Hyrule Warriors HRRRK! OH GOD IT HURTS!

[AncientPoe]

So, I'm willing to bet I'm far from the first person to notice this, but in the new Twilight maps you take a ton of damage. I'm talking 8-10+ hearts from single hits here. Since that in its own right is enough to pretty much spoil an A-rank right there, is anyone aware of exactly how defense works in this game? As you gain levels, does your resistance to incoming damage increase along with your heart container capacity? Or are we pretty much required to Perfect Clear every single level that doesn't use badges?

 

[Jirohnagi]

Defense comes from the defense medals. The ones that state they improve defense on a recommended level. This is completely useless if you are on a stage that has no elemental recommendation. I think the enemies do a preset amount of damage and the medals will subtract from that amount to give you the amount of damage you take.

 

[the8thark]

We do not know how the armour badges work on stages with no favoured element. And yes you take a ton of damage on these stages.
One stage you have to Beat up 3 enemy heroes but only attacks that hit all 3 of them at once do damage. If you hit only 1 or 2 of them at once then all 3 are healed up. And these enemy heroes hit you for about 8-10 hearts of damage per hit (with Lv2 armour badges). These kind of stages are just beyond hard, they are simply not fun.

 

[Jirohnagi]

These are the stages that teach you it is better to focus on wide groups of foes rather than one at a time. Darkness Element is useless in these scenarios. If you cannot swap focus from one to many you are doomed from the get go. Personally i would go with a character who can attack them all and have no gaps Link and the Master Sword is best for the simple thing of that spin attack foes can't break it because they are caught into it. If you have awakened it even better.

 

[AncientPoe]

Oh, let's be clear: I'm not having trouble beating the levels. I have no problem staying alive. It's A-ranks that are the problem. For that, I don't really have a choice who I pick. Getting an A-Rank would be useless to me with Link if I need to do it with Ganondorf or Girahim for the heart piece. And most of these levels don't have a recommended element, so there's no way to mitigate that damage apparently.

I mean, I'm quite good at this game, but I'm not 'don't get hit at all' good. Really, that's not where I derive my fun anyway. Ya gotta be a little reckless sometimes. And frankly, I'm not looking forward to the idea of forcing myself to be that hyper aware of every incoming enemy attack for an entire adventure map worth of unlockables. These guys are doing so much that if i get hit with a moblin spear, with shiek, and a brand new Water barrier, the whole barrier goes away and i'm still taking 5-8 hearts worth of damage. I can't really see a way to deal with this and still have lots of fun. I mean, it's pretty obvious that these new levels are made with the new level cap in mind, but that doesn't do much for incoming damage.

 

[Jirohnagi]

Yea i don't like the fact you have to be hyper aware. The best bet i can say is find out the time parameters on the missions and use that extra time Shielding. That or dodging. There isn't much you can do. Which is irritating. I think the main reason they have done this is to make us play longer on the game instead of being done in 20 mins ( slight over exaggeration there but the point stands)and then not do anything with it.

 

[AncientPoe]

Well, I suppose it does change where the challenge lies. Differences in Kind and all that. I mean, the first adventure map completion took a good while. Still haven't finished the Master Quest map, not even close. Right now I'm still just thinking there'll be some trick I haven't become aware of yet. In some of those maps, I think the damage limit for an A is greater than 5,000 this time.

 

[the8thark]

Yea i don't like the fact you have to be hyper aware. The best bet i can say is find out the time parameters on the missions and use that extra time Shielding. That or dodging. There isn't much you can do. Which is irritating. I think the main reason they have done this is to make us play longer on the game instead of being done in 20 mins ( slight over exaggeration there but the point stands)and then not do anything with it.

The game should have been like this.
C Rank to beat the level and get the map item
B Rank for the Character item (weapon or heart piece or costume)
A Rank for gold medal

That's it. And there would be no rank requirement to move to a new stage.
This would remove all the BS needed to get the loot and then you could come back to the levels with the best weapon and a lot of levels to try and beat the levels with A Rank. Being forced to A Rank these stupidly hard levels for the character loot is just not fun.

 

[DarkestLink]

The Zelda fanbase, I swear...

We need challenging games! It isn't fun unless the game challenges us!

*Hyrule Warriors is released*

The game is too hard! It's not fun anymore! DX

And honestly, this game isn't even that hard. Yes, I am getting stuck. Zant's old school weapon mission (A4) in the TP is giving me a run for my money. But as far as challenging games go (yes, including modern games), this isn't all that bad. I'd say it's average difficulty at most. That said, I probably would be having more fun if they gave us a "less damage" potion or something. An occasional challenge is nice, but overall I (and apparently a lot of people) don't get that much entertainment from a lot of challenges.

This game's real issue, IMO, is leveling though. I feel it'd be much better if they took out levels (weapons are fine) in the next installment. The real "challenge" in this game is knowing you're under leveled but not wanting to go through a grindfest, and going through a mission your character isn't prepared for to avoid grinding.

On the opposite side of the spectrum, your favorite characters end up getting too high leveled. Now even Hero Mode is a breeze, so if you WANT to be challenged, you can't use that character anymore. It'd be much better if we simply didn't have levels, grinding was removed, and every mission was beaten solely on your skill and nothing else.

