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General Zelda Sparse or Cluttered Overworld?

Zelda has had its far share of interesting and unique overworlds and many of which can be considered to be one of two; either sparse with a lot of open space like Twilight Princess and wind Waker, or cluttered like Skyward Sword.

So the question is, which do you prefer?

Do you prefer vast beautiful landscapes stretching out as far as the eye can see and then some with the natural world doing its own thing to immirse you in the idea that it is a fully functioning system?

Or do you like the more cluttered, one thing after another, assault course-like landscapes like those found in SS?
 
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Keeseman

Smash is Life
Joined
Sep 23, 2012
Location
Beijing, China
Well, I find that the overworlds in SS (below the clouds, anyway) are pretty much huge dungeons. Faron, Eldin, and Lanayru are all kind of like a dungeon, as there isn't much free traveling, and there are so many puzzles all throughout the regions that they seem like dungeons to me. So I really can't call the provinces an "overworld".

And going in and out of the sky is kind of annoying.

The various regions in MM were kind of like this, too, but not to the extent of what SS did.

However, a huge one, like TWW, is just too much. TP was okay, as there was teleporting, but I would even consider that cluttered, as it's all linear and surrounded by walls.

So I prefer a balance, like in aLttP or in OoT. ALttP was my favorite, as there was so much to discover over the vast land. OoT had a good, spacious Hyrule Field, but it wasn't so big like TP was, and there was also quite a bit to do around the various regions.

I'd lean more towards cluttered, but I wouldn't use that terminology. I'd say I prefer a "filled" overworld, which would include being filled with open space in various places.

Man, this is difficult to explain. Let's just say there needs to be balance between the two.
 

JuicieJ

SHOW ME YA MOVES!
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Skyward Sword's overworld wasn't really any more "cluttered" -- which is honestly a pretty poor word to use for this -- than A Link to the Past and The Minish Cap's. It just didn't have as much exploration. ALttP and TMC's overworlds are also what Zelda's overworlds should be modeled after, as they provide great exploration alongside of loads of gameplay spaces. I'm glad SS took a step back towards this, as it indicates Nintendo is planning on going back to that kind of overworld in the upcoming Zelda titles. It's past time Zelda's overworlds got back to their roots.
 

Random Person

Just Some Random Person
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I wouldn't call SS cluttered, it actually felt rather empty to me. I think what makes it seem that way (cluttered, that is) is the game leads you to many of the secrets it has. If the story has you passing secrets along the way, you get a sense that secrets are everywhere and it's impossible to not find one. I also don't feel that neither WW nor TP were sparse. Well... maybe TP, but certainly not WW. It's just that they had alot of room and treasure that some Zelda fans don't find as valuable. If you consider every small treasure chest in WW, then it technically has more content than most. I'm not sure that how little or how much treasures you have is a problem in Zelda games. Certainly if the secrets were too low, it would be a problem, but I don't think any game really has that. (Though I know people disagree with me) I think the true problem is how they are implemented. SS is called cluttered as it makes you find many of its secrets, WW is called scarce as it has you traversing huge oceans for specific treasures (despite all the treasure around you). The key is a balance of exploration and mandatory features. Allow the player to find secrets, but don't lead them there or force them there. When that happens, games like ALttP and MM are born where the overworld is full of secrets to find, and yet they seem so far from being achieved.
 

DarkestLink

Darkest of all Dark Links
Joined
Oct 28, 2012
If it's on foot (OoT, MM, TP) then sparse. If it's not on foot (tWW, SS) then cluttered.
 

ihateghirahim

The Fierce Deity
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Jan 16, 2013
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Inside the Moon
I don't know if any of you have played xenoblade chronicles. It's a great game, and it has one of the biggest and best worlds ever. I think it is and ideal place for Zelda to learn from. It has vast and varied landscapes: jungles, mountains, plains, caves, a sea, the inside of a giant monster, and others. These worlds are all vast and unique. Each world has different creatures and inhabitants to interact with. There are all sorts of sidequests scattered over each one. These quests are spread out, so that they make the entire level seem relevant. Many quests revolve around ancient ruins and lore, and they can tell you about the history of the world you're on. This sort of thing is sorely needed to shed more light on the history of Hyrule. The biggest achievement of the game is that it is FREAKING HUGE. There is so much room to explore and train in. There's more than enough room for anything a developer could want to do and more. There's more than enough for all the world building and other aspects a Zelda game needs. I'm not saying we should copy it, we should simply see it as an inspiration for future world designs.
 

