Goddess of Time

[XTC]

Well, I feel as if topic has shifted. How can we use what we have just discussed to bring back the original theme of the thread. The Goddess of Time. For her to have control over time and how it ebbs and flows she would have to be a deity that is not proclaimed by the people of Hyrule or of Termina but a goddess already before people existed. An interesting thing is that Zelda in MM is still in Hyrule and link goes to Termina (regardless of how he got there, walked, magic rabbit-hole etc.) Zelda speaks of the Goddess watching over you. Since you're in Termina the deity must be able to reach both locations while still being a proper Goddess (meaning she existed before humans and wasn't declared a God or Goddess by humans.) In my mind this makes me thing that Termina couldn't be part of a separate dimension as, sometimes, it is referred to be.

 

[T Edoc]

Common mistake. The Triforce will not have four pieces.

Of course, the name TRIFORCE comes from the original game, in which there were only two triforces...so the name probably refers to the number of egdes a triforce has.
Plus, I'm sure every of you already seen at least a shield with a golden triangle pointing down. Such triangle can be found on the main shield in the games of half the series : ALttP, LA, OoT, OoS, OoA, TP, ST, SS

I think it is Zelda, we have a seventh sage, right? Zelda, who is probably the sage of time (I don't think it is stated) now what they think is a goddess is really the triforce of wisdom, the light force (Or whatever it is Zelda has in Minish Cap) and Zelda combined to make something which just seems to have the powers of a goddess.

You're bringing some interresting points. And when you're talking of the Light Force (Minish Cap), isn't that a lone golden triangle? Hasn't it came from the Sky, along with a violet-hilt sword (Picori Blade)? I'm just saying what lots of people think. There are evidences of the existence of some sort of 4th triforce, and that the Picori Blade and Master Sword are somehow similar.
Speaking of the Master Sword, didn't :
''the people of Hyrule forged a sword resistant to magic which could repulse even powers granted by the Triforce.'' (A Link to the Past manual, pg. 5)

Something which could repulse powers granted by the Triforce? Very strong. What could it be? Where does the power of the Master Sword comes from? ...that little trianglish golden jewel?...

Please remember that the oracless are not Goddesses, they are just using the same names, Nayru was the Oracle of Ages (OoA) but there is nothing about the goddesses in that game (I think)

Indeed.

My idea is that there was a fourth goddess, who did not participate in the creation of Hyrule. Let's call her Goddess of Light or Goddess of Time.
It's likely that she is related to the fourth 'triforce', and that this triforce somehow got in the Master Sword hilt. That would explain why there is a 4th province protected by a 4th light spirit in Twilight Princess ('Ordonna' in english, but it's 'Latoan' in both japanese and french).
Don't forget that sword can face the power of A or THE triforce, what can be seen in OoT, ALttP and TP.

The Goddess of Time is called upon often by Termanian people's to save them and bring good harvest.

Hey, I got it! Link felt into a hole to go to Termina! A hole, like in the middle of the Triforce! ;-D (just kidding)
But you're right, she is mentionned several times through the game. :-)

 

[Vattible]

Anyone heard of the Tetraforce? I didn't think of it, I've heard of it though! We all know Nayru, Faroe, and Din right? Some people think that the hole in the middle represents The goddess of Gerudo, or the goddess of time(as you've said). They got it (I think) as a lot of people have said, the upside-down triangle on the OoT Hylian shield. Yes, it should just be called the triforce because tri points torwards triangular (I'm pretty sure).

 

[Pinecove]

Also I want to point out that in MM when you are in Skull Kid chamber there is a Triforce with a triangle under it and no ToP. So does this mean the goddes of time, only "works" in other dimmension cause MM, PH, OoX were in other worlds.

OoA and OoS do not take place in other worlds - they take place in other lands. Hyrule is even mentioned in the games.

