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"The Hero of the Past"

Shadsie

Sage of Tales
Holy Triforce, I'm making a Timeline topic. May the Goddesses have mercy on my soul. (Too brave for your own good, Shadsie. Farore, be with me?)

I don't want this to turn into a fight because, frankly, I don't give a rat's hiney about the Timeline. I've seen many different ideas upon it and I tend to lean toward "whatever the creators say" as being canon - this is called "Word of God" on TV Tropes. Read more here: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/WordOfGod Though, with Nintendo, I'm not quite sure... since they seem to make a game, then decide where it's supposed to fit and honestly, some of it doesn't make sense to me.

Now, I am a writer (though I may not be a professional just yet). Plot is God to me. I write and I edit and re-edit and recheck my work to make sure a given plot of whatever I'm working on is internally consistent. I also write a lot, and I do mean a lot, of fan fiction for the various entertainments/other peoples' stories I get obessed over. Whenever I am writing fanfiction for something, I re-check canon to make sure I'm getting details right (even as I'm doing my own thing) and in this way, I tend to find plotholes in the things I like. The Legend of Zelda is no different. Plotholes ahoy!

(Not necessarily a bad thing. Plotholes inspire me to write fanfiction)

This is why I don't tend to care about sent in stone Timelines very much... I see everyone fighting, my brain starts spinning, it's already filled with the notations of a milion plotholes and I wind up writing my own kind of thing, anyway (incudling a WIP right now that *purposefully* ignores Timeline Split because my co-writer and I didn't agree on the Timeline when we concieved the basic story and we wanted to do lots of refrence-cramming). I'm very flexible on the Timeline issue, so, if you start fighting, folks, and I'll just ignore you. Anyway...

Now, to the point of my post...

Supposing "Word of God" here isn't quick n' dirty plot butt-pulling (and I say this out of respect, sometimes the heart and soul of writing is knowing how to butt-pull ) and is/should be the correct Timeline, there is something about the Child Timeline between Ocarina of Time and Twilight Princess that's always confused me...

In Twilight Princess, Link is compared a lot to "The Hero of the Past" (presumably, the Hero of Time). This past Hero is said to have saved Hyrule from its darkest times. (I believe Renado said something to that effect, if anyone can bring up a quote, it would be appreciated).

If this takes place in the Child Timeline, where Hero of Time Link goes back in time to be a kid, goes to Termina, and all that business in Ocarina of Time where he sealed Ganondorf away in dramatic fashion did not happen...

How the heck do they know of his greatness in the TP era?

To answer my own question a bit, perhaps Hero of Time Link came back from Termina and did lots of other cool stuff... and, as is generally thought, warned the King with Zelda about Ganny and prevented him from rising to power and so forth.

Still, guy who's name I forget how to spell said something about the Child Timeline being a "pacified timeline."

If it was pacified, peaceful... and the Hero of Time just pretty much got to grow up in nice times... where is the drama that would make him the grand Hero that everyone would be looking back on and holding in reference in his decendant's/successor's era (Twilight Princess era)?

[This has always bothered me a bit. The result of this, so far, has been a post OoT/MM fanfiction from me that has, as part of its plot, a detailed description of how Link was essentially "split" when he was sent back in time, history in Hyrule repeated itself, and young Link spent several years in Termina before returning to Hyrule simply to avoid a temporal paradox from running into himself. (Now, before you start tearing me to shreds, this is JUST A FANFIC and nothing I'm proclaiming as canon... it's just my way of "filling in a plothole" for personal pleasure)].

Anybody got any (non-violent!!!) thoughts on this?

*Holds up hands, awaiting the stones.*
 
Joined
May 16, 2008
Location
Kentucky, USA
Really that is kind of an un-answerable question. It is really all left up to theories. I can only tell you what my theory would be on the subject, because I do not remember that quote (not saying it isn't there, I'm sure it is), but a similar thing was brought up once about recieving the Hero's Clothes (green tunic).

Here is my idea. First, Link told Zelda not only about Ganondorf and what he was going to do, thus preventing it, but also told her about his adventures in the future, and what he did to stop Ganondorf. These tales would have been passed down and by the time of TP, would probably be a legend spoken amongst its people. Thus, Link literally saved Hyrule from its darkest times by preventing them from ever happening.

Some people also assume that the Hero's Clothes thing was referring to Child Link, who actually done quite a bit himself in his time during OoT. The clothes you recieve are stiched together in places, so its possible that they had to be fitted to suit an adult from their original size which went on Young Link. As for that quote, well I don't know much about what to say for this theory. I'd rather go with my first option to explain that.
 

angelkid

TRR = SWEET
Joined
Apr 19, 2009
Well, I think that it is to do with Link saving the Zora's, Gorons and Kokiris as a child. If you look closely, you will see that the game never refers to the past Link as the 'Hero of Time,' merely as a great hero. To me this proves that noone was told about what Link did in the future. Also, one of the main people who gives reference to the past Hero is the Spirit of the ghost Zora, she tells us of garments which her husband made for a 'Chosen Hero.' Now, if this Chosen hero is OoT Link, then that makes sense because we know that Link saved King Zora's daughter Ruto, and spiritual god, Jabu Jabu. He would therefore surely be in the Kings favour and the king would certainly refer to his as a hero.

