Breath of the Wild Zelda Wii U Externalizing the Hammerspace

[Locke]

I honestly think we cannot go back to button controls now, so I think that these controls will be used in future Zelda titles, too.

We will want to use the Wii Motion-Plus controls that we did not use this time in future games, so we cannot tell you now. Please look forward to seeing them in the future.

Skyward Sword has started the Zelda series down an intriguing path toward immersion. The philosophy of this path is "Bring the players into the game by bringing the game out to the players." The first step was to pluck the sword out of the game and place it directly into the hands of the players, thanks to Wii MotionPlus. I say it started with Skyward Sword, even though Twilight Princess also incorporated motion controls. But Twilight Princess's motion controls were just that - controls invoked through motion. Controlling an in-game sword by swinging the controller. In that game, there was no difference between a swing of the Wii Remote and a press of a button. Skyward Sword's one-to-one mapping created a physical proxy for the sword outside the game.

Judging by the quotes above, we'll likely see this again in Zelda Wii U. It will also likely take the next step. With more hardware comes more possibilities.

With The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword, we had the Nunchuck and Wii Remote sort of stand in for the sword and shield that Link carries. But in a game for the Wii U, I can definitely see something like the controller itself becoming the different items that Link is using, allowing you to interact with the game world and with the game items in a very different way.

Now Aonuma taunts us with plucking another item out of the game and laying it into our hands: the Magic Satchel/hammerspace. I think the best example of how this will reflect this new immersion philosophy is that instead of pressing a button to bring up the map in-game, one can simply reach for the tablet which becomes the map, outside of the game. But that would be a low-impact change; what they'd really want to capitalize on is bringing Link's inventory outside the game. Instead of Link pulling his items out of hammerspace into the game, we can pull them out of our own hammerspace into our world, and "interact with the game world and with the game items in a very different way." Now, I don't want to start speculating on what exactly they'll do with the tablet, so I'll leave it at that.

One question that's nagging me as I envision this scenario is whether this immersion is really worth the extra trouble one would have to go through to use both the Wii Remote and the tablet. Link does have to put his sword and shield away before using a different item, but does increasing the immersion of this experience justify forcing us to set down the Wii Remote in order to pick up the tablet?

Another issue to consider with this "Bring the players into the game by bringing the game out to the players" approach is the hardware required to achieve it. Unless they took the Augmented Reality approach - which I don't see the Zelda franchise ever doing - they need to provide a physical proxy for everything they take out of the game. For the sword, this was Wii MotionPlus - an add-on which had to be purchased in order to play the game. For Zelda Wii U this is a nonissue because the tablet comes with the console, but in general, does an increase in immersion justify the cost of extra hardware?

Finally, is bringing the game out to the players the right approach for immersion? Do you think interacting with the tablet will make the game seem more real, or will it seem to lose cohesion?

 

[A Link In Time]

I only partially agree with the OP. In a rapidly changing industry, Zelda needs to adapt to not only remain relevant but stay close to the top as it has traditionally been. Miyamoto and Aonuma seem to believe that motion control is one means through which to accomplish this goal. I respect their opinions, however, I don't seem the traditional control setup changing in future handheld installments due to not only technological restrictions but also the nature of handheld gaming. On the console forefront Nintendo is slowly retracting from motion control. Although the Wii U tablet controller obviously includes a gyro sensor, this is a step away from the wholly realistic sword play of Skyward Sword and leaning more towards a traditional control scheme.

Also, I don't see why you believe the Wii Remote and Wii U tablet will or could be used in conjunction while playing the upcoming Wii U Zelda title. This will only cause an additional hassle for players and I'm sure Miyamoto and Aonuma would disapprove of the idea due to it, as you mentioned, breaking the traditional fast pace, of the Zelda formula due to having to swap controllers frequently.

I'm still rather iffy on the whole tablet idea. What critics of the Wii U are arguing is that the system lacks originality due to simply being a copy of the iPad with buttons or better yet a fusion of Nintedo's last two major successes-the DS and Wii. I was afraid Skyward Sword's motion controls would forever ruin the Zelda series and I was glad to be proven wrong for the most part. They may not have been perfect but they expanded upon what seems the prototypes titles like Wii Sports Resort and Red Steel 2 offered. I have confidence that Nintendo will find a way to incorporate the tablet controller wisely. Never has the company blotched a mainstream console installment.