Plus, I'm sure every of you already seen at least a shield with a golden triangle pointing down. Such triangle can be found on the main shield in the games of half the series : ALttP, LA, OoT, OoS, OoA, TP, ST, SS

TP nor SS nor ALttP feature no such Triangle.

Stop at 17 seconds for the SS shield

ST features a different sheild entirely (the Triangle represents a force gem).

TWW TMC and FS/FSA do not feature the Triangle. Nor does PH.

And just for reference, if you're using that as proof, that must mean judging from the OoS and OoA shields there must be a pentaforce:

Speaking of the Master Sword, didn't :
''the people of Hyrule forged a sword resistant to magic which could repulse even powers granted by the Triforce.'' (A Link to the Past manual, pg. 5)

Something which could repulse powers granted by the Triforce? Very strong. What could it be? Where does the power of the Master Sword comes from? ...that little trianglish golden jewel?...

Try the Japanese: It says no such thing about reppeling powers by the Triforce.
そこで、ハイラル人は神のお告げで、トライフォースをかどわかす魔を撃退する、退魔の剣を造り ました。
Accordingly, to repel an evil "kidnapping" of the Triforce, Hyrule's people were informed by a divine oracle to make an "expel-evil" sword.
それはマスターソードといわれ、真の勇者のみが使うことが出来るといわれていました。
That sword was called the Master Sword, and it was said that it could be used by (a person) with the faithful hero's values.

 

[T Edoc]

Oups, sorry, I confused for TP and SS. :-(
But OoT, ALttP, LA and Oracles do :
OoT
ALttP
LA
Oracles

(I don't know if there's a big reason why there are TWO pointing-down triangles, but they are there, and surely not just to make it pretty)

For ST, I know it looks like a force gem. But who knows what if it actualy is?
For the other games, I didn't say anything.

"However, it could not be assumed that only a good person would get their hands on the Triforce. For that reason, the people of Hyrule were told by the gods to make something that would repulse any evil that may kidnap the Triforce: the blade of evil's bane." (The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past (JP version) manual, pg. 7)

"The Sages first had to search for the existence of the Master Sword and a hero to use it." (The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past (JP version) manual, pg. 7)

I'm so sorry I don't have access to Japanese manual texts, but translations of it. :-/

 

[Satsy]

Someone earlier mentioned Din and Farore having other forces they control rather than just their power and courage (sand and wind respectively). In that case, as those are physical elements of the earth, Nayru would get water (which corresponds to her colour as well).

But considering that, think about how people, especially within the games, tend to describe time's passage. Ebbs. Flows. They refer to it in much the same way one would refer to water; time as a river in which we are just carried along (without mystical artefacts to shift us about). So though she's never directly referred to as a time Goddess (that I recall), it's reasonable to consider the power under her jurisdiction.

As for this talk of a fourth Goddess... There is no talk either way of a fourth Goddess, but that's what hurts the case. If there actually was a fourth Goddess that controls another element and also time, it would have been named by now. If not by Hylian prophecies, then by lands outside of Hyrule where she may well have disappeared to if she's taken her golden triangle with her*. When a new Goddess is fitted into the series officially, then the discussion will have true merit, but as it stands that hole, near as I can tell, is meant to be a hole, not a missing piece.



* Though to be fair if she had no true part of Hyrule's creation and didn't leave a sacred triangle at that mark, she may never have left one, so that hole would more than likely still remain a hole.

 

[Pinecove]

(I don't know if there's a big reason why there are TWO pointing-down triangles, but they are there, and surely not just to make it pretty)

For ST, I know it looks like a force gem. But who knows what if it actualy is?
For the other games, I didn't say anything.

If there are TWO pointy triangle wouldn't that mean it's a pentaforce? I'm sorry, but this is a REALLY stupid theory.
And for ST, no, it's a force gem. Occam's Razor. The simplest solution is always the best.

I'm so sorry I don't have access to Japanese manual texts, but translations of it. :-/

They are IN the theorist resources thread I've posted here that's stickied!

