OoX on the Neutral Timeline?

[Master Kokiri 9]

Okay so recently I was pondering OoX and Minish Cap when something struck me. Remember how in MC there were three girls in a hotel by the names of Din, Nayru, and Farore? They look kinda like how they were in OoX don't ya think? Most people might simply right that off as a cameo but I tend to believe that Nintendo/Capcom would make things a bit deeper. First of all there were to be three games in OoX each representing a goddess. However the idea of a third with Farore was scrapped. Now this may mean that OoX is between OoT and MC on the neutral timeline (the part before the split). This may possibly mean that in MC Din, Nayru, and Farore are the same as they were in OoX. What do you think?

 

[Zemen]

OoX can't go before OoT because Ganon is in OoX and Ganon/dorf wasn't introduced until OoT. Any game that has Ganon/dorf in it or any mentioning of Ganon/dorf in it CANNOT go before OoT.

 

[Erimgard]

Also, the Oracles in MC are stated to be descended from a line of dancers/priestesses. If they are related, they would likely be descendants, and not the originals.

@Zemen

Why do you say no game with Ganon/dorf can be pre-OoT?
FSA also seems to show an origin story of Ganon/dorf, yet no one says it has to be the first game.

According to the original telling of the Seal War, the Seal War was the birth of Ganon.

 

[Zemen]

Also, the Oracles in MC are stated to be descended from a line of dancers/priestesses. If they are related, they would likely be descendants, and not the originals.

Well the OoX oracles could just as easily be descendants of previous oracles, as well. The only thing that the MC oracles being called descendants means is that OoX and MC are on the same timeline. If MC goes first, it doesn't change them being on the same timeline. They just can't be on opposites sides of the timeline (a.k.a. one being on the AT and the other on the CT). This would also put OoX on the same timeline as the rest of the Four Swords series and ALTTP.

@Zemen

Why do you say no game with Ganon/dorf can be pre-OoT?
FSA also seems to show an origin story of Ganon/dorf, yet no one says it has to be the first game.

According to the original telling of the Seal War, the Seal War was the birth of Ganon.

I put FS/FSA after TP because at the end of TP Ganondorf is dead. I don't mean he's turned to stone like in WW. I mean that we him stabbed and the Triforce leaves his hand and he actually dies. If FSA seemingly introduces a new Ganondorf, it could just be some sort of reincarnation of the original that the soul of Ganon took over.

My point is, I believe that TP is the end of the original Ganondorf (from OoT) and FSA introduces a new one and those are the only 2 Ganondorfs.

 

[Skull_Kid]

The only game that actually fits before OoT is MC...
The fact that Both MC and OoX have the Oracles, only mean that it is a tradition, also, notice that the Oracle Girls' figurines say that they descend from a long line, so, it implies that it will also keep going.
Anyways, FSA makes sense on being after TP because in TP, we actually see Ganondorf dying.
In FSA there is a new Ganondorf, but it is clearly the same Ganon.
Zelda's Quote;

"Ganon, an ancient demon reborn..."

 

[Erimgard]

Well the OoX oracles could just as easily be descendants of previous oracles, as well. The only thing that the MC oracles being called descendants means is that OoX and MC are on the same timeline. If MC goes first, it doesn't change them being on the same timeline. They just can't be on opposites sides of the timeline (a.k.a. one being on the AT and the other on the CT). This would also put OoX on the same timeline as the rest of the Four Swords series and ALTTP.

The point is, in MC, the Oracles have moved to Hyrule from Labrynna and Holodrum. If it goes OoX-MC, that makes sense. If it goes MC-OoX that means that they had to live in OoX for a long time (as the figurine says they are from a LONG line of dancers/priestesses from Holodrum/Labrynna] moved to Hyrule for MC, and then moved back to Holodrum/Labrynna again for OoX...which doesn't make much sense.

I put FS/FSA after TP because at the end of TP Ganondorf is dead. I don't mean he's turned to stone like in WW. I mean that we him stabbed and the Triforce leaves his hand and he actually dies. If FSA seemingly introduces a new Ganondorf, it could just be some sort of reincarnation of the original that the soul of Ganon took over.

