OoX and LA

[Erimgard]

At least midna killed those theories that place OoX between ALttP and LA.
OoX, actually, fit as well as after OoX, but not as a direct sequel, as they fit after LA, also not as a direct sequel.

I don't think I understood anything you just said.

-What does Midna have to do with OoX?
-I think you switched up an "OoX" and an "aLttP" in that second sentence

 

[Skull_Kid]

I don't think I understood anything you just said.

-What does Midna have to do with OoX?
-I think you switched up an "OoX" and an "aLttP" in that second sentence

I was referring to the user midna666, in case you haven't been following the thread...

What I switched was AoL and OoX. I meant: OoX fits as well as after AoL, but not as a direct sequel, as they fit after LA, also not as a direct sequel..

Sorry

 

[Darknut]

I think that the order is ALttP-LA-OoX. I didn't read all of your...post, so if I missed something making it obvious it's not this order, well I'm sorry.

 

[Zombi Link]

Always thought of LA coming straight after LTTP. It just seemed right to me but who knows.

 

[sign of table]

I contemplated about whether or not to come back to this site after DarkLink edited my post for "spam". I didn't spam, I said one thing repeatedly and in caps because I'd covered that point about 5 times, you had never responded, then you continued to act as if OoX could ever be the training mention in the LA manual. And then you go and edit my post when I say it over and over in caps so you'll actually read it and stop using that argument?

Anyways...

There's been plenty of evidence. More or less I was using obvious intent. You have been basically doing the same thing.

You haven't stated any evidence exclusive to LttP so far.

Sure, you could take OoX and stick it in between them and say that they made OoX to fit the BS of LA,

Why would you stick it between them? That causes more problems than it solves.

but it fits ALttP as well and better

You've yet to prove why it fits better.

IMO considering that OoX didn't take place in Hyrule.

It doesn't need to.

According to LA's manual, Ganon was terrorizing Hyrule.

Wrong. ALL that it requires is for Link to restore peace to Hyrule by defeating Ganon. WHICH LINK IN OOX DID.

This was its intent.

Bolded and italicized the key word.

He had a reign of tyrany over that land as he was in control of Agahnim, who was doing his bidding there, obviously killing the king and taking Zelda captive.

Of course.

And the king is alive at the end of LttP IIRC.

In OoX, nothing happens in Hyrule.

Zelda disagrees.

Ganon's "clutches" are in no part over Hyrule at all.

But peace has crumbled in Hyrule.

Ganon is halfway revived at the very end, and has time to growl and moan before Link defeats him. I have yet to figure out how a halfway Ganon, moaning and growling, in Labrynna/Holodrum, has cause any bit of tyranny over Hyrule.

He doesn't have to. Read the manual for christ's sake. All it says on the matter is thus: "You, who regained the peace of Hyrule from the demonic hands of the king of evil, Ganon" Where in hell are you getting this tyranny crap? Non of that is required in the slightest for LA.

I'm going to agree that it makes sense (based on the picture and other evidence) if it is Hyrule that Link is seen leaving at the end of OoX but the problem I have with that is the people he's waving to. It makes no sense that Link made all of these friends in Holodrum/Labrynna and he's seen leaving Hyrule and waving goodbye to people who weren't even featured in the game. I hope that this is something we can agree on, SoJ, just the fact that it doesn't really make much sense, even if it is what's happening.

Someone on ZU showed that most of those people are cut and pasted over and over again.

It doesn't have to make sense for it to be fact *glances at the Song of Storms paradox*

Also, I am going to agree with DarkLink when he was explaining how the LA BS says that Link stops Ganon from the clutches and tyranny he had over Hyrule.

If you'd read the actual manual you'd know that Ganon wouldn't need to control Hyrule.

Ganon was in OoX long enough for one, short battle which didn't take place in Hyrule, so exactly how was Ganon causing terror in Hyrule if he was only HALF alive for only a few moments AND in a completely different country?

Clearly he doesn't need to. Seriously read the manual. It doesn't require anything that you keep going on about.

If anything, it was Onox and Veran(?) who were terrorizing anything with the help of Koume and Kotake

So?

and even then, Hyrule was not being attacked upon at all.

According to Zelda peace in Hyrule had crumbled. Which is all that is required for LA.

The BS for LA clearly is discussing the terrorization of Hyrule and no other place,

It discusses no terrorization.

yet Hyrule seemed to be unaffected by anything that happened in OoX.

Zelda says otherwise.

