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General Zelda The Zelda Story - Is It Too Happy?

Ventus

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Be forewarned; I do realize that the Zelda format for story is "hero saves the world".

Anyway, what I'm going on with this thread is an age old question (well...age old since OoT anyway): is the typical Zelda story too happy for you personally? How would you change the overall mood and tone of it for future installments? As a bonus, which Zelda game was the happiest? The least happy?
 

SNOlink

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I don't really see the Zelda stories as too happy. Think about it, there are some pretty dark and somewhat depressing parts of Zelda. Like with OoT, when you first go to the future, you see the full force of drawing the Master Sword: the entire Market has been burned and there are ReDeads everywhere. Not only that, but the Gorons are captured, the Kokori Forest is under siege by forest monsters, and the Zoras are frozen solid. These are pretty dark events in the story. Aside from this you have basically the plot for MM, the world becoming attacked by Twili forces in TP, Tetra turning to stone in PH, and Zelda sealing herself away no matter how much Link protests in SS.
 
the Zelda story presents itself in a light way but most of the time its pretty dark going, take the Hero of Time for example; his parents were killed and he was raised by a tree, heavy stuff. In WW, the most happy go lucky art style ever seen in Zelda we spend nearly the entire game sailing over a graveyard, being beaten to a pulp and watching people kill themselves while the gods of old mourn for what once was. then you have ALttP with serial kidnappings and sacrifices, SS with its war backdrop and MC with a guy seemingly attempting genocide. TP and MM go without mentioning that theyre dark on their own.

If the tone and artstyles were changed in Zelda to more drab and ark and heavy feeling aesthetics then the series would probably be thought of as being quite dark. As it is though, the way it presents itself for me is a bit too happy for me, though every now and again it doesnt matter when a game is as good as WW and every now and again we get games like TP and MM =]
 

Justac00lguy

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Of course we all know that the stereotypical story of Zelda games.....Zelda gets kidnapped by evil villain, Link then goes out on a quest tomsave Zelda and he finally defeats the boss and saves Zelda as well as Hyrule!

I think that not only have Zelda games have advanced in terms of narrative but also by adding darker or more mature themes! This was certainly present in Majoras Mask and Twilight Princess and I would have to say that it was a fresh change to the original light hearted story! It gave a sense of fear and danger to the game which made me care more for the story and it's characters!

I would definitely say that Zelda games need to have a good balance of light and dark themes as well as plots to maintain the charm of the franchise as well as to build a greater emphasis on realistic danger within the story.
 

Castle

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Looking back on it, while it may have not been as apparent as it is now, the Zelda stories have been rather dark, just not on the surface. ALttP had its dark moments. Agahnim trapping young girls in crystal and locking them deep underground surrounded by monsters, Flute Boy. Ocarina of Time. The Shadow Temple. The attempted genocide of the Gorons and Zoras... and let's not forget the whole Link's Awakening thing. You get the idea. At this time, however, the nature of the stories were quite dark if you really thought about it.

More recently however, the stories have gotten darker on the surface. Twilight Princess, obviously. And Majora's Mask is a given. But even Skyward Sword for all its colorful visuals features an extremely dark story that is so foreboding it honestly makes me nervous.

Mature... some might say sophisticated storytelling starts with treating it more akin to reality. This can lend some credibility to a fantasy adventure, but overall I prefer my fiction to at least end happily. There is enough death and depression IRL and each night on the evening news. I don't like having it in my fiction. But it's good storytelling regardless.

If Zelda were to tell darker stories I would at least prefer a fairy tale ending.
 

DarkestLink

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Some like MM and tWW are a little too happy for me, but I'm not really concerned seeing as story isn't exactly a focus either.
 

Random Person

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I think TP did a decent job of straying away from the "happy" atmosphere. It's not so much "happy" as it is "light." This is generally how I get into the MM verses TP conversations. Many people claim that MM is the darkest Zelda game. MM is a very sad game until the very end with the credits, but the game presents a very lighthearted atmosphere. I feel TP strayed away from this. Not only with its dark colors, but just how it presented itself. Even when times were happy, they were "serious" happy times (if that makes any sense). Though there was some comedy, it wasn't so much that it distracted you from the rest or the story, or it was followed by more serious moments. Zelda in general is a bit too light. I don't mind it, especially when games like TP get released every so often, but I would like to see the Zelda series stay in that general "dark" direction for a while.
 
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Zelda is definitely not "too" happy. It bears a happier, more lighthearted edge than a lot of other franchises, yes, but it's not sunshine and giggles all around. It's more about the light pushing through the darkness than the darkness itself; it encourages players to find their own inner heroes and be brave, which is part of why Link's status as a connection to the player is so important.

I think in general, Zelda should pull a lot of its story inspiration from Fire Emblem. FE is not really a "dark" series, but neither is it notably happy and lighthearted. Zelda is much the same way, but the difference is in story execution. Fire Emblem gives you frequent humor, sometimes stereotypical but oh-so-enjoyable characters, and shies away from the "harsh" end of the spectrum (for instance, in Radiant Dawn, Almedha is implied to be Ashnard's concubine, but it never goes much deeper than this). At the same time, it isn't afraid to show you character death, ugly betrayal, and implications of things like torture and sex. It's not a "dark" series, but neither is it considered "light." It has an excellent balance of the two, and it usually has a deep, emotional, interesting plot with few to no plot holes.