My point is, I believe that TP is the end of the original Ganondorf (from OoT) and FSA introduces a new one and those are the only 2 Ganondorfs.

And he could just as easily point out that Ganon is dead in OoX's ending, and was reincarnated for OoT.

 

[Zemen]

The point is, in MC, the Oracles have moved to Hyrule from Labrynna and Holodrum. If it goes OoX-MC, that makes sense. If it goes MC-OoX that means that they had to live in OoX for a long time (as the figurine says they are from a LONG line of dancers/priestesses from Holodrum/Labrynna] moved to Hyrule for MC, and then moved back to Holodrum/Labrynna again for OoX...which doesn't make much sense.

I didn't realize that oracles aren't allowed to travel. Sorry, my mistake.

And he could just as easily point out that Ganon is dead in OoX's ending, and was reincarnated for OoT.

At the time, when OoX was released, there was only one Ganondorf. There was absolutely no hint to a reincarnation or a reborn of Ganon/dorf. In FSA, Zelda specifically calls Ganon/dorf the demon reborn which is an obvious indication of a new Ganondorf whereas OoT definitely tells us the history and shows us the introduction of the original Ganondorf.

The only game that makes sense before OoT is MC and just because of easter egg figurines you're playing Devil's Advocate.

The figurines specifically say that they come from a long line of oracles. One could assume that if the line of oracles is LONG, then maybe it still goes even longer after MC, maybe all the way to OoX that could take place HUNDREDS of years later. Within those hundreds of years, it's possible that the family of oracles moved back to Labrynna/Holodrum.

 

[Pinecove]

My point is, I believe that TP is the end of the original Ganondorf (from OoT) and FSA introduces a new one and those are the only 2 Ganondorfs.

It's a theory that I definately agree with, but FSA before OoT works if you make FSA and OoT Ganondorfs different people. In other words:

FSA Ganondorf is born.
FSA Ganondorf gets sealed in the FS.
OoT Ganondorf is born.
OoT Ganondorf dies (TP or TWW)
FSA Ganondorf breaks out of the FS for ALttP.
ALttP Happens.
FSA/ALttP Ganondorf dies.
The end.
???
PROFIT!!!

Edit:

I didn't realize that oracles aren't allowed to travel. Sorry, my mistake.

Travel =/= buying a house somewhere.

Edit2:

Anyways, FSA makes sense on being after TP because in TP, we actually see Ganondorf dying.

We see him die in TWW aswell.

 

[Zemen]

It's a theory that I definately agree with, but FSA before OoT works if you make FSA and OoT Ganondorfs different people. In other words:

FSA Ganondorf is born.
FSA Ganondorf gets sealed in the FS.
OoT Ganondorf is born.
OoT Ganondorf dies (TP or TWW)
FSA Ganondorf breaks out of the FS for ALttP.
ALttP Happens.
FSA/ALttP Ganondorf dies.
The end.
???
PROFIT!!!

So with that you're saying that ALTTP can go before OoT? I really didn't understand what you were saying and it still doesn't make sense before OoT IMO.

Travel =/= buying a house somewhere.

Where did they buy a house in MC or OoX? I don't seem to recall them having any specific home in either title.

We see him die in TWW aswell.

Did you read the rest of my post? It clearly said, RIGHT after the part of my post you quoted, that it actually shows Ganondorf dying, not just turning to stone. We actually see his physical body stabbed with the Triforce out of his hands and we see him just lose his life. That is nothing like what happened in WW. In WW they actually made it seem like Ganondorf could come back somehow. In TP they made it clear that he was dead.

There have been plenty of speculations over his "death" in WW but it's perfectly clear that he is dead in TP.

 

[sign of table]

In FSA, Zelda specifically calls Ganon/dorf the demon reborn which is an obvious indication of a new Ganondorf whereas OoT definitely tells us the history and shows us the introduction of the original Ganondorf.

I ****ING HATE NOA!!!!!!1!1!!! That's a mistranslation.

NoA says: King of Darkness, ancient demon reborn. The wielder of the trident!!

NoJ retranslated by Jumbie and Jacensolo say: King of Darkness... The man who obtained the trident, the evil tool of demons that was revived from ancient times!!