 

[The Shadow]

Lets see, my theory about Zelda being the forth Goddess seems pretty likely, even if there had of been a forth goddess she could have died and the Picori/Minish changed her dead body into the light force which then went into the Zeldas, a forth goddess explains why there are four giants.

 

[Non-Epic]

Probably another Goddess for Termina that Nintendo got out of nowhere.

 

[Pinecove]

Lets see, my theory about Zelda being the forth Goddess seems pretty likely, even if there had of been a forth goddess she could have died and the Picori/Minish changed her dead body into the light force which then went into the Zeldas, a forth goddess explains why there are four giants.

You lost me. Zelda is a sage, not a goddess. The giants are parallel to the light spirits in TP.

 

[T Edoc]

@Pinecove : I don't know for which reason but it seems like you hate me from the very first moment you knew my existence. It's a bit annoying and there's no way to have an intelligent talk in these circumstances. :-/
Okay, maybe the pointing down triangles just don't meant anything, either when there is one, either when there are two (even it that sounds odd...). But you can still be polite at me if I don't agree.

@The Shadow : You know, I think there is something with the Picori Sword being said to come from the sky with the Light Force and all. I think that Light Force could have something to do with some fourth Goddess. I just don't know how to fit all those details together yet. Hopefully the next game will bring new answers. :-)

 

[Djinn]

OoA and OoS do not take place in other worlds - they take place in other lands. Hyrule is even mentioned in the games.



TP nor SS nor ALttP feature no such Triangle.

Stop at 17 seconds for the SS shield

ST features a different sheild entirely (the Triangle represents a force gem).

TWW TMC and FS/FSA do not feature the Triangle. Nor does PH.

And just for reference, if you're using that as proof, that must mean judging from the OoS and OoA shields there must be a pentaforce:

I don't mean to steer the thread too far off topic but does anyone else find it interesting that the bird of the Hylian crest on the shield evolved into a winged humanoid figure? I would love to know exactly what that represents. Might be worthy of a topic itself.

Now on to the topic at hand, there have been a lot of arguments on Nayru actually being the goddess of time as mentioned before. As she was the one who created law and order.

The God of Wisdom created science and wizardry and brought order to nature

And it is understood that time could be a part of this order to nature. More evidence would the Nayru the Oracle of ages which also semes to govern time. So it could be possible that over time the mythology of the three goddesses have changed slightly into separate belief systems. This does happen a lot in the real world so it is possible to happen in Hyrule as well. It is also believed that the Desert Colossus is Din, and Farore is thought to be the goddess of Wind. So different peoples in different regions might have a separate belief system involving the three goddesses of Hyrule.

 

[Pinecove]

@Pinecove : I don't know for which reason but it seems like you hate me from the very first moment you knew my existence. It's a bit annoying and there's no way to have an intelligent talk in these circumstances. :-/
Okay, maybe the pointing down triangles just don't meant anything, either when there is one, either when there are two (even it that sounds odd...). But you can still be polite at me if I don't agree.

I don't mean to be rude. I just get...impatient. I'm sorry if I have offended.

@Djinn: Why is Celia the spirit of courage and time in PH than?

 

[Djinn]

I don't mean to be rude. I just get...impatient. I'm sorry if I have offended.

@Djinn: Why is Celia the spirit of courage and time in PH than?

Because a spirit is not a goddess. She also seemed to be directly under the Ocean King in the order of things in that world. and I would not consider her a deity of those concepts as an equal to the golden goddesses. Besides we have already seen other lesser gods in similar roles in Wind Waker. And then the same could be applied to Valoo, the Deku Tree, it might even be possible to include the Light Spirits into the order of overlapping roles in Hyrule's Mythology.

However the using western terms of spirit and goddess might hurt the understanding of these concepts. Since kami is the term used most often in the Japanese. And that actually could include something as lowly as the spirit of one tree all the way to a primordial god of an abstract concept. It is very hard to translate to a western audience.

 

[Pinecove]

I know that. But thank you for your opinions.