Ventus

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I prefer the world-like overworld; what you refer to as "sparse". Enemies being assembled - stationed - everywhere can be natural...if you're in times of war. But, if you're ina regular, peaceful time...there is no reason to have enemies amok like in Skyward Sword. There's no reason for it, for one, and two, it defies the very theme of the times.

Anywho, my preference stems from games such as Guild Wars and Guild Wars 2, wherein calm areas naturally have fewer and WEAKER enemies, but the places closer to endgame have enemies riddled about, and tough ones at that. Zelda could take a page from the various MMORPGs, or just return to the days of Ocarina of Time. I'm all for slaughtering enemies, but keep it confined to (mini)dungeons, eh?

EDIT: Also, an overworld shouldn't be filled with puzzles. Really man, look in the real world! You don't see me having to blow up rockface #1 to reach my destination! I can walk and climb NATURAL GEOGRAPHY!
 

JuicieJ

SHOW ME YA MOVES!
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On the midnight Spirit Train going anywhere
I prefer the world-like overworld; what you refer to as "sparse". Enemies being assembled - stationed - everywhere can be natural...if you're in times of war. But, if you're ina regular, peaceful time...there is no reason to have enemies amok like in Skyward Sword. There's no reason for it, for one, and two, it defies the very theme of the times.

Hyrule is never at a time of peace during a Zelda game, though. There's always either a threat looming or a threat in progress.
 
Joined
Jan 27, 2013
I want an overworld not in the sky/sea. I like a dense overworld like Majoras Mask, it has open spaces but also a ton of stuff to see. The Wind Waker overworld felt absoulutely empty, there was only one island on each square and no incentive to explore.
 
Joined
Nov 25, 2012
Location
Monkey Island
TP had what I would call a "sparse" overworld, the devs purposefully made SS more "cluttered" because they felt like there was too much open space in TP. I for one loved the open space, what the OP described as beautiful landscapes stretching out far as the land can see. Hyrule Field, the Gerudo Desert, and the Snowpeak regions of TP all had this quality, and it just felt so awe-inspiring and adventure-ful and LOTR-esque (especially riding Epona around the field as the sun set..ahhhhh, beautiful). I never got that feeling from the more platform-gaming-friendly SS overworld. So I didn't like what SS did, the overworld felt too much like an outdoor dungeon, which made all the gaming really repetitive-feeling.

Nice thread idea, btw.
 

Justac00lguy

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Shewhale
I think a combination of the two would work nicely...

Two of my favorite overworld's in Zelda games are the heavily criticized Twilight Princess and Wind Waker, I do not mean mean the actual game but the overworld's. Complaints about TP were mainly due to the overworld bieng empty and in the Wind Waker it was due to the ratio of empty sea compared to island's. I think these arguments are very weak, TP had many thing's to do in its large overworld: Treasure, Rupees, variety of enemies, HP's, Golden Bugs, Mini-Dungeons and Poes to hunt at night. This doesn't seem empty to me! Of course the overworld could have had more thing's to do in but an empty overworld doesn't necessarily mean that its bad.

Let me take out an example of what I believe to be one of the greatest games of all time....Shadow of the Colossus... This game had a very simple formula but it worked to perfection, the overworld here was vastly empty, in this overworld alone there was next to nothing to do. However did this take away from the experience or the sense of an adventure? No it certainly did not. I find the idea of traveling over vast lands taking in the atmosphere the music and the views to be one lf the best aspects of traveling across an overworld. The satisfaction from adventuring for a prolonged time and finally reaching your target gives me a sense of achievement which little Zelda games fail to achieve, TP and TWW being the only two.

Now what I mean from a combination is that we should have a large overworld with contrasting areas of both sparse and cluttered. The journey between destinations should be a long quest in itself, it should test the players ability to find and explore the next area as well gifting the player with amazing views, great atmosphere and an epic soundtrack to help the journey. When a player reaches their destination or in Zelda terms a province, it should be a lot more dense in terms of things to do Etc. I think finding the perfect balance to an overworld which allows you to explore vast terrains and areas where you will find lot's of things to do will please many fan's.
 

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