Game Thread ExLight's Custom Role Mafia - ENDGAME [TOWN WINS]

[ExLight]

Votecount 1.8.

ExLight (1) - Storm
Mint Elv (1) - Paranoid King
KingOfDominaria (1) - Ragnarokio
Jinjo (1) - SoulAdvent
SoulAdvent (1) - Seanzie
Not voting (8) - Laurentus, KoD, DawningWinds, 15377, EchoLight, Mint Elv, Jinjo, Minish

Phase shortening (1) - Storm
Add Hammer Rules (3) - Seanzie, Ragnarokio, Storm


Phase ends on April 23rd, at 9:00:00 PM (GMT-3).
DEADLINE COUNTDOWN

3h UNTIL DEADLINE

 

[Jinjo]

I come back and there are alot of players not voting. For those who are not voting I'm assuming they don't have any scum reads.

 

[SoulAdvent]

@DawningWinds

Okay, I feel a lot better about you . Thank you!

I see about Jinjo. I will take a mental note for the future, that was very helpful. I’m getting a better vibe of everyone this way.

No vote: Jinjo

She is here now too

 

[SoulAdvent]

I come back and there are alot of players not voting. For those who are not voting I'm assuming they don't have any scum reads.

Yes and we have 3 hours until the deadline and it’s not like there is a lot of action :/. Text based like this is slow and especially with no result. Maybe better to just lynch the host than anyone xD.

 

[Jinjo]

Problem I have here is no one pinged me very scummy so far and players are null with a town lean I have.

Voting the host is a 50-50 since we don't know what will happen.

 

[SoulAdvent]

Votecount 1.8.

ExLight (1) - Storm
Mint Elv (1) - Paranoid King
KingOfDominaria (1) - Ragnarokio
Jinjo (1) - SoulAdvent
SoulAdvent (1) - Seanzie
Not voting (8) - Laurentus, KoD, DawningWinds, 15377, EchoLight, Mint Elv, Jinjo, Minish

Phase shortening (1) - Storm
Add Hammer Rules (3) - Seanzie, Ragnarokio, Storm

Okay, sometimes when we are blocked in what we should do around the middle of the game, we do an exercise together where we ask others to just say out loud the top 2 or 3 people they have a strange feeling about when thinking while looking at the others . It can work in trying to find if someone is being real or making it up.

I still haven’t reread the thread but for the sake of starting, I am going to say:

Storm, 15377 and Ragnarokio.

I will keep a closer eye to the posted posts of these 3 and maybe I can figure why I feel like they might be hiding something.

 

[ExLight]

No vote: Jinjo

I'll consider this as you Unvoting

 

[SoulAdvent]

Time for the Storm!

All of the messages in the thread:

Vote: Phase Shortage

i dont recall how things go on Bulbagarden, but by the end of this nobody is gonna talk, because the meta i see here is usually " kill the Talkers"

but let's enjoy RVS while we can, alright

Vote: Exlight

you know what time it is
STORM'S LIST OF BADASS F*CKITUDE

• Numbers
• DawningWinds-not exactly a nulltell, but you havent done anything suspicious yet i believe
• Echolight
• Jinjo
• KoD-already trying to make enemies by going "Grr. Im buying the thing"
• Laurentus
• Minish
• Mintish
• PK
• Rag
• Seanzie
• Soul
• Storm

go get your shinebox

Vote: Hammer
Catching up. Expect observations later, but i do agree with Seanzie. I am curious what will happen.

Wow, looking at all this now I get why I didn’t feel comfortable when looking at the list.

There is really not much to this at all… Storm voted to shorten the phase, which I don’t know how that helps but it is not necessarily like that of a wolf.

The 2nd time he posts something, he says that talking will get you lynched, I feel like this may actually be a very suspicious thing to say because Storm is excusing himself already for not talking. Wow! I did not catch or think of this earlier… o.0

Storm votes ExLight as well, which makes it a very safe attack because ExLight won’t tell him to stop doing it or ask about it because he is not playing. Wow!