 

[Awesome]

I honestly have no clue what Nintendo plans to do with the Wii U. There are so many options that they could explore, but I have a strong feeling that the motion controls of Skyward Sword will return for the Wii U. The Tablet could function as a Tingle Tuner or Map, but I don't think it will be the main way to control Link the upcoming Zelda game.

 

[Trio the Punch]

I don't really like the sound of this new style of gameplay. I enjoyed the motion controls in Skyward Sword and how they were integrated into the game, but I'm not sure I'm completely bought in to the idea of any more externalized game elements. Having to play the game while keeping track of all of your items with the tablet and switching over to the wiimote for your sword (which is what I think you were hypothesizing) sounds cumbersome and difficult to the point of being game-breaking.

On the subject of whether or not I think the externalization of all items in the game will make the experience feel real, I would have to say yes. That is not to imply that I think this is a good thing, however, as I personally dislike the strive for realism in video games. Frankly, I think it would suck to have to actually utilize all of the items and weapons that Link does all the time. It'd be a hassle. I don't think getting closer to that experience will add anything to the game, and I think it is in fact something that the developers should try to avoid. That being said, I do have faith in Nintendo being able to pull something like that off in a way that flows well with the gameplay and is comfortable (even if I can't even fathom how that's possible), as they have proven in the past that they can achieve this.

On the topic of buying hardware: no. Given my stance on the whole immersion thing, it is probably pretty obvious that I don't want that experience enough to want to buy more crap. At the same time, I still WOULD buy extra hardware if needed, as I want to play Zelda Wii U (regardless of having to suffer through the 'Xtremely Real' experience) enough that dropping a few extra bucks doesn't deter me. I wouldn't be happy about it though.

 

[Jeeen]

This makes me sad, since I tend to be way better at Zelda games with buttons only.. :'(

 

[SinkingBadges]

Locke, I thought at first that you were somewhere between reading too much into the statements and making a really interesting hypothesis. :xd: That's not important, though. It's an interesting, possibility to think over, and I actually do picture how they might externalize the inventory. (as usual, though, there isn't really a way to tell what Nintendo could come up with)

Also, I don't see why you believe the Wii Remote and Wii U tablet will or could be used in conjunction while playing the upcoming Wii U Zelda title. This will only cause an additional hassle for players and I'm sure Miyamoto and Aonuma would disapprove of the idea due to it, as you mentioned, breaking the traditional fast pace, of the Zelda formula due to having to swap controllers frequently.

I can't speak for Locke here, but if after taking another look at the WiiU concept trailer they showed at E3, there are some remotely relevant examples of externalizing in-game items that I personally found interesting (not necessarily good, though) and would recommend you to check out if you haven't:

[video=youtube;4e3qaPg_keg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4e3qaPg_keg[/video]

0:50 - Imagine applying the same mechanincs to a puzzle or minigame. Maybe a bit remote in it's actual relationship to Zelda, but it looked like a good starting point to me.

1:08 - Doesn't that look like a practical way to aim with the bow/hookshot? Maybe better off as an optional method, I guess.

1:20 - Ok, I doubt you'll ever have to play golf in Zelda. But I guess this one does give a remote idea of how they could externalize items by using the wiimote along with the tablet.

2:10 - Maybe not using shurikens either, but this is another interesting example of externalization. Who am I to judge if Link should become a ninja or not, though?

Anyway, thought these would be interesting to mention. I do admit many if not all of these methods would be more at home in say a demo ala Wii Sports. You can also take these as more of an indication to what Nintendo could do, rather than what they will do. Whether anyone else thinks they are good idea or not... it's probably better for me to leave it at that.

On the subject of buying more hardware: I actually remember a Cooking Mama Wii game doing something similar, and also that it was every bit as impractical as it sounds. I do think Aonuma and the other developers have a pretty clear grasp of what is practical and what isn't, if Skyward Sword's controls are any indication. Certainly, making you buy a plastic bow/hookshot/staff/any other items they decide to put in there-shaped stand does sound like something I don't see them doing by any means.