Ganon was not around long enough to terrorize anything

Once again for like the 15th time, he never needed to.

and he's the only enemy discussed in the LA BS.

So?

I'll bet money you (or someone else) would give the age old response of "the BS doesn't have to match perfectly" and I really hope you aren't the type of theorist to do so because it's just a bull**** reason to not come up with an argument.

Why would I? You've yet to post any inconsistencies.

Ganon terrorizing Hyrule is the main point in the BS of LA and is something that never happens in OoX.

2 things:
1) Ganon doesn't need to terrorize Hyrule, for the umpteenth time.
2) 1 sentence out of 18 is the main point? lol

It's like saying that there was a Link between OoT and WW when we are clearly told there wasn't.

Difference is, we haven't been told anything that prevents OoX Link from being LttP Link.

If you post anything along the lines of "But Ganon was terrorizing Hyrule!" I'm am going to flip out. Read my posts and read the manual. It is not required in any way. Stop acting like it is.


Post real evidence, no opinionated crap. Because you have not done so thus far.

 

[Zemen]

Hahah I am posting real evidence. You just seem to think that your ASSUMPTIONS are more important than the evidence we are taking directly from the game and the manual. You have clearly posted what the manual states and the manual clearly states "You, who regained the peace of Hyrule from the demonic hands of the king of evil, Ganon"

I don't get what part of that makes you think that Ganon doesn't need to be in control of Hyrule because that sentence right there says to me "Link saved Hyrule from Ganons reign"

I seriously feel like you need to calm down and actually read what YOU are writing because you seem to be contradicting yourself. You say that Ganon taking over Hyrule doesn't need to happen and I'm gonna use one of your responses to that....The LA BS would disagree.

The BS of LA isn't about Hyrule having peace restored IN GENERAL. It's about Hyrule having peace regained FROM GANON who had absolutely no control over Hyrule during OoX seeing as how he was only alive (and barely, at that) for a few moments. Stop saying it doesn't matter, because it DOES, very much so.

 

[sign of table]

I don't get what part of that makes you think that Ganon doesn't need to be in control of Hyrule because that sentence right there says to me "Link saved Hyrule from Ganons reign"

What happens in OoX when you defeat Ganon?

You say that Ganon taking over Hyrule doesn't need to happen and I'm gonna use one of your responses to that....The LA BS would disagree.

Well, see, the LA BS never says that Ganon has control of Hyrule, it ONLY SAYS THAT YOU REGAINED PEACE FROM GANON. Link of OoX is fated to show up when peace in Hyrule crumbles, so peace HAS crumbled. Link defeats Ganon. Peace returns to Hyrule.

That applies in every way to the LA BS.

It's about Hyrule having peace regained FROM GANON who had absolutely no control over Hyrule during OoX seeing as how he was only alive (and barely, at that) for a few moments. Stop saying it doesn't matter, because it DOES, very much so.

I never said it doesn't matter, I just said you were wrong.

So tell me this, when you defeat Ganon, what happens? Here I'll give you a hint. Zelda says this after you defeat Ganon. "Now hope and peace will return to the hearts of the people."

 

[MrMosley]

So tell me this, when you defeat Ganon, what happens? Here I'll give you a hint. Zelda says this after you defeat Ganon. "Now hope and peace will return to the hearts of the people."

She doesn't specify which people she is talking about. Any normal player of the games would understand that she is probably talking about the people of Labrynna and Holodrum, seeing as how that's where they are at. Now if she said the people of Hyrule, it would be a different story.

 

[Zemen]

What happens in OoX when you defeat Ganon?

You answered that yourself by saying that peace returns to the PEOPLE. No where does it say that peace returned to Hyrule or that Hyrule was ever even in any danger. But apparently that doesn't matter to you.

I never said it doesn't matter

Here are quotes from you that totally disprove what you just said.

DL says - "IMO considering that OoX didn't take place in Hyrule."
You say - "It doesn't need to."

DL says - "Ganon is halfway revived at the very end, and has time to growl and moan before Link defeats him. I have yet to figure out how a halfway Ganon, moaning and growling, in Labrynna/Holodrum, has cause any bit of tyranny over Hyrule."
You say - "He doesn't have to."

I say - "Also, I am going to agree with DarkLink when he was explaining how the LA BS says that Link stops Ganon from the clutches and tyranny he had over Hyrule."
You say - "If you'd read the actual manual you'd know that Ganon wouldn't need to control Hyrule."

