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REAL TIMELINE

Joined
Oct 6, 2016
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Manly man
1. The amiibo outfits match the text style of the in-game, not-amiibo BotW outfit of the same style. They are also worded in-character for the games, not out of character. Considering we never got a ruling on whether or not they are canon, the fact they provide setting details suggests they are.

The Palace of the Four Sword has similar flavour text saying that it was built for heroes, but due to it giving us a different ending, not being acknowledged in HH, and not making sense from a chronological perspective, we know that that's not canon.

Ancient Stone Tablets is an obvious ingame sequel to ALttP, which is a canon game, but AST itself is not canon as mentioned by HH, despite AST treating the events of ALttP as canon in its story.

Historical cultures that had mythology-as-history setups similar to Hyrule also had people who lived at the same time the legends were common that wrote down that the legends were not considered entirely factual in their own societies, but more allegorical accountings of history.

But we, the players, know that to not be the case. We've played OoT, and those legends had to come from somewhere. It makes sense to assume they're true until proven otherwise.

If the amiibo outfits are canon and BotW is part of only one timeline, then you'd have to answer that question as to how they knew the history of all three timelines since the amiibo outfits represent games from all three timelines. In order to justify them not at least knowing about other timelines, you either have to merge the timelines or start removing parts of the game as being canon. And, frankly, we're assuming the wishmaker wouldn't simply end up finding out from the Triforce itself if they bothered to ask. Why they would ask, how they would know to ask, or even what question would lead to such an answer is far too massive of a topic to explore; there's too many possible answers. And that's assuming Hyrulians didn't find out through some other method we're just not aware of or simply didn't know they existed from the very beginning; given they know time travel is real and in at least one timeline that alternate versions of Hyrule exist, it wouldn't be much of a stretch for them to figure out that other timelines exist or for someone to be dumb enough to think merging them is a good idea (maybe Ganon did it to gain more power? Seems like something dumb he'd try, and it would explain Calamity Ganon).

Sorry, far too many ifs, maybes, hypotheticals, and overall fanfic for me to accept this as a valid argument.
 
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Feel free to use what pronouns you want. I use both sexed pronoun sets interchangeably.
The Palace of the Four Sword has similar flavour text saying that it was built for heroes, but due to it giving us a different ending, not being acknowledged in HH, and not making sense from a chronological perspective, we know that that's not canon.

Ancient Stone Tablets is an obvious ingame sequel to ALttP, which is a canon game, but AST itself is not canon as mentioned by HH, despite AST treating the events of ALttP as canon in its story.

Those are entire games not being canon. That arguement does not support the idea that parts of a single game are not.

But we, the players, know that to not be the case. We've played OoT, and those legends had to come from somewhere. It makes sense to assume they're true until proven otherwise.

What the players know and what the Hyrulians know are not necessarily the same thing. For us, it's been a span of decades; for them, it's been tens of thousands of years.

Sorry, far too many ifs, maybes, hypotheticals, and overall fanfic for me to accept this as a valid argument.

Considering one of the hypotheticals I included is your own argument about the canonicity of the amiibo outfits, I am confused as to why you argued a stance you do not accept as a valid argument.

At this point, I think it's best if we agree to disagree. I think we've reached the end of productive conversation.
 
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At this point, I think it's best if we agree to disagree. I think we've reached the end of productive conversation.

Very well. I, also, have grown tired of this discussion, and it looks like we've both dragged the topic to hell.

If only it wasn't for my impulsive nature to argue against every point I disagree with...

Then again, it's human nature, I suppose.
 
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Timeline 1 Demise is Ganon 1 Hylia is Zelda 1 Zelda>Zelda 2 > OOT> ALTP
Timeline 2 SS>OOT > ALTP>Zelda>Zelda2
 

Spiritual Mask Salesman

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I'm just going wrap this up by saying why I think Convergence is unlikely, and then you can PM me if you insist on continuing this. The OR stuff may not have been the prime way of directing the discussion on my part, soI'll concede for now and focus on an earlier comment:

You said that you believe that the Triforce had something to do with this ''Convergence'', but how? Are we supposed to assume that someone just wished on the Triforce to bring the three branches together? Why would they do that? And how would they even know about the existence of the two other branches on what ever timeline the convergence takes place in? What parts stay? What parts go? Why isn't such an event mentioned in BotW?
I really like the The Elder Scrolls' take on converging timelines, they actually acknowledge it in books, and people have conflicting accounts on certain events. I feel like if something similar happened in Zelda it should be recorded. The problem is the only way I can imagine a convergence happening is if the power of the Triforce was used to merge the timelines. This requires knowledge that there are diverging timelines to begin with though, and we'd also have to ask why anyone would think merging histories would even be a good idea. Alternatively, they could try to apply TES logic on the matter, which is that the will of nature simply mandates that after a split in time happens, the various timelines must reconvergence back into one linear flow of history. The Zelda series could just pin it on the gods trying to fix things kind of like when Ganondorf randomly gets the Triforce of Power in TP.

