you in one swing. xD

Oh definitely. I like this compromise; it's essentially a difficulty mode in and of itself. :yes:

Great suggestion

 

[Moo22]

I say, Link's physical capacities should not increase at the end of each dungeon; ideally he would be weakened after defeating a boss and no quick fix would exist for that. :I

This!

I would love to have a game with only heart containers, where the heart containers not in main dungeons would be in optional side-dungeons that would have their own bosses and everything.

And definitly this, I've never really been a fan of heart pieces, there's so many of the things that when collecting them I feel "oh another token heart piece" and it's easy to over power Links health. I enjoyed collecting containers in the first two games when they were in the overworld and they didn't seem easy to come by, plus with those games difficulty level it was very satisfying collecting a new container.

I love the idea of them having their own minidungeons it would add heaps more to a game :yes:

 

[ScouseOctorok]

It would have to be a mighty big game to encompass multiple mini-bosses, side-quests, mini-dungeons, etc. I could imagine with the time frame allowed for Zelda games that adopting this idea might possibly take away a lot from the gameplay, storyline, etc. A couple of posts talked about being able to set how many heart containers you start with and that, to me, is absolutely absurd. No Zelda game before has had any sort of difficulty setting, why start now, 25+ years into the series? These games are always going to come easier to some people rather than others, that's something I've seen posted many many times throughout my short stay here on ZD. I don't think completely overhauling the health system is necessary for any future Zelda titles. New story, new weapons, new villains, even new main characters, yes. Basic Zelda tradition? A big N-O for me.