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General Zelda SS Upgrade System VS An XP System

snakeoiltanker

Wake Up!
Joined
Nov 13, 2012
Location
Ohio
So I have been playing a lot of Zelda II: Adventures of Link. It didnt dawn on me till yesterday when I started grinding to get my Attack and Magic up to par with how far i had made it in the game, that this game has an XP system, which has never been in any other Zelda game since! As I sat and thought about it, i started wishing this would make a return to the games, and be more fleshed out!

Sure, running around gathering things in SS in order to give to the engineer and upgrade your tools is fun and all, but its a lil frustrating. Yeah we know that certain items are in certain areas, so that cuts down on some of the aimless wandering, but in the end, its just not all that satisfying. The end game idea however is spot on, I like the upgrades, and think it should keep happening, but how you go about gathering what you need to upgrade, I'm not so sure! I also feel that it shouldn't be strictly for you tools and whatnot though.

For those of you who like the whole "gathering resources to upgrade" I have a sorta middle ground for you. Lets say for your tools/item/gadgets, go ahead and keep the resource collecting for all I care, it wasnt that bad. But I feel that Magic should return as well as the spells and everything. Hidden Skills should return as well. So with upgrades being done due to the resources you gather, how about leveling up your Magic Meter, Attack Power, and Spell Power, through a Zelda II style XP system. Use XP points to make Dins Fire stronger, or sword strikes stronger. As you gain more and more XP you can unlock some of the hidden skills, more powerful tunics that make you take less damage. Throw in an upgrade that makes spells use less magic. Im not saying make some huge XP system along the lines of Final Fantasy or anything. Just a simple XP system the likes of Zelda II!

What do you think, Do you like the idea of having a simple XP system that will make you feel stronger, or do you like the bare bone Zelda that you have always played?
If you think I'm on the right track, but needs minor tweaks, what tweaks would you make?
go ahead and throw in how you feel about the SS upgrade system as well. try to stay on topic, and have fun. Lets build a more in-depth zelda game!
 

JuicieJ

SHOW ME YA MOVES!
Joined
Jan 10, 2011
Location
On the midnight Spirit Train going anywhere
A portion of my article in the wings should cover this nicely.

RPG Elements

The Zelda series is not exactly a stranger to RPG elements, but generally speaking, it's been pretty light on them. That's not the case with every game, of course — look at Zelda II — but that doesn't change the fact that most games have treated them as more of a side feature rather than a major gameplay mechanic. That needs to change. The series needs to make them a larger factor in the future in order to continue to grow. Obviously there are ideas from other franchises that the series could take influence from, but in all reality, Zelda could easily just improve the RPG mechanics it's already seen.

Look at the rings from the OoX. These things offered customization and provided specific benefits depending on which ones were equipped. They had features like dealing more and taking less damage, automatically recovering hearts, not sliding on ice, and even turning into a specific enemy. The downside was only one ring could be equipped at a time. What if this were improved by working more like the medals in Skyward Sword where them being equipped takes up a slot in the Adventure Pouch, allowing for multiple rings — or whatever kind of item is used — to be equipped at once? Or maybe they could have their own container like they did in the OoX (the Ring Box), only have something like a point amount assigned to them with a maximum number of points available for use. It would provide a lot more resource management and would allow Link to have lots of cool enhancements, which would be perfect for Zelda.

skilltree-2.jpg
Then you have the upgrading mechanic featured in Skyward Sword. Treasure and bugs obtained either in the overworld or via an enemy drop could be used to upgrade Link's items and potions. Certain quest items could be upgraded to receive specific benefits, while extra containers could be upgraded to hold more of their respective items (Bombs, Arrows, Deku Seeds). It's a cool feature, right? Well what if it were to be upgraded — shameless pun intended — in the future? What if there were multiple paths for upgrading items, as well as much more advanced upgrades as compared to the ones seen in Skyward Sword? What if we could upgrade Link himself? Gain specific skills to use, such as the aforementioned Hidden Skills and Tiger Scrolls, only flesh them out a bit more, or maybe make his Stamina Gauge deplete less quickly. Countless options are ripe for the picking.

Moving on into the realm of things that Zelda could adopt from other franchises, a skill tree could be introduced in the future. Link could gain experience points by defeating enemies (or completing tasks) and gain different skills after obtaining enough of said points. Some people would probably initially consider this idea too similar to Zelda II's level up mechanic, but it wouldn't necessarily have to play out like that. The experience points could easily function like a currency and be spent on skills rather than having to be built up enough to level Link up and choose one skill. Implementing this mechanic would also provide the ample opportunity for magic to return. Players could start out with things like basic fire, ice, and electric spells and work their way up to more powerful versions to unleash devastating attacks. I'm sure some people would be sketchy about the idea of a skill tree even with the things I've said, but as long as if it were to be properly executed, I see nothing but positives from it.