 

[MartDiamond]

The Zelda fanbase, I swear...

We need challenging games! It isn't fun unless the game challenges us!

*Hyrule Warriors is released*

The game is too hard! It's not fun anymore! DX

And honestly, this game isn't even that hard. Yes, I am getting stuck. Zant's old school weapon mission (A4) in the TP is giving me a run for my money. But as far as challenging games go (yes, including modern games), this isn't all that bad. I'd say it's average difficulty at most. That said, I probably would be having more fun if they gave us a "less damage" potion or something. An occasional challenge is nice, but overall I (and apparently a lot of people) don't get that much entertainment from a lot of challenges.

This game's real issue, IMO, is leveling though. I feel it'd be much better if they took out levels (weapons are fine) in the next installment. The real "challenge" in this game is knowing you're under leveled but not wanting to go through a grindfest, and going through a mission your character isn't prepared for to avoid grinding.

On the opposite side of the spectrum, your favorite characters end up getting too high leveled. Now even Hero Mode is a breeze, so if you WANT to be challenged, you can't use that character anymore. It'd be much better if we simply didn't have levels, grinding was removed, and every mission was beaten solely on your skill and nothing else.

There's a difference between a challenge and artificially making something difficult by just increasing hit points, attack powers, defense etc. a ton. There's a ton of creative ways they could have upped the difficulty, but instead they chose to just throw in the same old enemies powered up immensely. At the same time they still don't fix the issue of the relative uselessness of Heart Pieces and to some extent defensive badges, just put more emphasis on it.

 

[DarkestLink]

There's a difference between a challenge and artificially making something difficult by just increasing hit points, attack powers, defense etc. a ton. There's a ton of creative ways they could have upped the difficulty, but instead they chose to just throw in the same old enemies powered up immensely. At the same time they still don't fix the issue of the relative uselessness of Heart Pieces and to some extent defensive badges, just put more emphasis on it.

That's essentially hero mode and the 2nd quest in a nutshell, and yet the fanbse acts like it makes all the difference.

 

[AncientPoe]

Also DL, I'd like to remind you that not everyone is in their teens with tons of time to devote to video games. Truthfully, I'm not saying that you or anyone else here is. However, I'd just like to point out that some people (like myself) have to devote a significant amount of time to not being dead or homeless. I, for one, only have a few hours a week that I can devote to my hobby. I don't want to spend that time repeatedly failing a level because taking a single hit is enough to screw up the rank. If I could come home from school and play until dinner like I used to be able to do that would be one thing. That's not the case anymore, however. You should remember that there's a difference between 'challenging' and 'punishing'. You should also note that the rewards for enduring such punishment does not seem, at this time, to match the scale of the punishment.

 

[Locke]

There's a difference between a challenge and artificially making something difficult by just increasing hit points, attack powers, defense etc. a ton. There's a ton of creative ways they could have upped the difficulty, but instead they chose to just throw in the same old enemies powered up immensely. At the same time they still don't fix the issue of the relative uselessness of Heart Pieces and to some extent defensive badges, just put more emphasis on it.

I don't understand your complaint about heart pieces after what you said about inflating attack power. Heart Pieces are made even more useful when enemies do more damage. They're only useless when you're going for A-rank.

I agree though that increasing the frequency of footsoldier attacks for example would be a much better way to increase difficulty.

In response to the OP, I haven't had too much time to play the new map, but so far I haven't encountered too much enemy damage. I recall powered-up Volga toward the end of Legend Mode dealing 10+ hearts per attack.

 

[AncientPoe]

Yeah. The first few maps don't really do it. There's a few random ones I've found with the damage scaled back to normal levels. Once you get to about the second zone you'll find it. However, I'd also like to state that I do believe the damage output may indeed be tied to level in some way.

In one of the first few levels, I tried to use Twili Midna. She was level 25 at the time. One hit from Cia was enough to take between a third and a half of her life total. Later, using a stronger character, the damage was much less. Honestly, I think this will be one of those things that doesn't equal out until I get much closer to that 150 cap. Hopefully.

 

[MartDiamond]

@Darkest
Something like Hero Mode and MQ is extra content. Just like people who set up challenges for themselves (3 heart challenge etc.). What we are talking about now is core gameplay. I'm pretty sure that if the the modes you mentioned were the standard way of playing the game the more casual folks would not be as interested,

I don't understand your complaint about heart pieces after what you said about inflating attack power. Heart Pieces are made even more useful when enemies do more damage. They're only useless when you're going for A-rank.

I agree though that increasing the frequency of footsoldier attacks for example would be a much better way to increase difficulty.

In response to the OP, I haven't had too much time to play the new map, but so far I haven't encountered too much enemy damage. I recall powered-up Volga toward the end of Legend Mode dealing 10+ hearts per attack.

I was indeed referring to A ranking maps. Most rewards that are worthwhile are locked behind an A rank, so unless you are a completionist you basically want the weapons and costumes unlocked which are all locked behind maps that are extremely difficult to A rank.