I say - "Ganon was in OoX long enough for one, short battle which didn't take place in Hyrule, so exactly how was Ganon causing terror in Hyrule if he was only HALF alive for only a few moments AND in a completely different country?"
You say - "It doesn't require anything that you keep going on about."

I say - "Ganon was not around long enough to terrorize anything."
You say - "Once again for like the 15th time, he never needed to."

I say - "Ganon terrorizing Hyrule is the main point in the BS of LA and is something that never happens in OoX"
You say - "Ganon doesn't need to terrorize Hyrule, for the umpteenth time."

It seems to me that you've said about umpteen times that it doesn't matter and now you're saying that you've never said that. Stop contradicting yourself.

So tell me this, when you defeat Ganon, what happens? Here I'll give you a hint. Zelda says this after you defeat Ganon. "Now hope and peace will return to the hearts of the people."

No part of that says that peace returned to Hyrule. As DarkLink said, anyone with a brain would assume she's talking about Labrynna/Holodrum's people seeing as how those are the 2 places the series takes place... Way to feed yourself your own poison with that one... Just because Zelda is the one that says peace will return to the people doesn't mean that she's talking about HER people.

It's kinda funny that your only good argument up this point was that Zelda supposedly said that peace returns to Hyrule after you beat OoX but then you later posted that quote and all she says is that peace will return to the heart of the people (she never once mentions Hyrule) and when we addressed that little problem you never replied to those posts. All of your posts are moot to the fact that Zelda never once said peace would return to Hyrule. Anyone with half a brain would know that shes talking about peace returning to the hearts of the people of Holodrum and Labrynna.

 

[Skull_Kid]

I think that I provided a good answer a few posts above after midna666 quoted a quote from Princess Zelda herself.

She INTRODUCES to Link when she first appears to him in the Oracles.
If these games were between ALttP and LA, it would have to be the same Link, and ALttP Link and Zelda already knew each other.
So why would she still need to introduce herself to our green capped hero?

 

[Zemen]

I think that I provided a good answer a few posts above after midna666 quoted a quote from Princess Zelda herself.

She INTRODUCES to Link when she first appears to him in the Oracles.
If these games were between ALttP and LA, it would have to be the same Link, and ALttP Link and Zelda already knew each other.
So why would she still need to introduce herself to our green capped hero?

Precisely! So let's take a look at both sides evidence that we have thus far and see which side is more substantial.

ALTTP/LA-OoX Evidence:

We have obvious original intent for LA to be a direct sequel as the games boss gives visions of past monsters fought (and one of the bosses forms is a shadow version of Aghanim).

We have the BS of LA that tells us that Link, who had just restored peace to Hyrule from the clutches of the king of darkness, Ganon, goes off to foreign lands to train.

That BS would only allow LA to possibly go after 4 games (LoZ, ALTTP or OoX). It can't be after LoZ because LoZ already has a direct sequel to it. It can't be after OoX because Link was sent to Holodrum/Labrynna against his own will whereas in the BS for LA it says he set off (of his own accord) to train in foreign lands. Also, Ganon never wreaked havoc in Hyrule during OoX. His minions wreaked havoc in Holodrum/Labrynna. Ganon was only HALF alive for moments in OoX. Not enough time to consider him as a threat to a country he wasn't even in.

Also, as Skull Kid said, if OoX did go after ALTTP it could not be a direct sequel as Zelda has to introduce herself to Link in OoX.

ALLTP/OoX-LA Evidence

A couple of enemies that only in appear in OoX and LA and since LA has Link's memories you guys believe that LA must come after a time when those enemies were met. This can best be explained by a rehashing of sprites because the 2 games used almost the exact same graphics engine.

Also, the owl in LA says to Link (not exact quote but very close to it) "It's good that you are here. All of the monsters on the island have been acting hostile recently. Please figure out what the problem is."

That quote from the owl is said to Link as soon as he find his sword which is only moments after he wakes up in the bed of Talons house. The way he talks about how the monsters have recently become hostile makes it sound like the monsters were there before Link was and they used to live peacefully. If the monsters were there before Link was then it's possible that the monsters actually aren't taken from Link's memories making the argument about exclusive monsters quite moot.


Another piece of evidence for this placement is the boat at the end of OoX that you are seen going away in. It looks like the boat in LA. That's pretty much the best evidence people who argue this placement have. The reason this argument is terrible is because the boats used are in no way out of the ordinary looking. If you told a 7 year old to draw a sail boat, the boats in OoX and LA are what he would draw. They are so ordinary and simple that, to me, there are probably hundreds of boats like them in the Zelda world.