Zelda needs to be the same. It needs to retain its general balance of light-to-dark, but flesh the plot out so it's deep, emotional, and interesting with few to no plot holes. It really hasn't done this so far, even if its stories have been fun, so I say take a leaf out of Fire Emblem's book.
 

Kirino

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the Zelda story presents itself in a light way but most of the time its pretty dark going, take the Hero of Time for example; his parents were killed and he was raised by a tree, heavy stuff. In WW, the most happy go lucky art style ever seen in Zelda we spend nearly the entire game sailing over a graveyard, being beaten to a pulp and watching people kill themselves while the gods of old mourn for what once was. then you have ALttP with serial kidnappings and sacrifices, SS with its war backdrop and MC with a guy seemingly attempting genocide. TP and MM go without mentioning that theyre dark on their own.

I don't really think these things really make Zelda all that dark. You only notice these if you actually look deep. They're pretty subtle. I see a lot of "kiddy games" (for lack of better words) with such themes, yet I never see them as dark, because they aren't presented as such. If you're making a dark game, atmosphere is probably the most important thing.

Some like MM are too happy

wut
 
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I don't see the Zelda story line as TOO happy. Like, Midna almost dies in TP, Fi has to leave Link in SS, and most of the cutscenes are a little sad sometimes
 

DarkestLink

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Seeing as MM went out of its way to dig itself into over 20 plotholes (not exaggerating) for the sake of giving everyone a happy ending, not to mention the cheery attitude and atmosphere of the central hub along with its inhabitants...yeah I found it to be a little too happy at times.
 
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No, because in the end that's what Zelda should be, an idealistic story of good versus evil through trials and tribulations of our young hero Link. While it isn't completely happy, some like King Daphnes or Skyward Sword Impa get a bittersweet ending, in the end good triumphs.
 

Kirino

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Seeing as MM went out of its way to dig itself into over 20 plotholes (not exaggerating) for the sake of giving everyone a happy ending, not to mention the cheery attitude and atmosphere of the central hub along with its inhabitants...yeah I found it to be a little too happy at times.

The music might have been cheery, but everyone was depressed, and everything was going wrong. Romani is experimented by aliens and kidnapped (especially creepy if you visit her afterwards and her mind is completely messed up), someone openly contemplates suicide and asks what the point of living is when he's just going to die anyways, the whole Anju and Kafei quest, ghosts of the dead haunting you, a creepy zombified mummy and her daughter, a missing child, a scary moon that used to literally give me nightmares, the whole Ikana portion, ect. The general tone was pretty creepy, and somewhat depressing at times; it was just masked by happy music and stuff. Just going around and talking to characters and doing sidequests makes you realize just how dark it gets. The main story also has a fair share of creepy moments. Also, have you ever been to Clock Town on the 3rd day? It's creepy af.
 

DarkestLink

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The music might have been cheery, but everyone was depressed,

They should have been...but they weren't. We have happy jugglers entertaining the public with carefree jolly kids who want to help everyone. The guards seem normal and on the job. The construction workers don't seem worried. All except that one guy (who you can barely notice) are just doing their jobs without a care in the world. The mailman seems content with his work. But this is the outside...inside? It's more or less the same. Anju rarely expresses emotion except in one isolated scene. The circus performers don't seem depressed (the twins seemed more concerned with their dance really) and almost nobody seems to have a care in the world.

and everything was going wrong.

This is what could (and should) have happened. But Majora's Mask dug itself into multiple plot holes just to make sure that everyone was happy and sacrificed the integrity of the story.

Romani is experimented by aliens and kidnapped (especially creepy if you visit her afterwards and her mind is completely messed up),

Well...that COULD have happened...but nah. Instead she magically prevails and convinces her sister to support her efforts. She should be mentally screwed up, but Nintendo decided even though Link didn't help her, she succeeded anyway and got a happy ending.

someone openly contemplates suicide and asks what the point of living is when he's just going to die anyways,

Uh huh...I've been MM loads of times. Never saw it. Who and where is this person?

the whole Anju and Kafei quest,

Which ends up working out in the end....when it shouldn't have.

a scary moon that used to literally give me nightmares,

I actually thought it looked silly...

The general tone was pretty creepy,

For Ikana canyon? Yeah. But the rest just seemed overly jolly or uncaring.

and somewhat depressing at times;

I saw more depression from OoT's character--or at least they seemed to care somewhat.

Just going around and talking to characters and doing sidequests makes you realize just how dark it gets. The main story also has a fair share of creepy moments. Also, have you ever been to Clock Town on the 3rd day? It's creepy af.

Nobody seems to care even then until midnight...but this is too isolated to effect the actual mood of the game. The ending was just ridiculously and obnoxiously happy though. ...It's like if OoT end with a sudden burst of light that just brought all the people Ganondorf killed back to life and restored the ruined land back to its former glory Okami style.
 

Castle

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OHAI DarkestLink

Ya know Clocktown in Majora's Mask is supposed to look cheery on the surface. If you pay attention it's pretty obvious half the populace is morbidly depressed and the other half is in anxious denial. This is a statement on how most everyone would rather deal with a life ending crisis... deny it. The sad truth is that pretending you're not FUBAR'd isn't gonna make the threat go away, but everyone just figured that there wasn't anything they could do about a planetary body that's come crashing down on top of them.

Mass Effect presented the same notion, with a whole galaxy under threat of extinction by a race of super advanced titanic starships. In Majora's Mask, guess who proved them wrong? There's your happy ending. If you want the bad ending you can just let time run out over and over again.
 

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