"It get's fantastic .... 20 hours in."

[Sheikah_Witch]

You can often hear this phrase when people talk about fantastic RPG's they love. Slow burners. Gentle slopes, whatever one might call them.

When buying a new game, choosing to dive into something, for the most part an RPG, are you the kind to give a game that generous a chance: not liking it initially, but not giving up on it until 10-20 hours later because 'that's when it's supposed to get good'?

Can it be considered a flaw if a game doesn't get kicking until hours upon hours later? Or are there games that are among your absolute favorites - even if they have a very, very slow start?

Is there value to be had in 'slow burners'?

 

[Spirit]

I've always held the belief that slow burners are different from stories that 'get better later'.

A slow burner can still do a lot to intrigue you and build the characters before things start cutting loose, and by that point you've come to care about the characters and are invested.

Games that just 'get better later' are different because they do nothing to invest you and the 'better' bit is just elements coming together to be a bit more interesting than it has been previously.

I give RPGs much longer than I should to 'get good' if I'm not enjoying them and always regret it.

I'd say if you're not having fun with any kind of game within the first 90minutes then it isn't worth it. You need to get invested early, you need to be interested in what you're doing and have some level of enjoyment in doing it. If none of that is happening within the first couple of hours or even 90minutes then it doesn't bode well for the rest of the game.

A game should never be described as 'it gets better later', because there's no other way to read that than the beginning of the game being a failure on numerous levels.

 

[VikzeLink]

I played Xenoblade Chronicles for the first time in 2019 (finished it in 2020) and I must say that while the game was fun to play, the plot didn't really interest me overly much until about halfway through the game.
It was as if the game was expecting me to care more about the characters early on than I did, since I hadn't had enough time to get to know them yet. It felt over dramatic for being so early in the game, and while it makes sense for the characters to care about eachother that much, since they know eachother, it felt weird for me who just started playing.

One of the characters, Fiora, dies in the beginning of the game, and it played out very dramatically with huge reactions from the other characters. But since I didn't really get enough time to get to know the character, it just felt weird to me to have that intense drama that early on. A little bit later you're going into a mine to save a guy called Otharon, and the main characters doesn't know him at this point, but the game puts very heavy drama whenever he is in danger, but since it doesn't feel like he has any real emotional connection to the main character, it just feels weird...
Later on in the game, the drama makes sense, as the story has progressed and the characters have gotten to know eachother.

To me it's a game that gets better later simply because the character arcs feel super awkward in the beginning. It's almost as if this is part 2 of a series and you missed the first one (speaking purely of how character interact towards eachother early on in the game). It is a very long game, so they could have made that better. It's not as if the character development was ever in a rush.

 

[Mikey the Gengar]

I will keep stubbornly playing games until either I break them or they break me
so I tend to have harsh opinions of games that I stuck to even when I wasn't having fun, like undertale

 

[Ninja]

I played Xenoblade Chronicles for the first time in 2019 (finished it in 2020) and I must say that while the game was fun to play, the plot didn't really interest me overly much until about halfway through the game.
It was as if the game was expecting me to care more about the characters early on than I did, since I hadn't had enough time to get to know them yet. It felt over dramatic for being so early in the game, and while it makes sense for the characters to care about eachother that much, since they know eachother, it felt weird for me who just started playing.

One of the characters, Fiora, dies in the beginning of the game, and it played out very dramatically with huge reactions from the other characters. But since I didn't really get enough time to get to know the character, it just felt weird to me to have that intense drama that early on. A little bit later you're going into a mine to save a guy called Otharon, and the main characters doesn't know him at this point, but the game puts very heavy drama whenever he is in danger, but since it doesn't feel like he has any real emotional connection to the main character, it just feels weird...
Later on in the game, the drama makes sense, as the story has progressed and the characters have gotten to know eachother.

To me it's a game that gets better later simply because the character arcs feel super awkward in the beginning. It's almost as if this is part 2 of a series and you missed the first one (speaking purely of how character interact towards eachother early on in the game). It is a very long game, so they could have made that better. It's not as if the character development was ever in a rush.

I was thinking about getting the game, that’s a pretty big spoiler so I’m not so sure now since she’s apparently one of the major characters. How big of an impact does Fiora have in the game? I really enjoyed XBC2.