 

[JuicieJ]

I kinda doubt the Wii U tablet will be used immersively in Zelda Wii U. If anything, it might be used for a map or for co-op.

 

[Hephaestus]

I really don't want to see them ditch the Motion+ controls in the next console Zelda. They were so rewarding.

 

[A Link In Time]

It actually appears as though there may be huge validity in the claim of controlling with both the Wii U table and standard Wii Remotes due to a recent Nintendo patent. I'm not opposed to this idea but it nevertheless seems awkward to have to switch between controllers.

 

[TheRealLink]

i personally would rather the whole game be played with one controller, whether it be a tablet, wimmote, or gamecube controller. motion is annoying to me but i also like the precision and speed it adds to targeting with the bow, if the tablet can do the same i'll be fine with just the tablet

 

[Gambitgamer]

Im sure they are going to use the Wii U remote very awesomely! But I don't they will use it as a weapon

 

[S. Mario]

Everyone seems to think that in order to use the tablet and the remote together, you'd have to switch back and forth. After looking at the concept trailer that SinkingBadges posted, I saw that several people were effortlessly holding the tablet in one hand. This means that there may be the possibility of holding the remote in one hand and the tablet in the other. You could probably poke the touch screen with a finger from the hand your using to hold the remote easily, without letting go of the remote. I think using both controllers would be fairly simple. Plus, the tablet has the same motion capabilities as the motion-plus, so we might have a one-to-one controls for the shield as well as the sword.

 

[Locke]

Also, I don't see why you believe the Wii Remote and Wii U tablet will or could be used in conjunction while playing the upcoming Wii U Zelda title. This will only cause an additional hassle for players and I'm sure Miyamoto and Aonuma would disapprove of the idea due to it, as you mentioned, breaking the traditional fast pace, of the Zelda formula due to having to swap controllers frequently.

I say it because in different scenarios Aonuma has expressed a very strong desire to use one or the other, so I think it would be very difficult for him to give up one opportunity. I am however, like you, concerned with how much of a hassle using both would be. I trust that if they do go down this road, reducing hassle would be one of their top concerns for both controls and gameplay.

At this point I'm more interested in how immersion can be achieved. Classic virtual reality concepts involve blocking out concrete reality in order to replace it with virtual sensations - the player leaves the real world in order to enter the game world. On the other hand, website designers follow the principle that viewers should not feel like they're navigating through pages in the website, but that the website brings pages to them. Can/should this same principle be applied to games? Maybe I should have posted this in general gaming. What about Zelda in particular then? Some might argue that it's easier to block the real world when there's less real-world motion required to stimulate virtual-world motion, but I think that it's easier to reify Hyrule and in a more meaningful way when we have direct access to it through real-world proxies.

Before Skyward Sword, most games had separate item menus that paused the game when they were opened. I actually think this was very harmful to the reification of Hyrule, not to mention the items themselves. I was thus very pleased when Skyward Sword allowed item switching in real-time. Miyamoto mentioned that choosing an item with the WM+ is like pulling it out of a pocket, and which pocket it's in is remembered, with the assistance of muscle memory, just like how one remembers in which pocket one keeps one's keys. With the items off-screen, Hyrule persists while you look down into your "Magic Satchel".

 

[feraldonkey]

There was a rumor awhile back that controls on some games would vary, kind of like how Super Smash Bros. Brawl had different options for seasoned or new players. I think switching between the two would be weird for a Zelda game, unless Nintendo wanted to go all the way with the immersion process they have going. It would have that same feel as digging in your pocket that Skyward Sword did with the item list, it would be challenging and a little tedious.

 

[Smegzilla]

I'd very much like it if the new Zelda game for Wii-U had your inventory/map on the screen of the controller. Being able to glance down at the map without interrupting my gameplay for even a short loading screen while it popped up would be wonderful, and it would be a lot easier to judge your relative position if you could dart your eyes back and forth to see which direction you were running in.

Inventory on the tablet controller would work great, I think. I imagine it would be similar to how it worked in OoT3D in that you poke the things you want to use and Link would equip them immediately. Of course, with all that extra space on the bigger screen they could have most of your items at the push of a (touchscreen) button so you wouldn't have to "set" any of them before use.