Reads list already, but this looks like an obvious joke anyone can do so it’s ok for me.

“Expect observations later” - and the deadline is in 3 hours and no observations are to be seen. I guess Storm can say “I will say things later” but then save face by saying he didn’t say exactly when.

Not a good look at all.

 

[SoulAdvent]

This is a game of calculations!

I find it interesting that given the anonymous nature of purchasing that nobody has floated the notion that KoD could simply have lied about buying the thing. Further this creates a flaw in the "let's make town spend out so scum can win" plan by removing accountability on actual spending. The only verification we would have is the item simply not being bought but unknown elements might wrench that to begin with. Let's say PK is a 3p that wins as long as he has the most stuff (example formulated upon their assertion of buying all the things). If they are snatching up all the items before anyone else can/is forced to, our accountability is gone. Likewise there may be roles that just straight mug money from people. The plan on a whole just isn't controllable enough to be a realistic strategy, imo.

I got up early for inventory today I have no more thoughts at this time.

DW I really think you overestimate the flak KoD will take if he doesn't produce an outted result.

Its not an easily disproven lie though, and that's why you overestimate the risk in such a play. That assessment only applies if KoD continues to treat the situation as a matter of fact and pushes based solely off of his flavor investigation which then fails to produce the desired outcome. But as has been thoroughly discussed, that's not the only avenue KoD can take from here. And each other path creates less and less risk and more opportunity for a scum!KoD to take such an action. Further, KoD is not a play it safe player regardless of alignment. I don't see his action as alignment indicative here. More likely KoD has a lyncher type role and is looking for a specific role. His pm probably alludes to them knowing this so his comments early on are to Guage reactions so as to better direct his shot. I don't feel bad if this ruins his reactions because nothing says that this removal would be pro town.

I'm assuming this is referring to Hapi's game? As far as I know Hapi decided everything she was going to do on the fly after she was lynched. I'm pretty sure no actual abilities failed, although some seemed like they did because she ciphered role results as well and nobody caught the binary cipher until she was beating them over the head with it because everybody was just ignoring it. Having reviewed her original design file before the game started I can say definitively that she didn't have anything on paper for it prior to game start at least. So just saying players can try to do something if they want (which was in her OP as well) doesn't mean it's a designed aspect of the game.

@DW, I'm pretty sure there isn't a stated means to do so. As has been mentioned before roles were potentially randomly assigned alignments meaning flavor checks are NAI without evidence that they aren't. Realistic expectation of KoD delivering on his claim is almost zero. With no reasonable expectation of delivering on the promise KoD isn't risking much by not following through. Further he can still take a different approach and lower expectations of following through even more (like was mentioned with reaction testing) and never intend to follow through. I just don't see any reasonable reason to clear KoD based on hyped up risk.

I meant to address this earlier but started eating bacon sandwiches while drafting and forgot about it because mmmm.....bacon...my apologies. My experience with Lau is brief, 3 games. One co-player, one spectator, and one hosting. The first two were on wintreath (his home site). There he is one of the more prolific posters. The third he came to NGA (my home site) for a game and was prodded 24 hours into the game start; less for activity in thread more because he had a lover role and hadn't even reported for duty in their discord either and the other lover was inquiring about their absence. Once he was there and settled in both thread and discord he was much more present. So this feels similar to that for me. There's also the possibility that he's a silenced player though.

Lau if you're here and silenced, react to this post, ja?

As for DW and the money win, that would be a strategy if DW was a known 3p with sole ownership of the money win because it's basic 3p precaution. But the money win will remain even if DW is removed so that threat will loom over every lynch until game's end regardless of if DW is lynched or not. With DW here being the likely winner of said mini game, given his claim so far, I think it's more pertinent to leave him unless we read him as non-town.

Okay, first post is fine. KoD could be lying true, but we don’t have reason to doubt it, and if he lying if he is a villager, then that could be good because that could be tricking the Mafia. The problems start if KoD is lying about how they use the role they bought.

