Game Thread ExLight's Custom Role Mafia - ENDGAME [TOWN WINS]

[DawningWinds]

thinking about it more, its always equally in town and scum's interest to buy a given item, since the more an item is worth to town, the more money scum will be willing to spend to prevent town from getting it, and vice-versa. This might change depending on how the money mechanic develops though. There's a role called marketeer (potentially) in the game and i would guess this mechanic is centered around them.

...This is a really good point. I can definitely see how buying flavourcop to keep scum from doing so would be a good call. I doubt that was KoD's reasoning based on his posts, but this is good for people to note in the future when more scum-useful items come up later on.

 

[DawningWinds]

Probably. The gambler is another one that might require money, but I think marketeer is more likely

I'd expect both to involve money? Gambler would probably like challenge to a bet or something, and their chances of winning or losing would either be random or based on circumstances outlined in the bet.
And then marketeer most likely gets the money from the market and probably picks what's for sale.

 

[DawningWinds]

I think being very vocal about scanning someone is a good idea. It starts a discussion about being scanned, and someone acting too nervous or too cavalier about being scanned might be a good target to get interesting info from. I don't think it'll be very effective, but even a small hint is better than nothing on the first day.

It does get a discussion to get reads from rolling, yeah. I'm still not sure that makes it the best play? I feel like there are lots of ways to start discussion, and if he's really does have a plan to use the flavourcop out scum (which I'm 100% sure on), then there also happen to be ways to start discussion that don't involve telling scum that that's a thing they need to be aware of and play around?

 

[Paranoid King]

I'd expect both to involve money? Gambler would probably like challenge to a bet or something, and their chances of winning or losing would either be random or based on circumstances outlined in the bet.
And then marketeer most likely gets the money from the market and probably picks what's for sale.

I could imagine a market existing even without a marketeer, just so money can move around more easily.
I wonder how a marketeer getting money from the market works with the "richest player wins" mechanic. Maybe they don't start with any money and need to get all their money through sales? Because otherwise, it seems like they'd be a shoe-in for that.
Or maybe they don't get money from sales, but they take all the unsold items at the end of each day.

 

[Ragnarokio]

a lot of roles could potentially use money as a mechanic but the market specifically immediately brings attention to the marketeer. Its always possible its a coincidence, but its probably a strong enough connection that its worth keeping in mind.

 

[DawningWinds]

I could imagine a market existing even without a marketeer, just so money can move around more easily.
I wonder how a marketeer getting money from the market works with the "richest player wins" mechanic. Maybe they don't start with any money and need to get all their money through sales? Because otherwise, it seems like they'd be a shoe-in for that.
Or maybe they don't get money from sales, but they take all the unsold items at the end of each day.

Hmmm, maybe they start with none or less, I guess. That could make sense to weaken it.
Taking unsold items at the end of the day could be a different way to let them get something from the role, but what are the odds that they'll get a chance to do so? Some people might try and save all their money for the richest player wins wincon, but wouldn't you expect most people's main focus to be on achieving the faction wincon? Meaning people will most likely buy items seen as adventageous, which someone will probably see all the items as?

 

[Ragnarokio]

I have other sheep, too, that are not in this sheepfold. I must bring them also. They will listen to my voice, and there will be one flock with one shepherd.

 

[Morbid Minish]

The discussion is good, but speculating plans is kinda scummy. Why give scum more info that they might not realize? I think KoD buying the item looks pretty townie at the moment, but I can see some scum motivation behind it.

Also, just want to tell whoever is mafia...please don't kill me n1. I will sub back in so it will be a waste. Ty.

 

[Paranoid King]

It does get a discussion to get reads from rolling, yeah. I'm still not sure that makes it the best play? I feel like there are lots of ways to start discussion, and if he's really does have a plan to use the flavourcop out scum (which I'm 100% sure on), then there also happen to be ways to start discussion that don't involve telling scum that that's a thing they need to be aware of and play around?

That's true. But even if it's not optimal, I think it's a good play, regardless of alignment. Saying "I will hunt you down and expose your role to everyone," is aggressive, but that's kinda what you need to get results.

The discussion is good, but speculating plans is kinda scummy. Why give scum more info that they might not realize? I think KoD buying the item looks pretty townie at the moment, but I can see some scum motivation behind it.

Also, just want to tell whoever is mafia...please don't kill me n1. I will sub back in so it will be a waste. Ty.

It's only scummy if we have excellent reasons to believe that the planner is town-aligned. Otherwise discussion is a good thing. Mafia have more information and more heads to put together than we do. If we can figure something out, they probably can too.

Also, as Rag mentioned, buying an item is equally helpful for both town and scum, because one team buying something denies the other team the opportunity. I'm inclined to think KoD is town, but more because they plan to publicly reveal the role than because they bought the item.

