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Two Timelines?

Zemen

[Insert Funny Statement]
Joined
Nov 11, 2008
Location
Illinois
i see where the timeline slits in ocarina of time. that is obvious. (kid link line and adult link line) but is the others accurate? i saw in legend of zelda a retrospective in part 6 where they give their theory in a detailed timeline.

is that the gametrailers timeline? hahahah....no one takes that timeline seriously at all.
 
Joined
Apr 10, 2009
Location
Aussieland
Alright, I know that Zelda has a split timeline at Ocarina of Time, and I understand that there is some kind of "master timeline" in the annals of Miyamoto's sock drawer, but I keep coming back to Minish Cap, Four Swords, and Four Swords Adventure, and I can't really place them with the other games.

Minish Cap is supposed to explain why Link always wears a cap, but absolutely NOTHING about Vaati or the Four Sword or much of anything about those games are ever mentioned in the other Zelda titles. It's almost as if it's trying to be the first title in the series, but at the same time it's making itself obvious that it just can't be.

This leads me to believe that there is ANOTHER Zelda timeline. One that has a completely different beginning than the Master Sword timeline, and may or may not intersect at any point. I know Ganon appears at the end of FSA, and Moblins, creatures made in Ganon's image, are prominant in MC, but trying to factor in all that on a linear timeline just throws a lot of stuff out of whack.

Is it possible that right under our noses there's actually two Legends of Zelda as opposed to just one big one? Some sort of alternate universe where Vaati is the major threat to Hyrule and can only be stopped by the Four Sword; and alternately, in the main universe Ganon is the major threat in Hyrule and can only be stopped by the Master Sword.

It looks kinda like this:
2dhs5sw.jpg



It's a rough outline. Don't judge me.


I think this involved some good thinking. I like it. I don't see why it can't be.
I agree that if we don't have the whole picture we can't really discard just like that the idea.


Like Masses explained it before:
Let's be a bit fair here. Nintendo has clearly contradicted itself a few times. A timeline split had been theorized prior to the 'confirmation' from the creator. It became a popular trend, a few quotes fit in to support this originally fan created theory, etc... That all being said, lets not assume everything that somebody says as being official. If anything, the games are the number 1 place for officialness.

In terms of quotes from Nintendo, hasn't Miyamoto stated in that past, when asked about the timeline, that he just tries to create fun/unique games for people to play. Alluding to the point that fun games are more important than a full, explicit, connected storyline from games throughout the last 20 years.

I think Zelda timeline theories in general are a fan creation

That's my thinking on this actually, I am glad someone actually explained out so nicely.
 
J

JoeGrzzly

Guest
Well, earlier in the thread there were some saying ALttP was the last game in their timeline theories. Doesn't the fact that LoZ and AoL are like guaranteed after ALttP contradictory.
 

DvSag

The Void in the Triforce
Joined
Mar 4, 2009
Location
New Jersey
Contradictory to what?
And how are they both "guaranteed" to come after ALttP?

*On a side note, I no longer believe that the timeline re-merges to ALttP. I believe it was Zemen showed me otherwise.*
 
R

rocker_3

Guest
this is my version of the timeline:
1.minish cap (explains why link has his cap)
2. ocarina of time
3. majora's mask
4. link to the past
5. legend of zelda (the NES one)
6. adventure of link (the towns are named after the sages in OoT)
7. twilight princess
8. wind waker (set 100 years after TP)
9. phantom hourglass
10. spitit tracks

the oracles and the 2 four swords can be placed anywhere in between OoT and TP because they dont have much of a back story, and links awakening can evn be put around phanton hourglass because of the similar storyline.

anyone still confused can go see the angry video game nerd video (called "cronologically confused about the zelda timeline" watch out for the many F-bombs!) his video really clears up alot
also, like the AVGN said, if there was supposed to be an official timeline, it would be there clear as day
 