Reading all over this now I know why I have a strange feeling. It’s really just talking about KoD and the functions of the game. I like how he helped me with Laurentus at least but most of the posts are really boring talk about how the buying stuff for power could work out. I always get bored when we get to talk about how a power works more than seeing how people react. It’s ok by itself, but when it’s the only thing you really do, I feel like it covers you up and it makes me worried.

I feel less like there is something strange with you now, but I am still keeping an

 

[Seanzie]

Unvote.

Vote: Exlight

 

[SoulAdvent]

hi friends

i'm hungry

i doubt we can infer alignment from rolenames, only mechanics (and even then it'll require a lot of guesswork presumably)

the magnifying glass is thus probably better for scum, but i think KoD buying it is more or less NAI. I would think the watcher one-shot would be the more appealing investigative option for town

thinking about it more, its always equally in town and scum's interest to buy a given item, since the more an item is worth to town, the more money scum will be willing to spend to prevent town from getting it, and vice-versa. This might change depending on how the money mechanic develops though. There's a role called marketeer (potentially) in the game and i would guess this mechanic is centered around them.

a lot of roles could potentially use money as a mechanic but the market specifically immediately brings attention to the marketeer. Its always possible its a coincidence, but its probably a strong enough connection that its worth keeping in mind.

I have other sheep, too, that are not in this sheepfold. I must bring them also. They will listen to my voice, and there will be one flock with one shepherd.

it didn't occur to me that the purchases were anonymous simply because KoD announced himself so loudly

good morning friends



i think this is from another game and just got left over in my multiquote



there will probably be other mechanics that can cause money to move between people (ie: the gambler might be able to force people to gamble with them and cause them to lose/gain money that way) so such a strategy won't be safe. We'll have more information about what abilities might interact with money going into day 2 though, assuming players can see their own money at all times.



nice avatar



in my experience lurkers on this site and on others have a tendency to stay alive longer than active posters. In the last few games I've played here the end-game has been mostly active players though, just because there hasn't been a lot of lurkers.



lie detectors aren't common here

The bribery strategy is a pretty interesting concept but its probably not something that will be workable until we know more about how money will move and the mafia can feel relatively secure in betraying their team mates. I'm guessing it still won't work out since it requires some trust and most players would feel guilty about playing that way but its a fun idea and I think we should keep it in mind as we learn more about the setup.

Vote: Exlight

idk what lynching the moderator tends to acheive in bulba games but if the bulbites think its worth doing i'll follow their advice

Unvote

i'll take dawning wind's advice here. I also doubt ex would straight up end the game as a result of being lynched but if lynching the mod isn't like lynching a pinata then i don't see any reason to do it.




mood

i haven't been able to read anyone yet and i think mechanical discussion is usually NAI. We haven't had much else, but its not like i've done anything to break that status quo either so i can't really complain.

I guess anyone who would normally try to generate real discussion day 1 but hasn't is a decent scumlean

i think KoD might fit that bill?

Vote: KoD

It’s mostly talking about mechanics, and then they vote the host.

I do not share the same feelings of worry about KoD, but looking at this more I think this action makes… sense? :u I need to read KoD again to see if I agree or not but there is an attempt past the mechanics and voting ExLight (which is already more than theother two xD) so they are good for that.

 

[SoulAdvent]

i doubt we can infer alignment from rolenames, only mechanics (and even then it'll require a lot of guesswork presumably)

the magnifying glass is thus probably better for scum, but i think KoD buying it is more or less NAI. I would think the watcher one-shot would be the more appealing investigative option for town

@KingofDominaria Why did you pick the flavor cop over the watcher role? Do you disagree with what Ragnarokio says and that flavor cop is better? If so, why is flavor cop better? Thank you :3

 

[Paranoid King]

Here's something interesting. Mafia don't necessarily win just by controlling the vote. I'm not sure if that means they might have more win conditions or if it means that items and abilities can change the balance of power there.

> Voting for "No Lynch" is allowed. A tie between "No Lynch" and a Player will prioritize "No Lynch". Keep in mind this would normally allow Mafia to control the votes as soon as they reach Parity, but that this might not be enough to satisfy their wincon.

