So recently Did You Know Gaming? took a deep dive into the cancelled Sheikah inspired Zelda game that Retro Studios was working on. That's interesting news in of itself, and has been news that publications have been reporting on whenever little tidbits about the project have popped up in the past. There is an aspect of this story that I think has been overlooked that I think we should definitely be talking more about: it may have confirmed the Downfall Timeline was a thing before Hyrule Historia.
I basically went over it in this Twitter thread, but I will convert that here for discussion.
Back in 2020, concept art for Retro Studio's planned Sheikah-inspired Zelda game was uncovered right under our noses on Sammy Hall's ArtStation. Now at the time, the big news was simply that this was a real concept, as it had been an unconfirmed rumor for over a decade. Alongside the artwork, we got this description on the plot of the game: "Fun pre-pre-pre-production origin story of the Master Sword, [Set] within the bad ending of Ocarina of Time..." Quote via Eurogamer. Of course, this was reported on alongside the artwork, but I don't think any publication realized how big of a deal this could be, as it seems to reference the Hero Fails, or Downfall Timeline. Admittingly, even I missed it despite having been a gaming journalist for the last 3 years.
This plot concept was for a game planned from 2005-2008. Back then Nintendo confirmed the Zelda Timeline existed, but people were still skeptical. Furthermore, the Hero Fails ending of Ocarina of Time was not something ever considered by fans until the publication of Hyrule Historia in 2011, which finally revealed Nintendo's Official Zelda Timeline. Even after Hyrule Historia, people have thought the Zelda Timeline was nothing more than an afterthought created for the book, and not something that has existed as a framework for any lengthy period of time. Among the fans who did believe the timeline existed in the past, The Downfall Timeline split came under harsh scrutiny. Many of them believed it especially was something fabricated for the book alone, and many fans still hold to that view currently.
The plot concept for Retro's Sheikah game could indicate that the Downfall Timeline did exist in the past, at least definitely by 2005, but probably even earlier. It also would seem it was not just knowledge internally within Nintendo, but also shared with subsidiaries. From the sounds of it, the Zelda Timeline and information on the series would be a starting point for idea generation — which is why the plot concept for this Sheikah game specifies where it would have been located on the timeline.
Now, I realize technically this concept, in terms of Zelda canon, makes no sense. If this game takes place after Ocarina of Time, the Master Sword already exists so an origin story doesn't really work unless the game was supposed to be set before Ocarina of Time. That said, I don't really expect a concept artist who worked at Retro, or really anyone at Retro, to know every single detail about the Zelda Timeline or Zelda lore considering they'd never worked on a Zelda game before. It's also possible Nintendo rejected the game precisely because the plot didn't make sense, aside from the other issues it ran into. Regardless, the Hero Fails ending being mentioned at all is surprising, and could indicate that it has existed as a concept way before Hyrule Historia.
I am considering the possibility of that detail being added later by Sammy Hall while he was recalling details on the game. It's my job as a journalist to remain skeptical, afterall. I'm not sure if it makes sense for him to just randomly add that detail though. This is by no means a smoking gun, but it could be something. If it is, it confirms details on the Zelda Timeline that should drastically change perceptions of it's validity regarding whether it existed in the past, and likewise the legitimacy of the Downfall Timeline.
I'm interested to hear thoughts on this. I find this bit of info really intersting and I think it might be a glimpse behind the scenes on the really early stages of concept design for Zelda games, in terms of plot.
I basically went over it in this Twitter thread, but I will convert that here for discussion.
Back in 2020, concept art for Retro Studio's planned Sheikah-inspired Zelda game was uncovered right under our noses on Sammy Hall's ArtStation. Now at the time, the big news was simply that this was a real concept, as it had been an unconfirmed rumor for over a decade. Alongside the artwork, we got this description on the plot of the game: "Fun pre-pre-pre-production origin story of the Master Sword, [Set] within the bad ending of Ocarina of Time..." Quote via Eurogamer. Of course, this was reported on alongside the artwork, but I don't think any publication realized how big of a deal this could be, as it seems to reference the Hero Fails, or Downfall Timeline. Admittingly, even I missed it despite having been a gaming journalist for the last 3 years.
This plot concept was for a game planned from 2005-2008. Back then Nintendo confirmed the Zelda Timeline existed, but people were still skeptical. Furthermore, the Hero Fails ending of Ocarina of Time was not something ever considered by fans until the publication of Hyrule Historia in 2011, which finally revealed Nintendo's Official Zelda Timeline. Even after Hyrule Historia, people have thought the Zelda Timeline was nothing more than an afterthought created for the book, and not something that has existed as a framework for any lengthy period of time. Among the fans who did believe the timeline existed in the past, The Downfall Timeline split came under harsh scrutiny. Many of them believed it especially was something fabricated for the book alone, and many fans still hold to that view currently.
The plot concept for Retro's Sheikah game could indicate that the Downfall Timeline did exist in the past, at least definitely by 2005, but probably even earlier. It also would seem it was not just knowledge internally within Nintendo, but also shared with subsidiaries. From the sounds of it, the Zelda Timeline and information on the series would be a starting point for idea generation — which is why the plot concept for this Sheikah game specifies where it would have been located on the timeline.
Now, I realize technically this concept, in terms of Zelda canon, makes no sense. If this game takes place after Ocarina of Time, the Master Sword already exists so an origin story doesn't really work unless the game was supposed to be set before Ocarina of Time. That said, I don't really expect a concept artist who worked at Retro, or really anyone at Retro, to know every single detail about the Zelda Timeline or Zelda lore considering they'd never worked on a Zelda game before. It's also possible Nintendo rejected the game precisely because the plot didn't make sense, aside from the other issues it ran into. Regardless, the Hero Fails ending being mentioned at all is surprising, and could indicate that it has existed as a concept way before Hyrule Historia.
I am considering the possibility of that detail being added later by Sammy Hall while he was recalling details on the game. It's my job as a journalist to remain skeptical, afterall. I'm not sure if it makes sense for him to just randomly add that detail though. This is by no means a smoking gun, but it could be something. If it is, it confirms details on the Zelda Timeline that should drastically change perceptions of it's validity regarding whether it existed in the past, and likewise the legitimacy of the Downfall Timeline.
I'm interested to hear thoughts on this. I find this bit of info really intersting and I think it might be a glimpse behind the scenes on the really early stages of concept design for Zelda games, in terms of plot.
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