• Welcome to ZD Forums! You must create an account and log in to see and participate in the Shoutbox chat on this main index page.

Breath of the Wild Zelda Wii U - Taking Advantage Of Multiple Control Schemes or No?

JuicieJ

SHOW ME YA MOVES!
Joined
Jan 10, 2011
Location
On the midnight Spirit Train going anywhere
Correction: It wouldn't feel awkward to you. Just because you're comfortable with something doesn't mean everyone will be as well. ;)

If it doesn't feel awkward to move an analog stick one one side of the controller, it wouldn't be for another. It could possibly take a bit to get used to, but that's really how any new control scheme works. We adjusted to controlling a camera with the second analog stick, didn't we? Remember back in the days when controllers kept evolving and we had to get used to them? Ah, the good old days when no one cared about having to get used to controls.

I'm actually quite curious to this notion. What games have you played that used this system of right analog stick to attack? I have never once in my life heard of such a game, only emulators designed to, well, emulate the WM+ and they got their task done with varying success.

Ever heard of Metal Gear Solid 2 and Ape Escape on the PlayStation 2?
 

Cfrock

Keep it strong
Joined
Mar 17, 2012
Location
Liverpool, England
You're moving an analog in multiple directions with both. There is no difference in what you're doing with the controller.

The difference comes from perceived direction (maybe not the best way to put it but I can't think of a clearer way). Moving with the left and attacking with the right is different because for movement pushing the stick up is 'forwards' but for attacking pushing the stick up is 'up'. With such a set-up the two sticks move their respective object in different ways, along different planes. Such a system would take some getting used to for most people and would definitely feel awkward for some, at least at first.
 

JuicieJ

SHOW ME YA MOVES!
Joined
Jan 10, 2011
Location
On the midnight Spirit Train going anywhere
The difference is in how the sword moves and how the person moves.

The action your thumb performs is no different. You're moving an analog stick. The action the character performs makes no difference to what you're doing. Also:

JuicieJ said:
We adjusted to controlling a camera with the second analog stick, didn't we?

That should really set you up for not having any trouble adjusting to using the sword with the right analog stick.

at least at first.

Key words there. "At first." Adjusting to anything feels awkward at first. Once you get used to it, though, it's smooth sailing.
 
I'm not a proponent of multiple control outputs. If I recall correctly, Nintendo is using both the Wii Remote Plus and Wii U Game Pad for Pikmin 3 to serve for character control and a world map display, respectively, however I believe this would devolve into an awkward mess when applied to Zelda. Action-Adventure games are faster paced than their strategic counterparts and I see this as a hindrance to gameplay.

One of the most perplexing factors to anyone who doesn't own a Wii U is why they would want to look down upon the smaller touchscreen while playing. I entered with these same doubts but have since then swallowed my words. Playing in 480 p on the Game Pad looks equally gorgeous as viewing the game on the larger television screen in 1080 p. Being a console controller, the Wii U Game Pad breaks power barriers currently impeding handhelds. It's also completely understandable and expected for several smaller functions to be Game Pad improved or required. A popular notion which I support is having access to the item inventory via the touch screen and certainly wouldn't mind seeing Resident Evil or ZombiU like switch puzzles to tap into as long as they're varied enough to retain an enjoyment factor.
 

JuicieJ

SHOW ME YA MOVES!
Joined
Jan 10, 2011
Location
On the midnight Spirit Train going anywhere
I'm not a proponent of multiple control outputs. If I recall correctly, Nintendo is using both the Wii Remote Plus and Wii U Game Pad for Pikmin 3 to serve for character control and a world map display, respectively, however I believe this would devolve into an awkward mess when applied to Zelda. Action-Adventure games are faster paced than their strategic counterparts and I see this as a hindrance to gameplay.

How does this make a difference? Control schemes can be adapted in any genre and maintain the same basic gameplay. There's no reason to say it works for Pikmin but not Zelda.
 
How does this make a difference? Control schemes can be adapted in any genre and maintain the same basic gameplay. There's no reason to say it works for Pikmin but not Zelda.

As I stated above, Action-Adventure games require quick reaction time when solving puzzles or battling enemies and incorporating a dual output setup is inconvenient for those tense situations. Trtuh be told, I can't imagine playing with the Wii Remote and Game Pad in any game. With a portable like the DS it's completely logical to observe two screens because they're adjacent to each other, one below the other but when the Game Pad is given secondary importance and I'm required to set it down somewhere albeit within view while navigating with the Wii Remote the experience loses its fluidity.
 

JuicieJ

SHOW ME YA MOVES!
Joined
Jan 10, 2011
Location
On the midnight Spirit Train going anywhere
As I stated above, Action-Adventure games require quick reaction time when solving puzzles or battling enemies and incorporating a dual output setup is inconvenient for those tense situations.

Yeah, flicking a stick is so hard to do on a moment's notice.

Trtuh be told, I can't imagine playing with the Wii Remote and Game Pad in any game. With a portable like the DS it's completely logical to observe two screens because they're adjacent to each other, one below the other but when the Game Pad is given secondary importance and I'm required to set it down somewhere albeit within view while navigating with the Wii Remote the experience loses its fluidity.

...Where did you get the idea that a control scheme require you to use both the Wii Remote and GamePad?
 

DarkestLink

Darkest of all Dark Links
Joined
Oct 28, 2012
[video=youtube;_BoEzdrcbns]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_BoEzdrcbns[/video]

1) Boring gameplay. I'm shuddering at the idea of going from TP combat to something...so mundane on the control.