Which means there's a slim chance that they might need to lynch Exlight to win.

 

[DawningWinds]

Town
Laurentus - I can see all the points they made against me when they first entered coming from a town mindset; reading the posts I definitely understand why they were getting the impression they were, and the following reevalution of my thought process as they read through the thread shows they were willing to see different possibilities for my alignment; I think they're pretty town.
KingOfDominaria - Numbers explained why the flavourcop thing isn't nearly as risky, even from a scum's perspective, as I thought it was, so that does hurt my townread on him some, but I do still think he's most likely town. The flavourcop thing was still the first thing to get discussion rolling,
SoulAdvent - They're willing to shift their stances in a natural-feeling way as new info comes up. I like their initiative on asking people to give their top scum reads and going through and explaining why. Overall really good vibes from them.
Mint Elv - While I say later I think PK makes good points for her scumminess, I disagree with those points; her misunderstanding of things feel generally pretty natural, not as intentional misrepping, and she feels like she's actually trying to figure out where people are. Generally feeling good about her.
Morbid Minish and Ragnarkio - Nothing concrete, but I'm getting townish vibes from both of them.

Null
Jinjo - I think I'd usually expect more from her, but at this point I don't think its something I want to push her over
EchoLight - I completely forgot they were in the game.
Seanzie - The main thing he's done is vote the host, which could come from either faction. On one hand, town could genuinely expect to get something from it, on the other, as mafia, it could be a way to 100% guarantee no one on his team is getting lynched. The other thing that comes to mind is the bribery strategy, which could also be beneficial to either faction- he could've been scum hoping to betray his team for an easy win, or town thinking getting scum to do so would be a fast way to win.

Scum
Paranoid King - Kinda scummy? I don't know how I feel about the "I'm gonna buy 100% of everything"; a lot of people have given reasons for having everything on one person being bad; and further, I feel like promising to take it all assumes most of the other people buying are not on his team, which most likely means scum to me, though that's kinda tinfoily maybe. He also tossed out a readlist and never really elaborated on any of the reads except Mint, even though he was asked to explain why he townread his townreads. That said, I think he makes good points in his Mint reads about her questions seeming dishonest, but immediately saying that they don't seem to be so consciously makes it seem like he actually just thinks she's misreading things (which is what I'm inclined to believe), making his scumread on her seem more dishonest.

15377 - Scummy I think. Most of their posts are mainly commenting on KoD's flavourcop thing, but despite saying on several occasions they disagree with the notion that flavourcop thing makes KoD town, they don't ever state what their read on KoD is. They also say leaving me alive because the money thing is a risk for everyone but seem to think I will win the money minigame (this was before I outed I only receive 30% of what I was given and that I had no clue where the rest went, so this did appear pretty guaranteed at the time); if they're scum, they could've been planning to have me side with them later, exactly as Soul suggested.

Storm - Kicking things off by giving your reads is a nice start, but it didn't keep up, and with it having been so early it just feels kinda pointless. None of his posts besides then feel like they've had any worthwhile content, so I'm not really trusting him. Also agree with Soul on him saying "talking gets you killed" is a good way to excuse not talking, especially since it directly contradicts my experience here.

DawningWinds - They outed their money role and still haven't fully explained how it works in its entirety, only trickling out information as it protects them from dying. Selfpres much?

Vote: Paranoid King

 

[SoulAdvent]

Okay, sometimes when we are blocked in what we should do around the middle of the game, we do an exercise together where we ask others to just say out loud the top 2 or 3 people they have a strange feeling about when thinking while looking at the others . It can work in trying to find if someone is being real or making it up.

I still haven’t reread the thread but for the sake of starting, I am going to say:

Storm, 15377 and Ragnarokio.

I will keep a closer eye to the posted posts of these 3 and maybe I can figure why I feel like they might be hiding something.

Ragnarokio I am good with now

15377 I am feeling better, I worry a lot less at least.

Storm I worry A LOT. Least interesting and most suspicious player. Please reread what I said earlier about them.

Vote: Storm