Another (terrible) piece of evidence is the quote from Zelda saying "now peace will return to the hearts of the people." and for some god forsaken reason some of you (SoJ) think that this quote refers to the peace that was brought back to Hyrule. I think it's safe to say that this quote is talking about the people of Holodrum/Labrynna since those were the people Link was trying to save.

 

[Skull_Kid]

How could Ganon's half-completed ressurrection affect Hyrule?
He never left the TwinRova's hideout, and was half-alive for just a few moments.
At the beggining of the Oracles, we see the Triforce(The complete one, not just a piece) sending Link to either Holodrum or Labrynna(depending on game), I don't think that it would send Link there if Hyrule's piece was in question.
The point is, it were those two "distant" lands that were endangered, Hyrule was clearly at peace, even more so, Zelda travelled to those lands.
Do you think that she would leave her Country and her beloved people if Hyrule was in Danger?
Of course not. I believe that, in the same way that the Triforce summoned Link, if a greater evil loomed upon Hyrule, it would have warped him back.

And yes, the quote in wich Zelda says that peace returned to the heart of people CLEARLY is referring to Labrynna and Holodrum, even my 7 year old brother got that when he played the games.

Just give me a good reason why a half-alive mindless Ganon, who was nothing more than a walking vessel capable of nothing but destruction and was killed moments after being ressurrected could EVER affect Hyrule?

 

[Zemen]

How could Ganon's half-completed ressurrection affect Hyrule?
He never left the TwinRova's hideout, and was half-alive for just a few moments.
At the beggining of the Oracles, we see the Triforce(The complete one, not just a piece) sending Link to either Holodrum or Labrynna(depending on game), I don't think that it would send Link there if Hyrule's piece was in question.
The point is, it were those two "distant" lands that were endangered, Hyrule was clearly at peace, even more so, Zelda travelled to those lands.
Do you think that she would leave her Country and her beloved people if Hyrule was in Danger?
Of course not. I believe that, in the same way that the Triforce summoned Link, if a greater evil loomed upon Hyrule, it would have warped him back.

And yes, the quote in wich Zelda says that peace returned to the heart of people CLEARLY is referring to Labrynna and Holodrum, even my 7 year old brother got that when he played the games.

Just give me a good reason why a half-alive mindless Ganon, who was nothing more than a walking vessel capable of nothing but destruction and was killed moments after being ressurrected could EVER affect Hyrule?

I can already tell you what SoJ's response to this will be.

"He doesn't have to affect Hyrule." That's the same response he's given everyone else. Apparently when they tell you that Ganon is reigning over Hyrule, we're not supposed to take it literally...go figure.

In response to you, SoJ, which game does Zelda call Link "the hero destined to appear when peace in Hyrule crumbles"? If it's OoX I would like you to post the exact quote, because last time you told us about something Zelda said (peace returns to Hyrule), it ended up being something completely different (peace returns to the hearts of the people). I just want to make sure that this time she doesn't say that he's "the hero destined to appear when peace crumbles" rather than being "the hero who appears when peace crumbles in Hyrule."

 

[MrMosley]

In response to you, SoJ, which game does Zelda call Link "the hero destined to appear when peace in Hyrule crumbles"? If it's OoX I would like you to post the exact quote, because last time you told us about something Zelda said (peace returns to Hyrule), it ended up being something completely different (peace returns to the hearts of the people). I just want to make sure that this time she doesn't say that he's "the hero destined to appear when peace crumbles" rather than being "the hero who appears when peace crumbles in Hyrule."

Not that it makes my mind change about the order, but she does specify peace crumbling in Hyrule (skip to about 4:20). At the beginning (at least of OoA), Impa says that the mark is that of a Hyrulean Hero. Here is the ending just for some reference.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UofFsnbdctU

 

[Zemen]

Not that it makes my mind change about the order, but she does specify peace crumbling in Hyrule (skip to about 4:20). At the beginning (at least of OoA), Impa says that the mark is that of a Hyrulean Hero. Here is the ending just for some reference.

She never said that he appeared BECAUSE peace crumbled in Hyrule. The whole point is that none of the battles, monsters, danger happened in Hyrule. It was all in completely different countries than Hyrule. SoJ's main argument deals with Hyrule which this game has no connection to.