Ocarina of Time Why?

[Rytex]

No, they aren't idiotic at all. Saying that is what causes enmity between people of all sorts, particularly why people really freaking hate Zelda among other game series. They're simply attracted to a specific type of game. Just like you care more about story and gameplay, they simply care more for online multiplayer and graphics. Again, that is your opinion and theirs.

Besides, Nintendo could learn some interesting facts about the Internet demographic by implementing some sort of massively multiplayer Zelda/Mario concept. Which in turn could potentially lead to more fans of any of their series. The time for crappy graphics and friend codes is over, what the average gamer wants is great graphics and secure Internet play. You have every right to disagree with that, but in no way should you or need to call them idiots or dumb; it is their choice.

But still. Most gamers don't buy a game for story anymore. They buy it because of the ability to sit in their basement and shout at the TV when someone so much as lands a shot on them (based on a true story, when I was playing with my friend against some terrible gamers online on his Halo 3 a few years ago) That's like buying a movie not because of how good the story is, but because of what Special Features are on the bonus disc. Pardon the expression, but basically, that's saying "F*** the game, let's spend all our time getting all worked up because of an online CTF Match where I'm an inch away from their flag and I get killed." Now, I'm not saying that Halo or CoD are bad games (to the contrary, they are some of the best I've ever seen in terms of gameplay and plot), but to not even care about those qualities and go straight to wifi... Yeahhhno.

And by the way, when asked what the saddest moment in video game history is, I don't say "when Aeris died". I say "when online multiplayer became more important that anything else."

 

[Ventus]

I don't buy games for the story either, simply because there are little to no games with any good story and I'm not really one to pay attention to that kinda detail. I buy games for the gameplay, examples being Zelda: OoT, Star Ocean 3, and several other games. Without good gameplay, it really isn't a game more so it is a movie or show, you know what I mean? When it comes down to it, stories aren't original anymore. They've already been done, which is why people call Zelda repetitive. There's no counter to that, they will always follow the same pre-established "hero does this, villain does this, hero comes out on top" OR "hero does this, villain does this, hero fails" structure. That is how Zelda is defined in this day and age. That is how nearly all games are defined. Originality doesn't exist in story, that is partially why it is so overlooked. Gameplay isn't really original either, what with the massive amount of games that have been chucked out, but with the right blend of physics, graphics and intuitiveness, you can get the "ultimate" gameplay for a game. Remakes could help in that department, such as OoT3D cleaning up the graphics as well as fixing frame rates and the enemy AI. Yes, graphics do play a part even if it is minor.

Yeah, I also agree that the worst part of video game history is when online multiplayer became the most important, I remember the days when I would beg my mom and dad to go over my friend's house to play on his PS1 or my parents would through a party and we could basically binge eat while playing Soul Calibur 2...ah, the days.

Back on topic, MM3D isn't necessary, but what it could do if it were made far outweighs waiting 2-3 years for a new Zelda, I'm sure you all would agree. No, it wouldn't detract Nintendo from making a new Zelda if they have a second/third party develop it, as seen in OoT3D and Skyward Sword's dual development. Heck, there could be a new Zelda in the mix for the 3DS as we speak! No, I don't want remakes to become a standard practice though porting I'm okay with (for examples of a port, see OoT64 vs OoT Collector's Edition, or the Virtual Console games. All of those are ports. A remake is in the vein of Ocarina of Time 3D, with significant gameplay and graphic improvements; despite all of those the game is still to the core Ocarina of Time 64).

 

[dur.i.am]

I'm going to go ahead and say now that I agree with all of the points that Athenian has made in her post, but I'd like to add to the second section of her post. I'm not attacking your opinion, though, ToonLinkGaming. After all, we are all entitled to our own opinions, but I think that you have made some unfair assumptions about remakes whilst making your post.

Assumption 2: Remakes are unnecessary/The original games were perfect already.

I could not disagree more. Remakes are needed in order to allow a newer generation of gamers to enjoy a truly classic game. I do not feel that Nintendo needs to remake EVERY game, certainly, but I do feel that Ocarina of Time is one of those games that was in need of a remake. It was incredibly popular, and pushed the limits of the platform it was released on, such that a remake enabled them to re-envision things and make them more perfect for the re-release.

Also, the 3DS itself was in desperate need of good games. Nintendo was in a hurry to release it, and there weren't many games for it to start with. So Nintendo had to rush some games to the new console in order to prevent it from failing. Developing new games would take too long at this point, as the genie is already out of the bottle, so to speak. You could argue that Nintendo shouldn't have rushed the 3DS to market, and I would agree with you, but that is a different debate entirely. The point is that, in the situation Nintendo found themselves in after releasing the 3DS, this was their best option. The games they've chosen were classic N64 games that have a proven record, and which have not seen a re-release before.

