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Song of Storms Time Paradox

linkypete

I am the very model of a modern major-general
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In ocarina of time and majora's mask, there is a huge time paradox happening involving the song of storms. In ocarina of time,after you become an adult, Guru-Guru tells you that some kid with an ocarina came and played a song that caused a huge storm, making the windmill hut go out of control. He then teaches you the song and you play it, making it go out of control again. This is the song of storms. Also, in Majora's mask, sharp the poe conductor teaches you the song of storms again, but Majora's mask takes place after ocarina of time. So how does this all work? I have a theory about this.

My Theory:
I think that it is a time paradox. In ocarina of time, after link defeats ganon, he is turned back into a child, and the events of ocarina of time occur again. link then goes into the lost woods to search for navi, and ends up in termina. there, he learns the song of storms, and after he defeats majora's mask and returns to hyrule, he still has the knowledge that he gets in termina. since this is still seven years before ganon is defeated because zelda sent you back in time, you go and visit the windmill hut and play the song of storms, making the windmill hut spin out of control. Seven years later, after you wake up in the temple of time, you have forgotten a lot of things, including the song of storms. When you arrive at the windmill hut, guru-guru tells you that some kid played the song of storms, messing up the windmill hut, then teaches the song of storms to you, thus repeating the whole cycle again, creating a never-ending time paradox.

So how do you like my theory? does it seem accurate? let me know if there is anything you found interesting or incorrect in my theory.
 

Justac00lguy

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In ocarina of time and majora's mask, there is a huge time paradox happening involving the song of storms. In ocarina of time,after you become an adult, Guru-Guru tells you that some kid with an ocarina came and played a song that caused a huge storm, making the windmill hut go out of control. He then teaches you the song and you play it, making it go out of control again. This is the song of storms. Also, in Majora's mask, sharp the poe conductor teaches you the song of storms again, but Majora's mask takes place after ocarina of time. So how does this all work? I have a theory about this.

My Theory:
I think that it is a time paradox. In ocarina of time, after link defeats ganon, he is turned back into a child, and the events of ocarina of time occur again. link then goes into the lost woods to search for navi, and ends up in termina. there, he learns the song of storms, and after he defeats majora's mask and returns to hyrule, he still has the knowledge that he gets in termina. since this is still seven years before ganon is defeated because zelda sent you back in time, you go and visit the windmill hut and play the song of storms, making the windmill hut spin out of control. Seven years later, after you wake up in the temple of time, you have forgotten a lot of things, including the song of storms. When you arrive at the windmill hut, guru-guru tells you that some kid played the song of storms, messing up the windmill hut, then teaches the song of storms to you, thus repeating the whole cycle again, creating a never-ending time paradox.

So how do you like my theory? does it seem accurate? let me know if there is anything you found interesting or incorrect in my theory.
Nice to see you noticed the proposed paradox, however just a couple of points....

When Link is sent back in time by Zelda, he is sent back to the time when he first met Zelda in the Hyrule Castle courtyard. It is stated that he warns Zelda and the King of Hyrule about the danger and true intentions of Ganondorf. This thus leading to Ganondorf being captured and being sent to the Arbiter Grounds where his failed execution would take place. Even if these events didn't happen it would be perceived that even though Link has the courage of the Hero when he gets sent back he does not in fact have the Master Sword. The Master Sword plays a key part in sealing Ganondorf at the end of OoT and without it I doubt Young Link could ever defeat Ganondorf.

So even though this could explain events am afraid this did not happen when Link got sent back in time.
 

linkypete

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Nice to see you noticed the proposed paradox, however just a couple of points....

When Link is sent back in time by Zelda, he is sent back to the time when he first met Zelda in the Hyrule Castle courtyard. It is stated that he warns Zelda and the King of Hyrule about the danger and true intentions of Ganondorf. This thus leading to Ganondorf being captured and being sent to the Arbiter Grounds where his failed execution would take place. Even if these events didn't happen it would be perceived that even though Link has the courage of the Hero when he gets sent back he does not in fact have the Master Sword. The Master Sword plays a key part in sealing Ganondorf at the end of OoT and without it I doubt Young Link could ever defeat Ganondorf.

So even though this could explain events am afraid this did not happen when Link got sent back in time.
but young link didn't defeat ganondorf. As I said before, the entire process started over after link learned the song of storms a second time as an adult WITH the master sword, and then link defeated ganondorf again as and adult. my point is that he actually had the master sword when the process started over again.
 

Locke

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When Link is sent back in time, it creates a completely new timeline. On this new timeline, Link never defeats Ganondorf, and presumably never teaches Guru-Guru the Song of Storms. Once Link enters the Child Timeline it's impossible to return to the Adult Timeline where these events occur.
 

ihateghirahim

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Well a paradox is something that, by nature, doesn't make sense. I think it is simply a plot hole, or a mistranslation. When you first go to Guru-guru, you've never taught him the song of storms, and you're still in the original timeline before the split. The fact that he can know you activated the windmill, when you never actually did it, is an impossibility. It's a gameplay mechanic needed to give players a hint as to what they need to do to get the Lense of Truth.
 

felipe970421

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It's similar to the (tedious) tree of life puzzle on Skyward Sword, at first it's a clever time puzzle, but when you sit down to it it just creates paradoxes, when establishing how the time travel works in those games, I just ignore those two, and while I generally dislike his approach, I have to agree with DarkestLink here, it's an oversight by Nintendo

If you really wanted it to make sense the only explanation is just completely shredded by Occam's razor, it states that another Ocarina kid taught the song to Guru Guru during the 7 years, not likely, but it's the only non-paradox explanation
 
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It's an Ontological Paradox. Basically, the song exists without having been created; what created it was Link teaching it Guru guru, but Guru guru taught it to Link...

:tardis:"People assume that time is a strict progression of cause-and-effect... but actually, from a non-linear, non-subjective viewpoint, it's more like a big ball of wibbly-wobbly... timey-wimey... stuff." :tardis:
 
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THis whole thing is making my head spin, but I think I get it...wait. No I don't. But I do think the whole thing with the paradox is really cool.
 

Terminus

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It's an Ontological Paradox. Basically, the song exists without having been created; what created it was Link teaching it Guru guru, but Guru guru taught it to Link...

:tardis:"People assume that time is a strict progression of cause-and-effect... but actually, from a non-linear, non-subjective viewpoint, it's more like a big ball of wibbly-wobbly... timey-wimey... stuff." :tardis:
The only hole I see in this is that the Song of Storms is playing in the Windmill. It's not quite the Ocarina version but it sounds a lot like the version played by Guru-guru in the future... except he seems to think the song was new.

A likely explanation in that he may have heard the song before, but only the Ocarina version had any effect. Or it may have just been a bad choice in background music by Nintendo.
 
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You have to take the theory that, if you go to the past from the future, what you do in the past (your future) has already happened before you go to the past. That means that, even though Link learns the song from Guru-Guru, Link IS the one who teaches him.
 

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