There are many other things I could talk about, but the bottom line is RPG elements should be a focal point in Zelda. I'm really glad that Skyward Sword attempted to make them more of a factor in the gameplay, but these features, alongside of other ones, must be expanded upon if Nintendo wants them to not become stale. I sincerely hope they follow through with this, because if they do, the series can only get better from here.
 

DarkestLink

Darkest of all Dark Links
Joined
Oct 28, 2012
Both are a bad idea the way they were implemented. They should add upgrades as sidequest rewards and nothing more.
 

ihateghirahim

The Fierce Deity
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Jan 16, 2013
Location
Inside the Moon
Zelda should not be about RPG elements. They can pop up from time to time, but that's not what Zelda is about. It's about adventure, puzzle-solving, and action. That is what I remember about a Zelda game, not how many things I have to find to make pointless upgrades to my net. The RPG simply doesn't belong in Zelda.
 

HylianHero

Gardener of Elysium
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Jan 21, 2013
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Academia de Hyrule
I think Zelda is best with light RPG elements. Not a lot, but not none at all. I loved the upgrade system in Sward Sword. It was really great and I would love to see it in future games.
 

Castle

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I wouldn't mind a simple experience system like was featured in Okami to improve attack, defense, unlock new sword moves or the like. I wouldn't want Zelda to become a JRPG grind fest, but if sidequests doled out experience point rewards then pursing sidequests could become a lot more lucrative without having to come up with a huge variety of unique rewards (most of which are pointless in many zelda games)
 

Sir Quaffler

May we meet again
I'm not for gaining XP by grinding away at enemies. When I fight enemies, I like to fight them because they're just plain fun to fight, not because I need to grind away to boost my Attack stat; I get enough of that in Pokemon.

What I WOULD be a fan of, though, is a gaining of XP by sidequests and finding them out in the wild, kinda like Okami does. I like that system. It's not required for you to do it, but if you want more health or strength or whatever you can go out and work for it, with the added benefit of fleshing out the world around you. It doesn't have to be a straight-shot upgrade, either; I'm all for a skill tree where you can upgrade in different ways to get different kinds of effects. I just don't want it to become part of the main combat; combat is the main goal for me, not a middle-man in between me and my main goal.

What I ALSO want implemented, if they do this, is to add these stat boosts when you defeat a boss, along with the Full Heart. Have it to where it drops a heart, attack boost, speed boost, defense boost, etc. and let us choose one or two at our own discretion. That'll change things up a bit.
 

Ventus

Mad haters lmao
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Hylian Champion
Zelda + "Feeling Stronger" = A game with depth

You can't feel stronger unless you actually gain strength in some sort of way, right? RPG mechanics allow me to gain that strength. People often complain about having to grind in a JRPG...but what are you doing when you collect materials? :brow:
 
Joined
Jan 30, 2013
Location
Australia
I don't think an experience system does any justice for the zelda series at all, In my opinion it would create more opportunities for
road blocks within the game. even worse than lack of having a certain item.
They tried it once and scrapped it for a good reason.
The upgrade system however, the upgrades weren't a necessity therefore you didn't need to grind for them making it more optional.
 
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Joined
Jun 14, 2011
Zelda II was pretty much an experimental game where they tried out different gameplay ideas. Obviously due to the negative response to that game, Nintendo decided to back away from the RPG side of things and continued to use and experiment with the original Gameplay elements of The Legend of Zelda. After 26 years, why would Nintendo change the genre now? Zelda is rightfully an Action/Adventure type of game and people are too used to the genre now, making that much of a jump will ruin the Zelda image. The SS Upgrade system was fine as Upgrading has actually been used in Zelda before, most noticeably in A Link to the Past where you could upgrade your Sword by completing certain tasks. At least the upgrade System in Skyward Sword was optional and you weren't forced to use it, whereas a leveling system won't be.

Obviously your attack increases once you obtain certain Swords, but your defence really is down to you and damage shouldn't be calculated due to the lack of Defense points. Zelda is more known for skill and strategy when it comes to combat and you fight enemies because they are in your way or they randomly approach and attack you. I want to be given the freedom to decide whether an enemy is even worth meeting the edge of my blade, I do not want to be forced to fight an enemy in order to increase my attack, Defense, Speed etc. that is not what defines Zelda.
 
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snakeoiltanker

Wake Up!
Joined
Nov 13, 2012
Location
Ohio
Im surprised no one wants this. And i think you all took it too literal. I dont think an XP system would mean you would have to use it, you didnt have to in Zelda II. its a choice. i could have beat the game without sitting in a woods and fighting over and over to get stronger, but i was enjoying the fighting, so i figured why not. You wouldnt have to grind at all, you level up enough as you are just cruising through the game. it's just fun to feel yourself getting stronger, and knowing you are being rewarded for every enemy you fight, where as any other time, there are just there to slow you down. i like having a good reason to kill them other than the story line. Otherwise i just dodge the enemies if i can get through without having to fight them!
 

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