The Worthiness of The Master Sword

[SpiritOfTheHero]

Because if he's being fed all the tools and powerss by someone else and just being guided around by a chosen one leash, he's not really a hero, just some divine errand boy. Links spends almost no time making any decisions for himself and spends the vast majority of it being told to go and do something.

The only Link I'd say really has much agency is Linkle.

Okay, so how about this? Link in Wind Waker makes pretty much every decision for himself. He wasn't born worthy, he made himself worthy. Do you still think that Link was chosen? It was already established that he had no connection to the Hero of Time in the game. The only reason he did what he did was to save his sister. The same can be said about Link from Twilight Princess. His decision to become the new Hero was fuelled by a desire to save his friends. The only Link we can say was born from the get-go to follow divine instruction was the Hero of Time. And so what if there is divine instruction? It doesn't mean anything. I'm not a fan of this "anybody can do it" mentality.

 

[Bowsette Plus-Ultra]

Okay, so how about this? Link in Wind Waker makes pretty much every decision for himself. He wasn't born worthy, he made himself worthy. Do you still think that Link was chosen? It was already established that he had no connection to the Hero of Time in the game. The only reason he did what he did was to save his sister. The same can be said about Link from Twilight Princess. His decision to become the new Hero was fuelled by a desire to save his friends. The only Link we can say was born from the get-go to follow divine instruction was the Hero of Time. And so what if there is divine instruction? It doesn't mean anything. I'm not a fan of this "anybody can do it" mentality.

Their initial actions were fueled by said desire. The Link of Wind Waker made the choice to go with Tetra and the Link of Twilight Princess chose to chase after his friends. The moment both of those decisions led to trouble, they were grabbed by the nearest companion and guided by the hand for the rest of the game with no decision making involved.

 

[SpiritOfTheHero]

Their initial actions were fueled by said desire. The Link of Wind Waker made the choice to go with Tetra and the Link of Twilight Princess chose to chase after his friends. The moment both of those decisions led to trouble, they were grabbed by the nearest companion and guided by the hand for the rest of the game with no decision making involved.

I disagree. Link is free to explore and participate in side quests on his own volition. He can choose when he'll continue his main quest and his problem-solving skills are a nature of his own too. There is little in the way of guidance beyond those around him giving him potential clues about where he should go next. For instance, to thaw Zora's Domain in Twilight Princess, Link had to locate a sufficient heat source, but no one was telling him where it was. He utilized his own memory and knowledge of Hyrule's geography to locate one. I think there is a plethora of decision making involved.

 

[Bowsette Plus-Ultra]

I disagree. Link is free to explore and participate in side quests on his own volition. He can choose when he'll continue his main quest and his problem-solving skills are a nature of his own too. There is little in the way of guidance beyond those around him giving him potential clues about where he should go next. For instance, to thaw Zora's Domain in Twilight Princess, Link had to locate a sufficient heat source, but no one was telling him where it was. He utilized his own memory and knowledge of Hyrule's geography to locate one. I think there is a plethora of decision making involved.

Choosing to complete side-quests is more of a choice that a player makes from a gameplay perspective.

Within each game's main story, Link never makes any meaningful choices. He's always being guided along by a companion, a boat, or some spirit-y thing that keeps him on a specific path with little opportunity for deviation or agency. In later games, he's usually just told exactly where to go. The closest analogue is a Call of Duty protagonist, where they say nothing and only ever do what they're told.

 

[SpiritOfTheHero]

Choosing to complete side-quests is more of a choice that a player makes from a gameplay perspective.

Within each game's main story, Link never makes any meaningful choices. He's always being guided along by a companion, a boat, or some spirit-y thing that keeps him on a specific path with little opportunity for deviation or agency. In later games, he's usually just told exactly where to go. The closest analogue is a Call of Duty protagonist, where they say nothing and only ever do what they're told.

Well again, from the perspective of LoZ, as a world saturated with the supernatural, there is nothing wrong with divine guidance or instruction. I know it seems like Link has little in the way of moral choices but he's got a lot more free will than you think he does. He didn't have to answer his call to destiny by the Light Spirits in Twilight Princess. He could have said, "Hey listen, I'm just worried about my friends. Everything else you're telling me about Hyrule is none of my concern, I'm just a goat wrangler from Ordon. This is too big for me." But he never went there. It would have been terribly irresponsible of him to ignore the big picture in Hyrule. By saving Hyrule from the evil that was destroying it, he was also safeguarding his friends at the same time. His interests were aligned with that of the goddesses. Remember, he is under the protection and blessing of Faore because he bears her mark, the Triforce of Courage. He was morally obligated to become the Hero, it was in his blood as being the descendant of the Hero of Time. As astonishing as it may seem, believe it or not, but lifestyles used to be dictated based on lineage, not on choices. So, whether Link desired it or not, he was born worthy from the get-go.

