New timeline dropped

[Bowsette Plus-Ultra]

In the far distant future of A Link to the Past, per the countless accounts of Aonuma and Fujibayashi of Breath of the Wild taking place at the end of the timeline.

So you have to cite an outside source or developer interviews to point out where the game stands chronologically, since neither game gives any indication on their own.

 

[Somasoa]

So you have to cite an outside source or developer interviews to point out where the game stands chronologically, since neither game gives any indication on their own.

I mean, sure, there’s a lot ingame pointing to it being in the far flung future of Hyrule. See the state of Calamity Ganon, see the Ruto tablet explicitly staring the events of Ocarina of Time are in the distant past even before even the Calamity of 10,000 years ago, see the amiibo gear going all the way to the Tunic of the Hero placing itself in the past (not that they’re all necessarily from that specific world, mind you, but that the tunic and the legend it’s associated with are associated the distant past), see the references to ancient Hylian abilities that no longer exist made by Yunobo, see the Master Sword being in the same location as in A Link to the Past/A Link Between Worlds directly west of Death Mountain, so on and so forth. It’s just easier to describe how the developers show their intentions.

 

[mαrkαsscoρ]

I and others have openly discussed in comments in this thread how the “official” timeline was put together by fans and has nothing to do with Zelda Team’s actual opinion in regard to the timeline. This is why A Link Between Worlds - literally the first new game after the Hyrule Historia released - ignored the modified account of Ocarina of Time and A Link to the Past’s backstory and instead continues using the original A Link to the Past backstory as described in A Link to the Past’s manual.

Furthermore, as this was not picked up on by the Hyrule Historia staff, the game and the Japanese website explicitly reveal that Four Swords Adventures is a direct sequel to Four Swords with the same Link. Hence why the FSA intro describes the FSA Link and Zelda as the same cast as the characters from FS.

but this is the thing though, sometimes the chronology within the games is unclear, on gamecube you had 3 zelda games w/ no relation to each other, but they relate to the game on the previous gen console

also in regards to FSA...you're saying the official timeline on 3 times still got it's placement wrong? and nintendo still endorsed it?

 

[Bowsette Plus-Ultra]

I mean, sure, there’s a lot ingame pointing to it being in the far flung future of Hyrule. See the state of Calamity Ganon, see the Ruto tablet explicitly staring the events of Ocarina of Time are in the distant past even before even the Calamity of 10,000 years ago, see the amiibo gear going all the way to the Tunic of the Hero placing itself in the past (not that they’re all necessarily from that specific world, mind you, but that the tunic and the legend it’s associated with are associated the distant past), see the references to ancient Hylian abilities that no longer exist made by Yunobo, see the Master Sword being in the same location as in A Link to the Past/A Link Between Worlds directly west of Death Mountain, so on and so forth. It’s just easier to describe how the developers show their intentions.

There is nothing outside of anachronistic amiibo items indicating such. This is a game that can't even get the timeline of the Zonai in line with the Hyrule of Skyward Sword and Ocarina of Time. It's a connection so flimsy that you just have to pretend the Rito were all hiding in a closet somewhere during the events of OoT.

Meanwhile in Baldur's Gate...

 

[Somasoa]

but this is the thing though, sometimes the chronology within the games is unclear, on gamecube you had 3 zelda games w/ no relation to each other, but they relate to the game on the previous gen console

also in regards to FSA...you're saying the official timeline on 3 times still got it's placement wrong? and nintendo still endorsed it?

Whether they relate to games on the same console or not is ultimately irrelevant. I assume you don’t feel this way about Path of Radiance and Radiant Dawn, and the other Fire Emblem games that do this, for example, per your profile picture.

Yes, the marketing team that commissioned a book from a team of fans that Aonuma has openly stated his desire to ignore has gotten it wrong.

 

[Somasoa]

There is nothing outside of anachronistic amiibo items indicating such. This is a game that can't even get the timeline of the Zonai in line with the Hyrule of Skyward Sword and Ocarina of Time. It's a connection so flimsy that you just have to pretend the Rito were all hiding in a closet somewhere during the events of OoT.

Meanwhile in Baldur's Gate...

If only Fujibayashi openly acknowledged Refounding in an interview. Also, your response is why I made the safe judgment that you wouldn’t care about ingame evidence and instead opted to use developer references.

 

[Bowsette Plus-Ultra]

If only Fujibayashi openly acknowledged Refounding in an interview.

If only the games could acknowledge any of that.

 

[Somasoa]

If only the games could acknowledge any of that.

The Zonai sealed away the Evil Spirit armor in the distant past, meaning that Ganondorf predated them. They also had ancient armor associated with the Heroes. The Refounding theory literally exists because it’s painfully obvious that it’s not the original founding of Hyrule.

 

[Bowsette Plus-Ultra]

The Zonai sealed away the Evil Spirit armor in the distant past, meaning that Ganondorf predated them. They also had ancient armor associated with the Heroes. The Refounding theory literally exists because it’s painfully obvious that it’s not the original founding of Hyrule.

