I kinda agree with thisI get that this was a joke mostly, but it feels weird. Maybe that's me, but I tend to take Mikey's "I have no meta" posts with a grain of salt. This feels almost...forced? Like the need to throw something back just to make him look bad for making his statement. Maybe I'm just tunnelling too hard.
I have some thoughts but I need to check some things first. But at the moment SMS and Tristan are sticking out to me. I'm not entirely sure if it's in a good or bad way yet. They're just piquing my interest.
Also I did some brief looking into what I mentioned earlier. Tristan's read of SMS felt interesting to me at the time, because SMS's post actually was reminding me of Classic Video games mafia for some reason. And I checked and it did kinda feel like as town SMS is more jokey at first, whereas as scum he seems more proactive early on. And that's what I was feeling here.
Ok, so you were apparently scumreading SMS.I am self admittedly not great at reading SMS. And I'm not even confident at the moment. I just feel a bit odd everyone is town reading him over that post when I felt differently. And Tristan's contrast in how he read into it made me second guess myself and also kinda made me wonder if SMS is maybe town and Tristan is throwing bs out there for an easy pocket read. But it's a bit of paranoia.
Can you remind me what was your opinion on the Rag x Chevy debate/interaction?I agree that Rag’s contributions have been fairly lackluster.
This is a fair worry that was bothering me at the time too. I kinda find funny Minish had the complete opposite opinion:I would like to vote for Rag but I'm slightly hesitant to due to Rubik and Pen still having their RVS votes on her. @Rubik @Pen could you either unvote or say whether you would actually like for her to be lynched?
This bothers me a bit. Two votes on someone is two votes regardless if it's RVS or not. Scum can sit comfortably and a wagon growing around their RVS is a good excuse for them to just leave it be or not want to move it.I don't think Rag is the easy vote here and I'm not sure why you think she is? She had two rvs votes on her that I don't take into consideration because they should be moved if not serious. And before I brought up my thoughts on Rag others were town reading her. It feels like you honed in on my reads list and read no other posts in the game.
Can we get an update on your reads and/or who you were town/scum reading D1?Plausible enough scum.
can someone explain the ISO to me yeetThis is a pretty good ISO.
susPretty heavily town reading Rubik right now.
Gonna address this first. I was asleep by the time SMS did his ISO and voted Rag. I was also asleep when day ended. So no there were no flags raised because I was unaware of it til after Rag flipped.Ok, so you were apparently scumreading SMS.
What did you think of his ISO and his 180° on Rag? Since you could see him as either alignment I feel like that should've raised a red flag and made you at least hesitate to keep the Rag wagon going?
wait this was throwing shade at TristanI kinda agree with this
This kinda fluff Moe kinda feel like jabs at other people approaching him
It's probably NAI but it kinda pings me a bit.
Yea my sleepy ass read that as him poking your "i HaVe No MeTa" joke that kinda annoyed me so I was fine with that lolDid you mean to say mezlo instead of moe?
maybe get some sleep you're barely coherentwait this was throwing shade at Tristan
I kinda dislike this
Yea my sleepy ass read that as him poking your "i HaVe No MeTa" joke that kinda annoyed me so I was fine with that lol
Just realized that he was actually antagonizing Tristan's message who's like my top town read which prolly makes me annoyed at them instead
If Tristan had said he was going to follow his meta when reading someone he would've been quite the hypocrite so I feel like this joke post actually puts him between a rock and a hard place because if he says he won't use the meta Johnny hounds him down and if he uses meta he also gets hounded down so it seems like an easy post to cling on?
I didn't say it was an excuse. And y'all keep twisting my read. It's not about activity. It's about the tone of his activity. One small part of it is activity based (scum Pen getting an earlier start than town Pen, but that doesn't mean I expect or give Pen a pass for not posting once he does start posting.) I wasn't even hard town reading him or anything, just thought he was possibly town and didn't want to lynch him d1. Also, I love how no one has questioned Kirino's read of Pen for the same reason but keep jumping on mine.I get this logic, but I find it rather silly. Being part of one’s meta is not an excuse to not participate when a lot was happening, especially when that person comes in later and says “lol I’m gonna keep my RVS vote cuz wynaut” which ends up resulting in a mislynch.
You're referring to [URL"https://zeldadungeon.net/forum/threads/boks-fantasy-book-mafia.70120/post-1272273"]this post[/URL] yeah? I probably overlooked it because of the relatively lighthearted tone and the fact that it was a one-off post, whereas you reiterated that read several times. Regardless, it's a bad read and I'm not sure how to feel about Kirino's sudden disappearance after his two early D2 posts so he's on my radar too.I didn't say it was an excuse. And y'all keep twisting my read. It's not about activity. It's about the tone of his activity. One small part of it is activity based (scum Pen getting an earlier start than town Pen, but that doesn't mean I expect or give Pen a pass for not posting once he does start posting.) I wasn't even hard town reading him or anything, just thought he was possibly town and didn't want to lynch him d1. Also, I love how no one has questioned Kirino's read of Pen for the same reason but keep jumping on mine.