I'm not saying they should merge the timelines, but if they did I feel like they need to take a page from TES to make it feel believable. Plant some books in BotW 2 that have conflicting accounts on historical events, and then they might have something.
 

AwdryFan1997

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I really like the The Elder Scrolls' take on converging timelines, they actually acknowledge it in books, and people have conflicting accounts on certain events. I feel like if something similar happened in Zelda it should be recorded. The problem is the only way I can imagine a convergence happening is if the power of the Triforce was used to merge the timelines. This requires knowledge that there are diverging timelines to begin with though, and we'd also have to ask why anyone would think merging histories would even be a good idea. Alternatively, they could try to apply TES logic on the matter, which is that the will of nature simply mandates that after a split in time happens, the various timelines must reconvergence back into one linear flow of history. The Zelds series could just pin it on the gods trying to fix things kind of like when Ganondorf randomly gets the Triforce of Power.

I'm not saying they should merge the timelines, but if they did I feel like they need to take a page from TES to make it feel believable. Plant some books in BotW 2 that have conflicting accounts on historical events, and then they might have something.
I like how everyone's talking about convergence when at this point I'm subscribed to Arlo's Jurassic Park 2 Theory.
 

Spiritual Mask Salesman

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It's more properly known as the "Recurrence Theory". It's basically where, since BOTW is set so far in the future, the events of every Zelda game have all happened on one timeline by coincidence. Arlo explains it much better in his video. I believe it was this one: The Zelda Universe is Ready For a BIG Change
I'm not sure if I care for this, each timeline has it's own events that aren't coincidental, and if we take away key elements of them the liklihood of major events happening drop tremendously. For example, Zant was apparently a push over, it was only after he was endowed with a fraction of power from Ganondorf that he became powerful enough to take over the Twilight Realm and then launch his campaign to blanket the Light Realm in Twilight. If there are no time shananigans like at the beginning of the Child Timeline, Ganondorf isn't executed, the "divine prank" never happens that splits the Triforce without it being touched, Ganondorf isn't banished into the Mirror of Twilight, and Zant never gets powerful enough to usurp the throne of Twilight. We'd have to assume similar events happen randomly for entirely different reasons and are resolved by different means. This interpretation is even messier than a theorhetical converging of the timelines, which could be explained by the gods just deciding to merge the timelines for some reason, and there is at least precedence for such a random divine action.
 
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I really like the The Elder Scrolls' take on converging timelines, they actually acknowledge it in books, and people have conflicting accounts on certain events. I feel like if something similar happened in Zelda it should be recorded. The problem is the only way I can imagine a convergence happening is if the power of the Triforce was used to merge the timelines. This requires knowledge that there are diverging timelines to begin with though, and we'd also have to ask why anyone would think merging histories would even be a good idea. Alternatively, they could try to apply TES logic on the matter, which is that the will of nature simply mandates that after a split in time happens, the various timelines must reconvergence back into one linear flow of history. The Zelda series could just pin it on the gods trying to fix things kind of like when Ganondorf randomly gets the Triforce of Power in TP.

I'm not saying they should merge the timelines, but if they did I feel like they need to take a page from TES to make it feel believable. Plant some books in BotW 2 that have conflicting accounts on historical events, and then they might have something.

Just because TES did it doesn't mean every series has to hop on that bandwagon, nor is it good storytelling(and one of the reasons why I don't really care about TES lore). Saying that Hyrule was erased and non erased at the same time is absurd, like how saying Ganon is eradicated and still around and replaced by a different guy with the same name. All explanations for a convergence have no evidence behind them(and no, ''God did it'' or ''the Triforce did it'' are not evidence), and you're getting rid of the storytelling possibilities that the three branches allow for, such as exploring the development of New Hyrule now that the MS and Ganon are both gone, or the possibilities of Ganon II returning in the CT, or exploring any other possibilities.
 

Spiritual Mask Salesman

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Just because TES did it doesn't mean every series has to hop on that bandwagon, nor is it good storytelling(and one of the reasons why I don't really care about TES lore). Saying that Hyrule was erased and non erased at the same time is absurd, like how saying Ganon is eradicated and still around and replaced by a different guy with the same name. All explanations for a convergence have no evidence behind them(and no, ''God did it'' or ''the Triforce did it'' are not evidence), and you're getting rid of the storytelling possibilities that the three branches allow for, such as exploring the development of New Hyrule now that the MS and Ganon are both gone, or the possibilities of Ganon II returning in the CT, or exploring any other possibilities.
I agree that I don't think Zelda should go this route, but I think if any series wants to, TES is probably a nice execution of it because their historical accounts in game acknowledge the convergence. That was my point.
 

Mikey the Moblin

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Honestly I was going to say elder scrolls takes its world building way more seriously than zelda ever has and I'm not sure that such an explanation is even necessary for a world that isn't so complete as skyrim
 

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