Joined
Oct 18, 2008
Location
In my coffin
Gender
Non-binary
this is my version of the timeline:
1.minish cap (explains why link has his cap)
2. ocarina of time
3. majora's mask
4. link to the past
5. legend of zelda (the NES one)
6. adventure of link (the towns are named after the sages in OoT)
7. twilight princess
8. wind waker (set 100 years after TP)
9. phantom hourglass
10. spitit tracks

the oracles and the 2 four swords can be placed anywhere in between OoT and TP because they dont have much of a back story, and links awakening can evn be put around phanton hourglass because of the similar storyline.

anyone still confused can go see the angry video game nerd video (called "cronologically confused about the zelda timeline" watch out for the many F-bombs!) his video really clears up alot
also, like the AVGN said, if there was supposed to be an official timeline, it would be there clear as day

Just so you know the timeline is split.
There is no way Wind Waker and Twilight Princess can go on the same timeline.
And the Oracle and the Four Swords games are more important then you make them out to be.
 
R

rocker_3

Guest
Just so you know the timeline is split.
There is no way Wind Waker and Twilight Princess can go on the same timeline.
And the Oracle and the Four Swords games are more important then you make them out to be.

the timeline isnt split, wind waker takes place sooooooooooooooo much longer after twilight princess, nintendo explains WW as being in a different era
and i wouldnt know about four swords and the oracles since ive never played them, i just guessed based on wat i heard about them
 

DvSag

The Void in the Triforce
Joined
Mar 4, 2009
Location
New Jersey
The timeline IS split. It splits at the end of OoT. It ends with Zelda sending Link back in time to relive his childhood.

Time doesn't go back with Link, time continues for Zelda and everyone else. However, Link does go back as a child, and he continues on to the events of MM. Zelda sending Link back results in there being no Link with Zelda. This results in Ganon coming back with no Link (aka: Hero of Time) to stop him. This is the WW backstory.
 

Zemen

[Insert Funny Statement]
Joined
Nov 11, 2008
Location
Illinois
well i guess thats right if u look at it that way, :)

it IS right. this is all stuff thats been confirmed by the very people who make the games.

think about the back story for WW. it says that Ganondorf was sealed away by the hero of time. that ONLY happens when Link is an adult. it also says that the hero of time disappeared and when the evil escaped he didnt return. after Link beats Ganondorf in OoT he is sent back to his childhood (aka he disappears) so when Ganondorf escapes hes not there to save the people.

the back story for TP shows Ganondorf being executed as a result of plotting against the royal family. this quite obviously takes place when Link is back in his childhood. its believed that he tells the royal family of his adventures through time so the royal family arrests Ganondorf and sentences him to death.
 
C

Caleb, Of Asui

Guest
I can't believe that some people are still arguing about whether or not the timeline is split. I'll admit that before Nintendo announced that the timeline was split, I was of the opinion that it was not split. I thought it would be too confusing, too. I'm going with what Nintendo says now, though. Twilight Princess makes the split work better.

Now, as for the Four Swords games (coughbackontopiccough), I consider The Minish Cap and Four Swords to be before Ocarina of Time, thus effecting both timelines, and Four Swords Adventures to be a prequel to A Link to the Past in the child timeline. Miyamoto said somewhere, prior to TMC's release, that he considers Four Swords to be first.

Since TMC and FS are able to effect both timelines, it's possible that we might see Vaati in another game in the Adult Timeline. They might do that with Spirit Tracks, though it's doubtful.

One thing I want to ask is: what in The Minish Cap, other than moblins, clearly states that it's NOT before Ocarina of Time, as the first post mentions? I don't think the moblins are another form of Ganon or whatever, so saying anything about that won't convince me.
 

Zemen

[Insert Funny Statement]
Joined
Nov 11, 2008
Location
Illinois
Miyamoto said somewhere, prior to TMC's release, that he considers Four Swords to be first.

Since TMC and FS are able to effect both timelines, it's possible that we might see Vaati in another game in the Adult Timeline. They might do that with Spirit Tracks, though it's doubtful.

One thing I want to ask is: what in The Minish Cap, other than moblins, clearly states that it's NOT before Ocarina of Time, as the first post mentions? I don't think the moblins are another form of Ganon or whatever, so saying anything about that won't convince me.

for starters, i want to say that i believe that MC is the first game in the timeline. i am still rocky on where i would put FS but i do believe that MC is first in the timeline. everything i am about to say isnt because i dont believe thats where it goes, but its just to answer your question and play devils advocate.

reasons as to why MC WOULDNT be before OoT.

