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Geography of Hyrule

Joined
Aug 18, 2011
Here, I'm simply wanting to lay out what I believe is a fairly good geography of Hyrule. First, I must state some of my assumptions that lead to my understanding of Hyrule.

1. Cartographers are not wholly accurate. Small things, mysterious things, and even whole towns move or vanish from one map to the next.
2.In line with the above, the games are best viewed as 'legends' or 'myths'. Heroic tales where the absolute location of a thing is minimal to the understanding of a story are common, thus why temples and *dungeons* might completely vanish, or appear a vast distance from a previously known area.
3. Some things are important, and therefore, never move unless the thing is mysterious or it's disappearance or movement lends to the story being legendary.

From here, with my assumptions, I note a few important things that are always present, or can be derived from the locations of each other. Lake Hylia, Death Mountain, the Castle, and the desert. In all of the stories, Lake Hylia rests to the south, it's headwaters coming from the waterfall at Zora's Domain, which resides among the mountain range in which Death Mountain lays, usually to the north-east. The Castle of Hyrule rests in the center of the land, while the desert sits in the west. This statement is correct when talking about the maps of ALttP, OoT, FSA, TP(GCN) and (loosely) MC. [Just learned that Death Mountain doesn't exist proper in MC... Mount Crenal, then is possibly just another mountain within the same range as Death Mountain...]

Now, arguments have been made for the maps of LoZ and AoL to also fit this bill, with Hyrule castle actually resting in the small, southern wilderness.The issue here is that Death Mountain, one of our derivable locations, is actually in the west. As well, Death Mountain itself is only shown as a mountainous area, while we know it is a large volcano. In LoZ, the final battle takes place in Death Mountain as accessed through Spectacle Rock. These would seem to lead to Death Mountain being a part of a much larger, still volcanic, mountain range that forms important borders between provinces during the Era of the Triforce using Monarchy. Hyrule itself sits to the west of Death Mountain, while the North Palace (possibly a vacation palace or border fortress at some point) lies to the east in the vast, mountainous 'Eastern Hyrule' (which may have become the center of the country during its decline).

To make matters a little more problematic, we have a set of seemingly moving areas that are rather important. These are Kakariko Village, the 'Lost Woods', and the Temple of Time. Here's where I get serious with the theory. Because Kakariko is placed in the mountain range of Death Mountain twice, as opposed to being near the Castle in ALttP, I believe that Castle Town was either called Kakariko during this time, or that the original Kakariko fell into obscurity following OoT (which could be upheld because of Old Kakariko in TP, which is on the Child Timeline, unlike ALttP's Failure Timeline). The Temple of Time houses the legendary and powerful Master Sword, once within Castle Town, and once (barely, since there isn't a roof) in the Faron Forest. This, and the location of the 'Lost Woods' (also known as Mysterious Woods, which must be gone through to get to the Temple in TP, and house the sword themselves in ALttP) can be chalked up to legendary and mysterious status of these locations.

Back to AoL for a moment. Many have noticed that several of the towns are named after the Sages from OoT, with the exception of two. The town of Mido, which rests on the shore of western 'East Hyrule', and old/new Kasuto, which rests in 'Dangerous Hyrule', in the shadow of the Great Temple above Death Valley (Note, that this is separate from Death Mountain, and would actually put the Great Temple on the side of a cliff if viewed in modern graphics). I believe that Kasuto is the replacement for Impa, as she exists in that story. To have her alive, with a town named after her so close to the location of the Triforce of Courage, would both give away her position of a guardian, and be extremely dangerous. Mido, however, appears to be just a small port town.

For most of the games, their location to each other physically is now explained. Except for FS. Most may notice that FSA's map is based strongly on ALttP's map, and for good reason. It takes place prior to that game. But FS seems to be in a different location, and it is. As above, I noted that Death Mountain is in the East of most games, except LoZ and AoL, which I explained. Here, it appears that Death Mountain is in the North, like in LoZ. Same place? Not likely. One might notice the bridge just north of the forest stage, which goes off into another land. I believe that that other land is LoZ's Hyrule, or that FS takes place in the south-west section, below Death Mountain, within the 'Lost Woods' of LoZ, and in a previously unvisited icy location to the south.