There is argument that this tunic is not the same as that in OoT because the change of design and the fact that you could buy those tunics in the Zora shop. I think the explanations of these two things are simple. The reason the design is different is simply because Nintendo have all this shiny new software. They are going to want to show it off. Also, with the tunics being sold at the shop. I believe this is because they probably weren't originally in the game, but then when the 'Like-Likes' could steal your Tunics. They HAD to make it possible to acquire another tunic otherwise the game could be impossible. So I think the tunics being sold in the shops is not storyline significant and not something that should be considered when taking this into consideration.

As for your theory about MM Link coming back and doing lots of other 'cool things.' I have to disagree. It is said that MM Link never finds his way back from termina (unfortunately as I think this is a cheap, safe and boring move by Nintendo when we could have seen alot more from this Link. It all means his whole quest was pointless as, though I have not finished the game yet, I seriously doubt Navi (I heard it is Navi he is looking for,) ever finds her way to Termina.) I think it is more Likely that there could be a 'missing Link' inbetween who comes and does alot of heroic things, and he is who all the inhabitants of TP are talking about.
 

Zeruda

Mother Hyrule
Joined
May 17, 2009
Location
on a crumbling throne
As for your theory about MM Link coming back and doing lots of other 'cool things.' I have to disagree. It is said that MM Link never finds his way back from termina (unfortunately as I think this is a cheap, safe and boring move by Nintendo when we could have seen alot more from this Link. It all means his whole quest was pointless as, though I have not finished the game yet, I seriously doubt Navi (I heard it is Navi he is looking for,) ever finds her way to Termina.) I think it is more Likely that there could be a 'missing Link' inbetween who comes and does alot of heroic things, and he is who all the inhabitants of TP are talking about.
When and where was this (bolded text) stated? I don't recall hearing or reading that. As far as I knew, Link did make it back to Hyrule, hence the prologue:
"In the land of Hyrule, there echoes a legend. A legend held dearly by the Royal Family that tells of a boy... A boy who, after battling evil and saving Hyrule, crept away from the land that had made him a legend... Done with the battles he once waged across time, he embarked on a journey. A secret and personal journey... A journey in search of a beloved and invaluable friend... A friend with whom he parted ways when he finally fulfilled his heroic destiny and took his place among legends..."


The bolded/pink text would imply that he had returned to Hyrule, or else the Royal Family would not know of this Terminan quest.


In Twilight Princess, Link is compared a lot to "The Hero of the Past" (presumably, the Hero of Time). This past Hero is said to have saved Hyrule from its darkest times. (I believe Renado said something to that effect, if anyone can bring up a quote, it would be appreciated).

If this takes place in the Child Timeline, where Hero of Time Link goes back in time to be a kid, goes to Termina, and all that business in Ocarina of Time where he sealed Ganondorf away in dramatic fashion did not happen...

How the heck do they know of his greatness in the TP era?

To answer my own question a bit, perhaps Hero of Time Link came back from Termina and did lots of other cool stuff... and, as is generally thought, warned the King with Zelda about Ganny and prevented him from rising to power and so forth.
I believe my quote from the prologue answers that. The prologue says that the story held dearly by the Royal Family contains information of both his Time Traveling adventure to save Hyrule and his adventure to find his fairy companion in Termina.

Basically, history. Legend, even. It is possible, however, that he had to save Hyrule from another threat once he came back from Termina, or even several years later. But it's more than likely because the legends that the Royal Family hold are of great importance.

[AONUMA]
"In the last scene of Ocarina of Time, kids Link and Zelda have a little talk. As a consequence of that talk, their relationship with Ganon takes a whole new direction. In the middle of this game [Twilight Princess], there's a scene showing Ganon being executed, right? Link and Zelda left him be and he then did something outrageous, so it was decided he should be executed. That scene takes place several years after Ocarina of Time. Ganon was sent to another world and now he wants to obtain that power..."


This quote is enough to let us know that the Royal Family would become aware of his adventure saving Hyrule (time travel and the likes), so even if he never made it back from Termina (which I firmly believe he did), there would still be a legend of his heroics.
 

Shadsie

Sage of Tales
Very good theroies. I suppose such legends would be believed because Zelda has mystical psychic powers and stuff and would know that Link is telling the truth. It's still kind of weird to me that he'd become such a legend in the hearts of the people without them having actually seen some of his great Adult Timeline deeds.

I think he would have had to come back from Termina at some point because isn't TP Link explicity supposed to be his blood descendant? If so, young Link would have to grow up, find a girl, and make babies - and those babies, at least would have to be in/or make their way back to Hyrule.
 

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