Now, obviously, to show off the new console's capabilities, a port of these excellent games is simply not enough. It was necessary to remake OoT in particular, in order to showcase the potential of the new console in action-adventure games such as OoT. No game on the console already did so adequately, and Nintendo needed to show QUICKLY what the console was capable of, that it wasn't just an expensive toy/gimmick. I believe that they succeeded. The 3D feature and the gyroscopic motion control for aiming are seamlessly integrated into the game, and the former is breathtaking while the latter is useful at times. It revealed the potential of the 3DS as a console.

As Athenian said above, remakes arenecessary to allow the newest generation of gamers the chance to enjoy playing the classic games such as Ocarina of Time. After all, it's been 13 years since Ocarina of Time was first released, and there is a large group of younger gamers that weren't even born by then. And there are those that were born, but were only a year or two old and wouldn't have been playing games. Therefore there is a large section of the gaming community that won't have a Nintendo 64 because they opted for the newer generations of consoles that were out at the time.

Even then, there is are the older generations to consider. A lot of my friends either never owned a Nintendo 64 for their own reasons or just the lack of money, or if they did they are no longer in ownership of one due to it breaking or they sold it/gave it away. I only have my Nintendo 64 due to the fact that my brother was kind enough to give me his.

 

[WhiteRundas]

Like I said before I enjoyed OoT when it was released on VC. I'm satisfied with a port for 10$/€ and I think the only better thing about the remake is that it is portable. But it seems that for many people (younger players) the graphics are also important, but I don't understand why I should pay 40€ for better graphics.

 

[Zeldawolfsheik]

I think OoT3D was okay because they wanted to do one remake. Operation moonfall? NO! We need new games instead! 1 remake enough right?

 

[00031]

I'm personally all for re-releases on new consoles. I mean, let's face it, kids nowadays don't exactly go home and fire up the old SNES - I like to look at re-releases as a way to introduce the next "generation" of Zelda nerds to the games. It doesn't make the games you played or the memories you have with them any less awesome, it just lets more people experience them.

 

[A Link In Time]

Honestly, I'm sick of all the attention that OoT3DS has been getting, and I'm also sick and tired of all this Operation Moonfall crap, It's really getting on my nerves! The original games are good for what they are, we don't need some crappy remake that serves little to no purpose what-so-ever.

I love the Legend of Zelda franchise and everything within it (except Twilight Princess), I love and cherish all of the games, and want it to never change. OoT3DS kinda wrecked that for me, because all I really want from Nintendo is to produce the same quality of work with rising amounts of effort in each new Zelda title, not remake something that we already know and love. I like to say "Don't fix something that isn't broken", and this metaphor applies quite nicely here, because OoT was perfect. 10/10 in my eyes, why fix it, WHY!!!!

I seriously think, and worry, that Nintendo are running out of ideas. I am aware that it was to test the 3DS's new hardware, and to show us the graphical improvements they can do, but still, OoT was fine, up yours Nintendo! *raises middle finger in a harmful manor* -.-

I may be grumpy over something that had good intentions, sure. But I just wish that Nintendo would stop getting so damn distracted and work on NEW titles, not remakes, ffs >_>

You're wrong, no game is "perfect". It may be masterful, but not perfect. That being said games age and the games of the N64 era did not age gracefully and Miyamoto wanted to give Zelda an early spin on the 3DS. OOT 3D is truly masterful and improves on what was already a cornerstone in gaming.

 

[00031]

I may be grumpy over something that had good intentions, sure. But I just wish that Nintendo would stop getting so damn distracted and work on NEW titles, not remakes, ffs >_>

...it's not like they're making a new game or anything...

...you know, like about an upright weapon or any crazy talk like that...

 

[Zeldawolfsheik]

I'm personally all for re-releases on new consoles. I mean, let's face it, kids nowadays don't exactly go home and fire up the old SNES - I like to look at re-releases as a way to introduce the next "generation" of Zelda nerds to the games. It doesn't make the games you played or the memories you have with them any less awesome, it just lets more people experience them.

ya,ya, i am all for ports. I would not be playing so much zelda if not for ports.

 

[Forlong]

You're being kind of a hypocrite now. You call me and him biased, yet you're trying to prove that TP is better than OoT. Which is YOUR opinion.

Ocarina of Time is not an absolute clone of ALttP, not at all. The story details are very different, the gameplay is different, the graphics are completely different, the plot is also tweaked enough. Ocarina of Time is definitely similar to aLttP a lot of ways, but different enough to not be a clone.