 

[Bowsette Plus-Ultra]

Well again, from the perspective of LoZ, as a world saturated with the supernatural, there is nothing wrong with divine guidance or instruction. I know it seems like Link has little in the way of moral choices but he's got a lot more free will than you think he does. He didn't have to answer his call to destiny by the Light Spirits in Twilight Princess. He could have said, "Hey listen, I'm just worried about my friends. Everything else you're telling me about Hyrule is none of my concern, I'm just a goat wrangler from Ordon. This is too big for me." But he never went there. It would have been terribly irresponsible of him to ignore the big picture in Hyrule. By saving Hyrule from the evil that was destroying it, he was also safeguarding his friends at the same time. His interests were aligned with that of the goddesses. Remember, he is under the protection and blessing of Faore because he bears her mark, the Triforce of Courage. He was morally obligated to become the Hero, it was in his blood as being the descendant of the Hero of Time. As astonishing as it may seem, believe it or not, but lifestyles used to be dictated based on lineage, not on choices. So, whether Link desired it or not, he was born worthy from the get-go.

Not saying there's anything wrong with it from the perspective of Legend of Zelda's world, but there is an issue with it from a storytelling perspective. The moment I see a hero who is blessed, chosen, protected, or destined to do something, my interest wanes, because that hero's decisions are no longer their own. A hero must make their own decisions, lest they become nothing more than a divine errand boy.

Heroes aren't born, they're made and all that.

 

[SpiritOfTheHero]

Not saying there's anything wrong with it from the perspective of Legend of Zelda's world, but there is an issue with it from a storytelling perspective. The moment I see a hero who is blessed, chosen, protected, or destined to do something, my interest wanes, because that hero's decisions are no longer their own. A hero must make their own decisions, lest they become nothing more than a divine errand boy.

Heroes aren't born, they're made and all that.

I would argue that the Link from Skyward Sword would best fit your description. He made himself worthy of being the Hero, and of course the Link from Wind Waker. They weren't born heroes, they made themselves heroes. Still, when it comes to a fantasy world, I prefer when a hero is special and not ordinary. It's been a staple of epic poems for centuries. Heroes tended to be semidivine in nature or sometimes even demigods. And it's in keeping with modern day heroes as well. Most heroes have superpowers therefore they are superheroes.

 

[Bowsette Plus-Ultra]

I would argue that the Link from Skyward Sword would best fit your description. He made himself worthy of being the Hero, and of course the Link from Wind Waker. They weren't born heroes, they made themselves heroes. Still, when it comes to a fantasy world, I prefer when a hero is special and not ordinary. It's been a staple of epic poems for centuries. Heroes tended to be semidivine in nature or sometimes even demigods. And it's in keeping with modern day heroes as well. Most heroes have superpowers therefore they are superheroes.

We probably just have different storytelling preferences. You okay with calling a truce so we aren't just going back and forth?

 

[SpiritOfTheHero]

We probably just have different storytelling preferences. You okay with calling a truce so we aren't just going back and forth?

Yeah, that's no problem with me. Honestly, the back and forth was fun. You got in some excellent points.

 

[el :BeoWolf:]

The Master Sword was forged by the hero of the sky by bathing it in the three sacred flames and then blessed by Hylia. Fi of course Recognized him as her master and remembered his traits from physical to emotional. This would become the basis for which all later heroes were judged on, this is the spirit of the hero, not a literal soul but rather a list of traits Fi feels that are needed of a hero. The reason Ghirahim could take it was only cause he was an illusion created by the thunder dragon's lightning round which came from Link's memory of that technique, so if Ghirahim actually tried this with a fully powered master sword he would fail. The Goddess sword is easy to pick up because it was the flame of Din that gave the sword it's power to repel evil.
The hero of time had to collect three spiritual stones which reflect his predecessor's journey for three sacred flames. Fi determined Link was too young and sealed him until he was close enough in age to wield the sword, however this allowed evil to take over so that clause was eliminated thus why the hero of winds wasn't sealed, or any younger hero.
The hero of twilight beared a much closer resemblance to the first hero so was easily able to acquire the sword but not before an exorcism/removal of Zant's curse. Plus it's quite possible that he had the triforce of courage as further claim.
The heroes of legend(ALttP) and hero of the triforce (ALBW) both had to collect three pendants which too reflected the first wielder of the sword.
The hero of winds had to once again collect the three pearls and then take on the tower of the gods before getting the master sword however Fi being a self improving a.i. of sorts did not seal him away since that didn't end well last time.
The hero of the wild was easily able to get the sword as well but his failure made Fi add a clause that the hero must be particularly stronger than most and would drain the life force of anyone who attempted taking the sword as a test of strength so they don't die like a certain hero almost did. Zelda always gets a free pass due to her connection to Hylia. However this begs the question why the strength clause occured in BotW and not in ALttP where the hero of time also failed.