1. you already mentioned moblins and people believe that moblins were made by Ganon or something like that (i dont like this reason).

2. the fact that when you look at the map and its the zoomed out map it shows two islands which is a sign of an ocean which COULD mean that it is right after the flood before WW or it takes place not too long after WW.

3. the mentioning of the triumph forks in the library in MC. in WW, the fish would talk about triumph forks which was a messed up way of saying triforce. in MC, there is a book in the library and im not sure what the book actually says but i know that "triumph forks" is in the book. this implies that the game comes after WW which is the only other game to mention triumph forks. (many speculate that the mentioning of the triumph forks is just an easter egg and nothing more).

4. when you get the figuring that talks about din, nayru and farore (the girls in MC that resemble the goddesses), their descriptions say that they are descendants of a line of oracles from Labrynna/Holodrum which is evidence that MC is actually supposed to take place after OoX (which CANT be before OoT). a counter argument to that is that the oracles in OoT could be descendants of the girls in MC which would then mean that MC could still be before OoT.

thats pretty much the only decent evidence for it to not be before OoT.

reasons why it could be before OoT:

1. no menioning of Ganon/dorf WHATSOEVER. its the only Hyrule based game to not have ganon/dorf in the game. this implies that no one knows about Ganon/dorf, he hasnt been born yet, etc...

2. the BS of this game does not seem to resemble any other Zelda game and also talks about a hero that seems to NOT be Link. this implies that this is the first Link to have an adventure.

3. this game seems to show the origins of the hat.

4. the hero of men captured monsters and locked them in the chest with the four sword. when Vaati opens that chest, he releases the monsters. this might explain why there are monsters in Hyrule throughout the series. kind of like a pandora's box idea. ill explain.

evil was sealed away in a box. pandora was told not to open that box. she did and she released evil onto the world, but she also released some hope, as well.

monsters were sealed away in the chest. Vaati was told not to open that chest. he did and he released monsters onto the world, but by opening the chest, he left the broken sword which was the only weapon powerful enough to stop him. so in essence, the four sword was the hope that was released with the monsters.

basically, it could explain why there are monsters in the world of Zelda.
 
R

rocker_3

Guest
it IS right. this is all stuff thats been confirmed by the very people who make the games.

think about the back story for WW. it says that Ganondorf was sealed away by the hero of time. that ONLY happens when Link is an adult. it also says that the hero of time disappeared and when the evil escaped he didnt return. after Link beats Ganondorf in OoT he is sent back to his childhood (aka he disappears) so when Ganondorf escapes hes not there to save the people.

the back story for TP shows Ganondorf being executed as a result of plotting against the royal family. this quite obviously takes place when Link is back in his childhood. its believed that he tells the royal family of his adventures through time so the royal family arrests Ganondorf and sentences him to death.

but if link went back in time, that makes adult link non-existant at the time. the legend of the hero of time started with the adult link in OoT, but if he never existed (or killed ganondorf and saved hyrule) how is there that legend?
nintendo HAS said that OoT started the hero of time legend that has been going on throughout the series
 

DvSag

The Void in the Triforce
Joined
Mar 4, 2009
Location
New Jersey
But do you notice how they reference the Hero of Time in WW (who just so happens to be adult Link), yet there is no reference to him in TP. That's because Link as a child didn't gain that title. (However, it is strongly believed that the dead swordsman who teaches you techniques is that same Link from OoT.)
 
R

rocker_3

Guest
but there is a reference in TP, why else would link have a green suit! while hes gettin it, the spirit says its the clothes worn by the old hero.

also, another thing i noticed is where the master sword is in each game. in Oot, its in the temple of time, in hyrule castle town. in tp, its in the lost woods, in the ruins of the temple of time. ithought the temple of time was in hyrule castle town! in alltp, its in the lost woods, and there doesnt seem to be any ruins, but in wind waker, its in hyrule castle!!!
 

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