 

[Kirino]

I was thinking about getting the game, that’s a pretty big spoiler so I’m not so sure now since she’s apparently one of the major characters. How big of an impact does Fiora have in the game? I really enjoyed XBC2.

I honestly wouldn't worry about it too much. It happens very early in the game, and there are plenty of bigger twists.

 

[AwdryFan1997]

Final Fantasy III sucks, and being a slow starter is a part of it. Chrono Trigger is immediate action, which continues throughout. The plot is constantly in motion; there is little time to stop and wander for no reason. And that's the way I like it. I originally thought EarthBound was pretty slow, until I managed to git gud and actual try to play the game, and I found it to be excellent in its design, with each town being a sort of "checkpoint" in your quest. Paper Mario feels kinda slow, until it eventually picks up and you just kinda completely forget the tutorial ever happened. Super Mario RPG is pretty far from "slow-starting" but I dislike some stuff the game did with its design that really hamper the experience.

So to answer your question, no, there is no value in "slow burners". I want them to burn faster. Maybe some more firewood will help.

 

[VikzeLink]

I was thinking about getting the game, that’s a pretty big spoiler so I’m not so sure now since she’s apparently one of the major characters. How big of an impact does Fiora have in the game? I really enjoyed XBC2.

I honestly wouldn't worry about it too much. It happens very early in the game, and there are plenty of bigger twists.

Yea, it's not really a spoiler at all. She is with you a little bit in the beginning for one little tutorial quest, then there is a bunch of story cutscenes, a thing happens and then she dies. It's mainly to give Shulk and Reyn a motive for leaving their village

 

[mαrkαsscoρ]

Yea, it's not really a spoiler at all. She is with you a little bit in the beginning for one little tutorial quest, then there is a bunch of story cutscenes, a thing happens and then she dies. It's mainly to give Shulk and Reyn a motive for leaving their village

I'd say it kind of is a spoiler, even if it's early on, you're not expecting to that happen to a party member, that certainly came as a shock to me when I first played it

smash has done worse so I'm a little null to that, but I definitely wouldn't have said that

 

[VikzeLink]

smash has done worse so I'm a little null to that, but I definitely wouldn't have said that

You mean with trophy descriptions and such?

 

[Spirit]

You mean with trophy descriptions and such?

One of the Dragon Quest XI spirits has a fairly major spoiler.

 

[mαrkαsscoρ]

You mean with trophy descriptions and such?

Spoiler

the trophy in smash 4, spirits and freaking shulk's final smash in ultimate

 

[Ronin]

I was thinking about getting the game, that’s a pretty big spoiler so I’m not so sure now since she’s apparently one of the major characters. How big of an impact does Fiora have in the game? I really enjoyed XBC2.

Depending on how quickly you move the story along, it can take place within the first hour or two. Fiora's death is what sets things in motion, so she has a major impact on the game and then some. That's all I can say without going into major spoiler territory.

 

[the8thark]

I have to say one of the only slow burner games I've played was Breath of the Wild.

Even in the typical slow burner games, there's still things to do early game, story to progress. Characters to learn about.
BotW on the other hand once you're out of the cave, that's it. Totally on your own to work out what to do and where to go. Even the story takes a while to learn as you get it in dribs and drabs, not a continual flowing story like most other RPGs.

I don't think BotW gets good 20 hours in because the game hasn't changed 20 hours in. It's the same thing. It's just a slower paced game where going anywhere or doing anything takes ages. Add in so much to find and do and it really slows the pace of the game down. Not a bad thing though as it works as a, as fast or slow as you want kind of game.

 

[Quin]

I'm not sure you know what a slow burner is, because BOTW is for 100% sure not one. You watch one cutscene and walk out one cave and thats literally when the game begins. TP is the only game that comes to mind for being a slow burner, maybe.

Older MH might be considered a slow burner, since the first couple of quests are mostly gathering and other stuff to easy you in its mechanics. Its really not that bad in most games but I have heard of enough people quiting before they fought a real monster that I feel like I should mention it.

Xenoblade 2 has a really boring first 5 hours that almost took me out of it. It does get better but thay doesnt make it right.

You mean with trophy descriptions and such?

In Ultimate Sakurai basically made it his job to spoil a big thing about the game and there really is no way around it. I think its even in one of the game modes art.