It's become pretty obvious that you like Twilight Princess over Ocarina of Time, and that is what is driving your argument. I will politely excuse myself from this conversation.

I don't recall claiming that TP was better than OoT, despite whether or not that is my opinion. The point I was making is that you were incorrect. You said that TP didn't improve on anything OoT did, I showed you that it did. The scale of the game is grander, and that is called an improvement. Want me to think you are not bias? Tell me three things OoT did that TP didn't do better. I'll even give you one: difficulty. OoT has a better difficulty curve than TP. Other than that, there is nothing that makes OoT a superior title. Get over it.

I'm playing TP now and I know your just making stuff up about it being a clone of OoT. With the first three dungeons, I can see it. But with NOTHING ELSE. Everything else about the game feels completely different from OoT. This is why I can't stand OoT fanboys (and girls). The moment a truly excellent adventure game comes out, they claim it's copying OoT, as if that makes the other game less good.

Forlong, OoT cloned a hell lot of ALttP's mechanics and story, I'm pretty sure Mases or Axle did a review about that a few years ago. But, there is the fact that Ocarina didn't rip the Dark World or many of the dungeon layouts from Past. Meh, if you don't like OoT, don't play or talk about it. TP, on the other hand, copied OoT (and to an extent, ALttP) but did so horribly – the dungeons are way too easy to the general player and the overworld while big, is so like...blank, as in deforested or something. There's hardly anything to do. Yes, Hyrule Field [TP] will give you a grander sense of 'adventure', but once you realise that the cake is dominant and there is hardly any icing, you start to recall that TP wasn't really that great of a Zelda and many of its ideas were poorly executed. Your opinion isn't my opinion, and clearly that won't change.

You've got some good points there. However, wouldn't putting more secrets in such a large overworld be more confusing? It's about having the right combination of features. Looking at it like you say, however, it does make sense to say that TP isn't quite as good as OoT. I don't agree, but it does make sense.

^ TP isn't better than OoT. A bigger overworld doesn't mean that it is a better overworld.This would mean that WWs overworld is the best. TPs overworld may be bigger but it doesn't have many secrets. The dungeons are easier than OoTs and actually as extensive as OoTs. TPs final dungeon is pathetic compared to OoTs or WWs. You beat King Bulblin and some Darknuts and it is finished.
Back to the topic: I also didn't like Oot3DS.But only because it was so hyped. I really enjoyed Oot and it is a great game but OoT3DS is only a remake.

It's so silly to see OoT fanboys try to defend that absolute worst part of that game. The Water Temple, Spirit Temple, and Shadow Temple kicked me to the curb the first time I played through the game. The last dungeon, on the other hand, was a breeze. That is nothing more than completely pathetic. Everyone knows that you should save the most challenging level for the end. They didn't even screw that up in AoL. I'm sorry, but saying that you fight King Bulblin in the last dungeon of TP automatically makes it five times better than the final dungeon of OoT, because that is a challenge. Certainly a step up from the halfassed tower at the end of OoT. So there is something bad about that game. Is that a problem?

 

[WhiteRundas]

You seem to judge people very fast. Calling me a fanboy of OoT is exaggerated because I like many Zelda games far more than it (MM,WW,ALttP,MC). But I can understand some of your arguments because OoT is sometimes really overhyped. I think that King Bulblin isn't that hard.Maybe because of that I don't think that the last dungeon is hard. So far ALttPs last dungeon is my favourite.

 

[Forlong]

You seem to judge people very fast. Calling me a fanboy of OoT is exaggerated because I like many Zelda games far more than it (MM,WW,ALttP,MC). But I can understand some of your arguments because OoT is sometimes really overhyped. I think that King Bulblin isn't that hard.Maybe because of that I don't think that the last dungeon is hard. So far ALttPs last dungeon is my favourite.

Maybe I was being a bit harsh. The OoT hype just gets on my nerves. Totally agree about the last dungeon of LttP, though.

2 - Characters. 99% of TP's characters were completely irrelevant, even Zelda was just there to be there. In Ocarina of Time, you kind of personally knew all the sages you awakened, even Zelda had some personality. In Twilight Princess, the only people you can care about is Midna and Zant.

3 - Sidequests. We all know TP wasn't big on side quests, even Ocarina of Time had better sidequests than TP.

There are your three. Also, Ocarina of Time is my 4th favorite Zelda game. I think you should refrain from insulting people just because they don't agree with you.



King Bulbin was a breeze, I have no idea what you're talking about. Hyrule Castle was a disappointment in difficulty and length, and King Bulbin was basically a punching bag. While the Iron Knuckles in Ocarina of Time's Hyrule Castle at least made you back up.