It was only the trident that was brought back from ancient times.

The figurines specifically say that they come from a long line of oracles. One could assume that if the line of oracles is LONG, then maybe it still goes even longer after MC, maybe all the way to OoX that could take place HUNDREDS of years later. Within those hundreds of years, it's possible that the family of oracles moved back to Labrynna/Holodrum.

Yeah it can happen that way, but you can't deny that the oracles from OoX-TMC are make more sense. Oracles moving from Holodrum/Labrynna to Hyrule is a lot simpler than Oracle line in Holodrum/Labrynna decide to move to Hyrule, then move back to Holodrum/Labrynna without anything implying such.

The former just makes more sense (the latter isn't impossible, though. It's just not as nice).

So with that you're saying that ALTTP can go before OoT? I really didn't understand what you were saying and it still doesn't make sense before OoT IMO.

He's saying that some people (NOT HIM OR I) believe that FSA goes before OoT and was giving an explanation for how it can work. I personally like the theory, but the connections FSA seems to have (to me anyway) to LttP are too strong for me to change it.

Where did they buy a house in MC or OoX? I don't seem to recall them having any specific home in either title.

The oracles get houses in TMC. And then they can give you their little charms in your bottle after they get their house.

There have been plenty of speculations over his "death" in WW but it's perfectly clear that he is dead in TP.

I reaaaaally wish I could find the Aonuma quote right now. But there IS a quote where Aonuma says that Ganon is dead in TWW, they only changed it to fit the censors (which isn't the first time. Remember OoT Ganondorf v1.0's red blood that they changed?)

 

[Erimgard]

I didn't realize that oracles aren't allowed to travel. Sorry, my mistake.

There's a difference between travelling and buying a house somewhere. It simply makes more sense that they moved from Holo/Brynna to Hyrule, rather than that they moved from Holo/Brynna to Hyrule and back to Holo/Brynna again. If they wanted to include the Oracle girls in a way that wouldn't contradict the timeline, why have them leaving their place of residence in a game pre-dating the ones where we see them there.

At the time, when OoX was released, there was only one Ganondorf.
There was absolutely no hint to a reincarnation or a reborn of Ganon/dorf.

When OoX was released, Ganon had died twice (aLttP, LoZ). So yes, there is implication that there had to have been a reincarnation.

In FSA, Zelda specifically calls Ganon/dorf the demon reborn which is an obvious indication of a new Ganondorf whereas OoT definitely tells us the history and shows us the introduction of the original Ganondorf.

The Japanese text does not call Ganon "reborn".

The figurines specifically say that they come from a long line of oracles. One could assume that if the line of oracles is LONG, then maybe it still goes even longer after MC, maybe all the way to OoX that could take place HUNDREDS of years later. Within those hundreds of years, it's possible that the family of oracles moved back to Labrynna/Holodrum.

Possible, yes.
Have you ever heard of Occam's Razor?

 

[ironknuckle1]

OOX and MC can go anywhere on the tiomeline I mean just because they are i none game doesn't mean they can't appear in another it just means it has been a while since their paths crossed.

 

[Pinecove]

Where did they buy a house in MC or OoX? I don't seem to recall them having any specific home in either title.

You help them move in/buy a house in TMC...

(DAMNIT 50 CHARACTER LIMIT!!!!)

 

[Zemen]

You help them move in/buy a house in TMC...

(DAMNIT 50 CHARACTER LIMIT!!!!)

So what? If they are from a LONG line of oracles then who is to say that line of oracles wouldn't last past MC, say into OoX? You guys are making it sound like MC oracles are the end of the line. If their bloodline/oracle line lives on hundreds of years past MC, then it's possible somewhere along those hundreds of years of oracles they moved back to Labrynna/Holodrum. All the figurines tell us is that OoX and MC are connected. There is nothing clearly stating that they HAVE to be the descendants of OoX's oracles. That's just your way of interpreting it. And them buying a house in MC doesn't change my theory or destroy it.

 

[sign of table]

And them buying a house in MC doesn't change my theory or destroy it.

I don't think Pinecove was saying it does, he was just saying that they do buy a house in TMC.