And yet that inherently means little, because TotK just outright contradicts Ocarina of Time and Skyward Sword with its existing species. To say, "Actually, they renewed their kingdom vows," isn't supporting anything, it's trying to write around bad and contradictory lore.

 

[mαrkαsscoρ]

Whether they relate to games on the same console or not is ultimately irrelevant. I assume you don’t feel this way about Path of Radiance and Radiant Dawn, and the other Fire Emblem games that do this, for example, per your profile picture.

Yes, the marketing team that commissioned a book from a team of fans that Aonuma has openly stated his desire to ignore has gotten it wrong.

I kinda sorta do feel that way about the 3ds FE's actually but it's not quite the same, but also I mean more like you need to do some digging to figure out where the gamecube games fit in relation to another, you'd have no real clue otherwise by the games themselves

that is extremely embarrassing if so, I'd have to look at the intro again b/c I don't recall it suggesting they were the same, but how was it worded on the japanese site?

 

[Somasoa]

And yet that inherently means little, because TotK just outright contradicts Ocarina of Time and Skyward Sword with its existing species. To say, "Actually, they renewed their kingdom vows," isn't supporting anything, it's trying to write around bad and contradictory lore.

Do you even understand the point of Refounding? The point is Hyrule collapsed and fell after the furthest point in the timeline before the Zonai era, which doesn’t remotely contradict with its races. This is just outright a necessity for the story to make sense, and your failure of the observation of this again is not an excuse to attack the story.

 

[Bowsette Plus-Ultra]

Do you even understand the point of Refounding? The point is Hyrule collapsed and fell after the furthest point in the timeline before the Zonai era, which doesn’t remotely contradict with its races. This is just outright a necessity for the story to make sense, and your failure of the observation of this again is not an excuse to attack the story.

A thing we never see on screen, has never been implied to happen, and that fans made up to justify the overwhelming incompatibility of TotK with the events of OoT and SS? Yes, I understand the point of it.

 

[Somasoa]

I kinda sorta do feel that way about the 3ds FE's actually but it's not quite the same, but also I mean more like you need to do some digging to figure out where the gamecube games fit in relation to another, you'd have no real clue otherwise by the games themselves

that is extremely embarrassing if so, I'd have to look at the intro again b/c I don't recall it suggesting they were the same, but how was it worded on the japanese site?

It truly isn’t surprising, see the Valentia Accordion and the Mario Encyclopedia also making **** up that doesn’t make sense. The website and the intro feature the same dialogue and in fact the website even uses Four Swords Adventures art to depict the events of Four Swords.

A thing we never see on screen

I just gave you explicit examples of reasons that people noticed and determined that it clearly could not be the original founding of Hyrule, and it extends far beyond just the examples I’ve provided; see Hylians existing at the founding of Hyrule which contradicts Twilight Princess‘s account for the founding of Hyrule, for example. There’s also nobody who explicitly says in Spirit Tracks “Hey, we’re in a new Hyrule and the old one is gone!” They don't have to do this because it’s obvious and the observant player should be able to pick up on this without having it spoonfed to them.

has never been implied to happen

Fujibayashi literally discussed it.

fans made up

Like Hyrule Historia? Not sure why it’s given any credibility here then to be blunt.

I understand the dispassionate timeline hating vibe is kind of your thing, but the fact you’re just actively choosing to talk past me and regurgitate your previous points is telling.

 

[Bowsette Plus-Ultra]

I just gave you explicit examples of reasons that people noticed and determined that it clearly could not be the original founding of Hyrule, and it extends far beyond just the examples I’ve provided; see Hylians existing at the founding of Hyrule which contradicts Twilight Princess‘s account for the founding of Hyrule, for example. There’s also nobody who explicitly says in Spirit Tracks “Hey, we’re in a new Hyrule and the old one is gone!” They don't have to do this because it’s obvious and the observant player should be able to pick up on this without having it spoonfed to them.

Fujibayashi literally discussed it.

Like Hyrule Historia? Not sure why it’s given any credibility here then to be blunt.

I understand the dispassionate timeline hating vibe is kind of your thing, but the fact you’re just actively choosing to talk past me and regurgitate your previous points is telling.

Has never been suggested or even implied to happen in game. There is nothing in game suggesting that Hyrule fell off screen and then renewed its wedding vows. If you have to use interviews to clarify key pieces of your 40 year old franchise's lore then there's a good chance your lore sucks.

And no, not like Hyrule Historia. Nintendo, like it or not, gave the go ahead to those source books. They, with all their editorial oversight, offered their stamp of approval. You can't publish something like the Zelda sourcebooks and then say, "Wait! I takes backs!"

 

[Somasoa]

Has never been suggested or even implied to happen in game. There is nothing in game suggesting that Hyrule fell off screen and then renewed its wedding vows. If you have to use interviews to clarify key pieces of your 40 year old franchise's lore then there's a good chance your lore sucks.

It’s like talking to a wall, frankly. If something is so blatantly necessary to the point the story only makes sense with it as an occurrence, and the director of the game also acknowledges it, it’s literally just an active grudge for the sake of being a pessimist to avoid the obvious. I’m sorry Zelda hurt you or whatever, but it’s kind of amazing to see these attempts at ignoring clearly unknown information.