You keep saying I swayed SMS, but I never once told him or anyone to vote Rag and had no intentions to. My back and forth with SMS was because he was suspicious of me so all of that was about defending my thought process and not swaying. I wasn't super confident in my Rag read but it was what I felt best voting at the time. And it's funny I'm considered spearheading the lynch because I was purposefully trying not to be a town leader or anything because I didn't want to die n1 in a game I really wanted to play in. So my actions weren't extremely townie d1 and you can say this is to cover my ass, but it was actually because I just wanted to survive past n1.I also want to reevaluate Minish somewhat. She was the first to vote for Rag after 2 RVS votes and ultimately the one who swayed SMS to vote that direction (getting SMS off her radar, something she is good at doing as scum). She spearheaded that lynch as a whole and I need to rethink my townread on her a bit.
Bundling these together because they touch on the same point. I don't particularly care about SMS's meta in this instance since people change their metas all the time. SMS was one of the first people in the game to give actual reads and was making some nice attempts to keep the game moving, which I think is a really silly thing to scumread someone for meta or not. He was acting in a pro-town manner, hence the town read.
Anyway, knowing now that SMS was town, I have to ask Minish, does my early read of him still ping you in the same way?
This is quite funny considering the post I just quoted. Your read of SMS was literally based on meta. That's the first thing you mention. That's why I thought it was bs because I knew he's acted differently as scum than what you were saying and the fact you seem so against meta but used that to justify your read.Early town lean on SMS. This is way different from Pen Mafia X in which he wasn't super present and made incredibly lazy reads.
Answered this in the above quote, but for someone so against meta you've brought up meta a couple of times already. I'm not gonna townread someone just for giving reads on people early, because I find that way easier to do as scum and I do it as scum a lot.What bs? You know how I feel about meta, so if I see someone say/do something that gives off town vibes I'm going to townread them for it. That's how this game should always be played and I will never ever change that opinion.
Yes and no. His vote doesn't look good because he kept it for no reason. His is probably my least favorite vote on Rag. But I also don't know if scum Pen draws that attention to himself as scum if he knows Rag will flip town.Do you still feel this way about Pen going into today?
Part of it is just a vibe. Your tone of posts feels like they're coming from maybe a more informed mind set. Also the meta stuff I mentioned earlier. There was one post I read after eod that I remember starting out agreeing with you and then the more the post went the less I liked it. I'll try to remember to find it later.You said again later that I was acting scummy but to this point you have yet to actually explain why.
I mean yeah. But I'm also notoriously always unconfident in my SMS read and bring it up often.The lack of confidence regarding Minish's SMS read sticks out to me a bit. Saying you're not confident with a read covers your butt when that person later flips since you can simply refer back to it and say "look I never actually scumread him". And I genuinely do feel like SMS was acting pretty townie at this point.
Your read of SMS seemed to hinge on my alignment so I'm curious if the inverse is also true?
No, that was my basis for explaining the read. I read people based off of when I played scum with them a bit. So I was using that game, but it explained the scummy actions I was seeing. Which was asking questions (possibly to try to trip someone up to push them), but not going anywhere with them. Asking questions is easy because it makes it look like you're proactive without actually being proactive, so that people will townread you. But those questions never led to anything more.Was your entire read of Rag based on one niche game that less than half the players in this game were involved with?
Also reads list as a whole is OK, I already mentioned how half of them are null reads which is meh.
Already mostly answered this above. But it's not really convenient that I referenced the closest game I have to being scum with Rag. The game was a bit complicated but we did think we were scum to begin with.Like I said above, I feel like the entire reasoning for this vote on Rag was based on a game in which she wasn't even technically mafia, and a game that most of us have no clue about. It just seems, idk, convenient? to me that the one game you consistently referenced in your read is one most of us can't really refer to.
Was there any reason for your vote beyond meta? Because Rag is someone who I feel changes her meta fairly often so it's not a great source of a read.
How is me calling someone out for things that they do as scum and then that person saying "yeah I do do that as scum" flimsy? Like that should be the most solid proof that my read was at least genuine even if wrong.I disliked that from Rag too, but this is rather flimsy.
Yes. It's too complicated to explain, but we still thought we were scum at the beginning and once we realized we weren't exactly we still had to keep hidden because there was a faction that was more like "town" to our "scum".If you weren't technically scum in that game, and it was unusual in many respects, then is it really a good game to use as the basis for your scumread?
I also addressed this earlier, but I think it's a bit much to act like I was really pushing for Rag's lynch. I was going with what I thought best at the time. Despite my read on you and SMS I was more unsure of those. If I were scum I'd probably just push you tbh. All of my posts were defending my read and vote of Rag and not pushing anyone else to vote her. If my reasoning for voting someone sways someone else that's not my fault because I can't just not give my reasons for voting someone.This is where Minish successfully swayed SMS into voting for Rag (or, at the very least, prompted him to check her ISO). I still think Min's scum read on Rag was a bit flimsy so I'm surprised that SMS was swayed so easily. Either way, the important thing here is that Minish was essentially the main person behind the wheel of Rag's lynch. Mikey planted seeds for it earlier, but Minish got SMS to look in that direction which in turn was the cause for Chevy's vote, which had made Rag's wagon the central occurrence of EoD leading to Kirino's vote. Pen and Rubik kept their RVS votes on Rag in spite of the rapid acceleration of said wagon but neither really played a role in driving it.
I mean, you're not using meta here to read me and you're wrong. So both things have their places and I do get decent lynches and town reads from meta.The main thing I got from Min's ISO is a reminder as to why I dislike relying on meta so much lol. The bases of all her reads, including on 2 people who flipped town, are meta-related, with Rag's being based on a game that should barely even count. She drove the Rag lynch and swayed a townie to join it, so as a whole I don't think that's a great look.