 

[Morbid Minish]

That's true. But even if it's not optimal, I think it's a good play, regardless of alignment. Saying "I will hunt you down and expose your role to everyone," is aggressive, but that's kinda what you need to get results.


It's only scummy if we have excellent reasons to believe that the planner is town-aligned. Otherwise discussion is a good thing. Mafia have more information and more heads to put together than we do. If we can figure something out, they probably can too.

Also, as Rag mentioned, buying an item is equally helpful for both town and scum, because one team buying something denies the other team the opportunity. I'm inclined to think KoD is town, but more because they plan to publicly reveal the role than because they bought the item.

Even if the buyer is scum aligned you could give them ways to use it that they might not have thought of. And if they're town aligned then you can give scum their plans for it just by speculating. Sure Mafia can work together as a team to speculate outside of thread, but just because there are more of them doesn't mean they'll think of everything. One person is capable of mentioning something that no one else thought of. So if that's the case then that means there are definitely things scum can just miss or not realize when speculating.


There are plenty of good reasons why either alignment would want/not want items. And those reasons don't even rely on the ability of the items themselves.

 

[ExLight]

An item has been sold.
A Night Vision Binocular was purchased on April 21st, 5:35 AM (GMT-3).

 

[Ragnarokio]

it didn't occur to me that the purchases were anonymous simply because KoD announced himself so loudly

 

[Paranoid King]

Even if the buyer is scum aligned you could give them ways to use it that they might not have thought of. And if they're town aligned then you can give scum their plans for it just by speculating. Sure Mafia can work together as a team to speculate outside of thread, but just because there are more of them doesn't mean they'll think of everything. One person is capable of mentioning something that no one else thought of. So if that's the case then that means there are definitely things scum can just miss or not realize when speculating.

Let me put it another way.

Mafia have the ability to discuss outside of thread. This gives them an advantage. Open discussion in thread puts everyone back on equal footing. If mafia know something that was discussed in thread, town does too.

The idea is to keep secrets that mafia don't know about, while discussing things they are likely to talk about. Because of KoD's challenge, mafia is likely to talk about them. So discussing it in thread brings everyone up to speed.

The discussion is good, but speculating plans is kinda scummy. Why give scum more info that they might not realize?

Actually, would you mind elaborating on this? At best, talking about plans in thread would be a bad idea, not scummy.

There are plenty of good reasons why either alignment would want/not want items. And those reasons don't even rely on the ability of the items themselves.

Now I'm curious. This is a zero-sum game. What is good for one team is bad for the other. How would it be more important for one team to buy an item than the other?

 

[Morbid Minish]

Let me put it another way.

Mafia have the ability to discuss outside of thread. This gives them an advantage. Open discussion in thread puts everyone back on equal footing. If mafia know something that was discussed in thread, town does too.

The idea is to keep secrets that mafia don't know about, while discussing things they are likely to talk about. Because of KoD's challenge, mafia is likely to talk about them. So discussing it in thread brings everyone up to speed.

Yeah Mafia has the advantage of talking outside the thread. But not everyone needs to be on equal footing if it doesn't benefit everyone to be. Town can be in the dark from the workings of other town as long as it also keeps mafia in the dark. As long as town isn't lying, then them having their own info/reasons for doing something then not everyone needs to be privy.

Actually, would you mind elaborating on this? At best, talking about plans in thread would be a bad idea, not scummy.

It's scummy because it gives the appearance of actually doing something while not actually doing something. Like yeah there's discussion, but how does it help to find scum? Speculating is fine if it's about the scum motives behind what KoD did. But if you're speculating on all the town reasons he did it then you're giving scum that info and possibly outing a townie's plan to them. For example, some people do things as reaction tests. If people speculate about why the person did that certain thing and the speculation is that it's a reaction test, then it basically nullifies the test and lets people know to not react to it/change their reaction to it. Which is scummy because only scum has something to hide there. Town's reactions should be genuine and have nothing to hide.

Now I'm curious. This is a zero-sum game. What is good for one team is bad for the other. How would it be more important for one team to buy an item than the other?

I don't know if it's necessarily more important for one team over the other (besides like obviously it's more important for town of you're town and scum if you're scum and the items are more beneficial to your alignment). But as for why an alignment might not want to buy an item, maybe scum wants to save their money because they're at the numbers disadvantage so it gives them a chance at a second way to win. There are layers to something like this other than just having abilities.

 

[SoulAdvent]

The game has finally started!! Yay!!

I am kind of confused (or more accurately, i start feeling dizzy?) when thinking about this money function. It seems like it’s better to hold your money? If everyone starts with 1000 and everyone with the highest amount ties, then just holding the money and not buying anything should mean everyone wins, right??

Though, now that somebody has bought something, that definitely does not seem that it will be the case ^^;;