2) Wasted development time

3) Accuracy.

4) It isn't the motion + itself that people are upset about. It's the combat. Those who are against it want their Oot-TP combat back. Trying to mesh that together with combat fit for Motion +...not gonna happen.

5) This would imply that the Wii U's controller is an extra option for those who don't want to use the Motion +...but doesn't it feel weird to build a game around a controller you don't use anymore with the main controller as an option?
 

JuicieJ

SHOW ME YA MOVES!
Joined
Jan 10, 2011
Location
On the midnight Spirit Train going anywhere
1) Boring gameplay. I'm shuddering at the idea of going from TP combat to something...so mundane on the control.

2) Wasted development time

3) Accuracy.

What do you even mean by these?

4) It isn't the motion + itself that people are upset about. It's the combat. Those who are against it want their Oot-TP combat back. Trying to mesh that together with combat fit for Motion +...not gonna happen.

I rarely see people complain about the combat. It's almost always people saying they would rather use a normal controller than the Wii Remote.

5) This would imply that the Wii U's controller is an extra option for those who don't want to use the Motion +...but doesn't it feel weird to build a game around a controller you don't use anymore with the main controller as an option?

The Wii U isn't leaving the Wii MotionPlus behind. There are already multiple games that use it as well as the other controllers, and there's even a game coming out next year (Pikmin 3) that has the MotionPlus and Nunchuk as its main control scheme. The Wii U is designed to be versatile with its options in controls. People seem to not understand that and think that the Wii Remote is dead because of the GamePad. It's not.
 

Zorth

#Scoundrel
Joined
Apr 22, 2011
I'd like 2 control schemes, One where we use the Gamepad & Touchscreen and the other one being the Pro Controller (classic controls). Really no need for more than that because the first control scheme would be the new way to play Zelda for those who want to while we still have the old way to play Zelda left in our options. More than that will just be overkill, The only reason people are debating right now is because one part of the fanbase wants to play old school controls while the other one wants to "evolve" and play with new controls (lol). So just satisfy both sides.

^^

I don't want to wait even a couple more months to get this title; it's going to the Wii U so it will definitely be a big title, and delays will already be rampant so that Nintendo can make what they perceive to be the right decisions.

Trust me, Delayed games will always be better than rushed ones. I'll gladly wait a couple of more months to make sure this next game is as perfect as possible instead of playing a title where parts of it weren't fully developed or tested. Even if they go with only one control scheme they'll still have tons of other stuff left to test and polish, Not taking the time they need and trying to make it release within a certain time frame will most likely mean more scew ups.

:silent:
 

Cfrock

Keep it strong
Joined
Mar 17, 2012
Location
Liverpool, England
Trust me, Delayed games will always be better than rushed ones.

Duke Nukem Forever and Daikatana.

Using the Gamepad and using Wii Motion+ isn't just a simple question of reprogramming buttons as swings. The game is going to be designed with the Gamepad's functions in mind. Two screens, touch control, a microphone, two analogue sticks, more buttons, heck, even a camera. These are things Motion+ simply does not have. It's not going to be a case of just adding a new control scheme, the way the inventory works will have to be different, the way the map works will have to be different, they will have to either have two totally separate sets of items or completely change how some will work just to accommodate Motion+.

This isn't like Smash Bros. Brawl which used 4 control scheme that were all basically just buttons and sticks, the Gamepad is not comparable to Motion+ and if the game used both control schemes it would, as Ventus said, be like having two entirely different games. The differences are too many for it to be an easy thing. It would require a lot more dev time, a lot more money and all for what would ultimately be the option to play a worse version of the game.
 

Zorth

#Scoundrel
Joined
Apr 22, 2011
Duke Nukem Forever and Daikatana.

Sorry, should've specified what I meant by delay.

a few months, maybe a year at most.
Not 15 years. :xd:

Using the Gamepad and using Wii Motion+ isn't just a simple question of reprogramming buttons as swings. The game is going to be designed with the Gamepad's functions in mind. Two screens, touch control, a microphone, two analogue sticks, more buttons, heck, even a camera. These are things Motion+ simply does not have. It's not going to be a case of just adding a new control scheme, the way the inventory works will have to be different, the way the map works will have to be different, they will have to either have two totally separate sets of items or completely change how some will work just to accommodate Motion+.

This isn't like Smash Bros. Brawl which used 4 control scheme that were all basically just buttons and sticks, the Gamepad is not comparable to Motion+ and if the game used both control schemes it would, as Ventus said, be like having two entirely different games. The differences are too many for it to be an easy thing. It would require a lot more dev time, a lot more money and all for what would ultimately be the option to play a worse version of the game.

Mai gawd.

..

..

..

STAHP.

I never even mentioned the Motion+ in my post. I talked about Gamepad and Pro Controller..
But that's really no excuse since the same argument can be applied, sort of.

but you should still read posts before replying to them.

So yes, You are correct it would be complicated to construct two control schemes for two different styles of play. But the motion + solely relies on movements while the Pro Controller at least has some things in common with the Gamepad, 2 analogue sticks, buttons.. but lacks a touch screen. But adding a menu which you access by pressing START or something should solve that problem. But problem still remains, how to make them not drift apart by too much to make the game split into two games because of different controls?

I'm not the guy to answer that sadly, ask the devs! :wave:
 
Last edited:

Users who are viewing this thread

Top Bottom