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Could a Zelda game have the potential to be a narrative masterpiece?

Sheikah_Witch

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Zelda games, while some of them tell great stories, are hardly first and foremost known for containing emotionally complex, nuanced and rich narrative experiences.

But are they able to?

With Zeldas setup of characters, lore and world building, do you think there is potential there to make games with some of the best storytelling in the medium? And how do you think such a game would look like? Additionally, which era in the timeline(s) would you want to see a more well-crafted, multi-faceted, story-driven experience take place in?
 

Bowsette Plus-Ultra

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Based on the series as a whole at this point? No. Zelda doesn't do enough compelling work with its narrative to come even close to a masterpiece category. It stumbles over broad story strokes by pushing characters in the background, and it just doesn't seem sure what to do with its secondary characters most of the time.
 
I definitely think Zelda has the characters, lore, world and history to make some games with some genuinely deep and emotionally resonant stories with complex plots and compelling narratives.

It's just Aonuma's mindset that 'story is an appendix to gameplay' that stops it from being such.
 

TheGreatCthulhu

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They totally can, but story has always taken a backseat in regards to the gameplay.

Video games as a medium can tell stories in an entirely unique way unlike film, animation, and books. The series has the deep lore and compelling characters to truly tell an awesome story that only a video game can tell, but I don't bank on that happening.
 

Cfrock

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Majora's Mask says hello :rosa:

Games excel in telling stories when story and gameplay are treated as the same thing. Honestly, a game can have all the world-building and deep lore it wants, but that doesn't mean the story will be good or even interesting. Most stories are, ultimately, the same thing and we resonate with how they are told more than anything else.

Video games can tell stories in ways no other medium can, and it's when they use that advantage that those stories become masterpieces. Majora's Mask is an example of this, in my view. It uses its game mechanics to create a world more believable than any other in the series, with a richness of character and a real sense of being lived in. The NPCs all feel like actual people with their own lives, and the game asks you follow them and learn who they are and what they want in order to actually help them.

It's all well and good killing a dragon in OOT, but it doesn't have even half the emotional weight of reuniting a son with his missing father. It's cool finding a magic sword and using it to defeat an evil wizard, but it doesn't come close to the intimacy of reuniting two lovers so they're together for the end of the world. It's epic to joust with a monster riding a giant boar on a bridge over an abyss, but that'll never break your heart as much as a woman getting her little sister drunk so she sleeps through the apocalypse.

Majora's Mask uses its central mechanic of a repeated time cycle to tell real, emotional, and engaging stories. Yes, they're on a smaller scale, but their impact is significantly larger because of it. And all of those interactions are what weave together the atmosphere and motivation for the main story. It's through understanding exactly what will be lost when the moon falls that we fear that moment. It makes the loss tangible, and thus more threatening, more terrifying. And it gives us a concrete, personal reason to fight it. We don't just fight because it's our destiny. We fight for Anju to marry Kafei. We fight for Pamela to have her daddy back. We fight for peace between the monkeys and Deku Scrubs. We fight so that Cremia doesn't have to put her sister to sleep.

Creating a narrative masterpiece isn't reliant on lore or scale or world-building. It's reliant on making the story and the gameplay one and the same, for them to feed into and reinforce each other. Sure, you can tell an excellent story in a game in a more traditional, cinematic way, but in such cases you end up rating the story separate from the game. When you can't do that is when you have something truly special. Zelda has done it before, so I see no reason why it can't do it again.

You don't need lore. You just need good design.
 

el :BeoWolf:

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Highly unlikely. Save for a couple exceptions Nintendo is gameplay first. Story is pretty much always an afterthought tacked on begrudgingly it feels at times.
 

Spiritual Mask Salesman

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Not as long as they maintain their ideology of story should take a back seat to gameplay. I'd love to see another Zelda game like Majora's Mask where both story and gameplay are interwoven, and I'd like to see Breath of the Wild's sequel be the game to manage it. I don't know if we'll ever get that much effort out of Nintendo with Zelda ever again, and honestly Majora's Mask felt like it all came together coincidentally somehow. Other games have decent themes ocassionally, but are rarely grippingly story-driven. I also can't help but get nervous because we all saw what happened the one time they did actually put emphasis towards story... Suckward Sword.
 

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Oh sure. There's the potential. But Ninty couldn't care less. "Story backseat to gameplay" is the way it is often described, but Ninty doesn't even relegate story to the back seat, they ignore it entirely.

Okay, not entirely. Zelda games do notably feature some pretty subtle and heavy narrative themes in a few titles and some pretty eloquent prose on the occasion. Ocarina of Time, Majora's Mask, Twilight Princess and yes even Wind Waker are the greatest examples. But even those games - with the possible exception of Majora - really held back with just how far they could take their story and themes.

I don't know if we'll ever get that much effort out of Nintendo with Zelda ever again
Not even once.

and honestly Majora's Mask felt like it all came together coincidentally somehow.
Why is it that any time ninty does something worthy of applause anymore it seems like a happy accident?

I also can't help but get nervous because we all saw what happened the one time they did actually put emphasis towards story... Suckward Sword.
Metroid Other M would also like to know your location. Whenever ninty does make a conscious effort to tell a story it turns out like... that.
 

thePlinko

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I think that the Zelda series has better stories than people tend to give it credit for. Majoras Mask, Windwaker, Links Awakening, and Spirit Tracks (at least in the context of being a sequel to Windwaker) all have really good stories and motifs. The thing is, the developers weren’t making thes games with the story in mind.

This doesn’t mean these games were accidents or didn’t have any effort put into them per se, but rather that they didn’t have too much effort being put into them. Look at Skyward Sword. This is probably the most story driven game Nintendo has ever made, and the general opinion of it isn’t very good. (I personally don’t think it was that bad, but it wasn’t amazing by any regard). How about Twilight Princess? That games story was as well made as a 4 year olds drawing of a house, yet you could tell they put arguably more effort into lore than gameplay. BotW may be an odd example considering it’s not exactly story driven, but one of the main mechanics of the game was completely story based, only for it to have the single worst story in the series.

My point is that in order for us to get a really good story in a Zelda game Nintendo needs to go back to what they used to be doing. They had the right idea. Gameplay first, story second. This is Nintendo’s most lore-heavy series (Metroid and Pokemon might have something to say about that but for the most part it’s definitely Zelda) so if they’re ever gonna give us a good story it’s gonna be from it.
 
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Oh sure. There's the potential. But Ninty couldn't care less. "Story backseat to gameplay" is the way it is often described, but Ninty doesn't even relegate story to the back seat, they ignore it entirely.

Okay, not entirely. Zelda games do notably feature some pretty subtle and heavy narrative themes in a few titles and some pretty eloquent prose on the occasion. Ocarina of Time, Majora's Mask, Twilight Princess and yes even Wind Waker are the greatest examples. But even those games - with the possible exception of Majora - really held back with just how far they could take their story and themes.


Not even once.


Why is it that any time ninty does something worthy of applause anymore it seems like a happy accident?


Metroid Other M would also like to know your location. Whenever ninty does make a conscious effort to tell a story it turns out like... that.


Your not wrong.
 

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