2: Sorry, but that is incorrect. If not for Rusl, Collin, Malo, Beth, and Ilia; Link wouldn't have received the call to adventure. They were key to the plot. And then there's Ashei, Auru, Ralis, Shad, and Telma do something NPCs have never done in a Zelda game: actually help Link. They give him orders, help him get the job done, and they even save him from danger. When they can't do something themselves, a good reason why they cannot is given. How many characters are like that in OoT? Zero. Hence, my claim of improvement.
3: Sidequests are only good if they have a point. Quite a few in OoT do not. Collecting more than 50 gold skulltallas is a waste of time, as is racing the marathon man. There may be less sidequests in TP (though I don't think there are), they have more purpose to them. I don't feel any of them are just there to waste my time for a pointless reward (though the poe soul collecting tries my patience).

 

[MahBoiLink]

Honestly, I'm sick of all the attention that OoT3DS has been getting, and I'm also sick and tired of all this Operation Moonfall crap,

I’m sick of people trying to prevent Majora’s Mask from being remade, but you don’t see me making rant threads about it, because I’m also sick of the fighting, and that’s just what this kind of thread stirs up. I’m not asking anyone to support it who doesn’t want to, and I don’t appreciate you asking me or anyone else to stop supporting it, which is what this and other threads/posts bashing remakes and calling our opinions "crap" is. If you want to present a logical argument, then by all means do, I respect a different opinion if it's presented politely.

Now, Ocarina of Time 3D has no effect on Ocarina of Time. You can still buy the good old N64 version for 10 bucks and play it to your heart's content. I don't understand why people think like a remake has or will change the original game, it's not like they are sending some update out that will erase the old version and replace it with the new one. And in my opinion, Ocarina of Time 3D is a great update to Ocarina of time, I like it the same as the original, and I'm glad I bought it and grateful that Nintendo made it.

I also don't find it a very logical argument against the creation of a remake when people say that they don't want to pay 40 dollars for a game they already own. That can be easily resolved: don't buy it again for 40 dollars, no one says that you are required to purchase every game and remake with the name Zelda. But what do you gain from trying to prevent those who consider a remastered and portable version of one of their favorite games worth 40 dollars from buying it? Just roll your eyes at them and talk about something else, don't let your blood pressure be raised by something that doesn't or shouldn't effect you. Also, it won't effect the creation of new games, or the release, because MM3D would be released when there were no other Zelda games currently ready to be released, new games > remakes, and Nintendo would be much more excited about a new game and not want to sit on it.

You don't have to think Ocarina of Time 3D or another remake is a good idea, I understand the grounds for some of the arguments against remakes and I myself don't support a flood of remakes, though I see no problem with several if they are spread out and they are remade well, like Ocarina of Time 3D was. I support Majora's Mask 3D and Operation Moonfall because: it would be nice to have a non-buggy version, I like the game and would love to have it made portable with controls and graphics similar to Ocarina of Time 3D, it uses a lot of content that's already been remade, and because Eiji Aonuma is open to the idea and said that having fan support behind it would help make it more likely to happen.

I realize that if you do not support Majora's Mask 3D my opinion will not change your stance, and that's not my goal. I just hope for you to understand why I feel the way I do and that I truly believe in what I say. I'm glad to give you the same respect, I know that you're not just saying stuff because you have nothing better to do, you're clearly worried that another remake will do harm or otherwise you wouldn't be fighting about something like this. I feel it's not something to be worried about and I've said why many times so I won't repeat myself here, but you're entitled to be worried if you think you should be.

 

[theganonator]

i don't mind the remakes bcause these are legendary games and it's only grezzo who's doing it, but i don't get all the hype... OoT3d is just a port of a 13 year old game, and what's up with the petitions and all that nonsense for operation moonfall?! if you want to play majora's mask you can right now! are people really that obsessed with slightly better graphics? there are great 3ds games coming out, i don't want to buy old games that i already own several times, let alone beg nintendo to make them, it kinda pathetic imo

 

[Azure Sage]

If you don't mind, I'd like to link you to a coversation I had with JuicieJ about Operation Moonfall. JJ has a similar perspective that you do about OM, ToonLinkGaming. Here it is.

http://zeldadungeon.net/forum/converse.php?u=10707&u2=10840&page=2
http://zeldadungeon.net/forum/converse.php?u=10707&u2=10840

Less for me to type this way. I express all my points in our convo here on this thread. And about Ocarina of Time 3D, it's not a big deal. Personally, I love the game and I bought it the day it came out. ToonLinkGaming, if you don't like it, then don't buy it. No one's forcing you to buy it. Just don't ruin it for everyone else by complaining. And that's all I have to say.