So now, outside of a few small issues, like the huge size of Maze Island and the Death Mountain area in AoL (which are simply caused by the graphics of the time), I feel that a basic sketch of Hyrule is fairly easy to draw. For clarity, the Hyrule of OoT and TP are really only so big because of their proximity in time to the Unification War and Interloper War, causing a smaller country that has focused more on internal growth than outward expansion. For LoZ and AoL, the country is near the end of its' decline after several generations of Triforce use causing growth.
 
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Joined
Aug 18, 2011
Here's a little something I cooked up that may help clarify how I view things. This is just the Eastern side of Eldin Province, with LoZ and AoL's Hyrule shown on the right. I left out Talus Cave as I'm not quite sure how it looks in FS to make it look good in my map.
VZ8ks.jpg
 
Joined
Oct 22, 2012
I've always believed that every map is viewed from a different perspective or are showing a new portion of the land because you can tell from OoT ( I use this as an example frequently because I play almost non-stop) you can clearly see the land could go farther if the cartridge would have allowed for a bigger overworld. You only see portions of hyrule that are significant to that game. As for any other movement of the geography relocation (which isn't unlikely seeing as TP verifies AT LEAST 2 seperate Kakariko villages), erosion, continental drift, earthquakes, climate change, so on and so forth could be explanations seeing as time lapses are not well specified between many of the games. It's also possible that as you said the legend status the games portray could account for different takes on the geography of Hyrule.
 

Sarianae

Infinite Dreamer
Joined
Nov 21, 2010
Location
Storybrooke, Maine
I've never actually sat down to study Hyrule's geography for some reason, but since I think it's probably something I should be taking a crack at at some point at least once, I figure now is as good a time as any.

1. Cartographers are not wholly accurate. Small things, mysterious things, and even whole towns move or vanish from one map to the next.
2.In line with the above, the games are best viewed as 'legends' or 'myths'. Heroic tales where the absolute location of a thing is minimal to the understanding of a story are common, thus why temples and *dungeons* might completely vanish, or appear a vast distance from a previously known area.
3. Some things are important, and therefore, never move unless the thing is mysterious or it's disappearance or movement lends to the story being legendary.

Agree wholeheartedly---the assumptions you point out are extremely essential.

Well if you want to go by the HH timeline, the way you should compare (strictly) Hyrule maps is in this order:

SS --> MC --> FS --> OoT --> TP --> FSA
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|------> ALttP --> LoZ --> AoL (FYI I vehemently reject this timeline but for the purposes of a Hyrule geography discussion, I can disregard that.)

(Because of the flooding of Hyrule in the Wind Waker, I'm not sure how relevant it would be to study its geography since the scattering of its landmarks into separate islands means they had the freedom to relocate them anywhere....additionally it was no longer called Hyrule at that point, so I'm going to disregard it for now.)

Firstly as you mentioned, there are several landmarks that hold fairly constant on every iteration of Hyrule, the ones you mentioned---(Hyrule) Castle, the (Lost) Woods, (Death) Mountain, Kakariko Village, Lake (Hylia), and the Desert. I think it's a good idea to mark these on every map to see how they evolve throughout the games.

I don't think that Skyward Sword's map should be studied too closely to be honest, since it's three areas are self-contained and it isn't shown exactly how they connect to each other; the whole map with regards to where everything is in relation to one another is pretty ambiguous. It's probably just worth noting that Skyloft's return to the Sealed Grounds probably becomes the basis for Hyrule Castle, Eldin Volcano eventually becomes Death Mountain, Lanayru Desert probably either becomes the Lanayru we know in TP, or becomes the desert beyond the Haunted Wasteland where the Desert Colossus is in OoT which later becomes known as Gerudo Desert, Lake Floria becomes either Lake Hylia or Zora's Domain, and Faron Woods is probably connected to the Kokiri Forest (especially because of the Deku Tree in the Sealed Temple), with its deep woods perhaps turning into the lost woods. (Also that the Sealed Temple in Faron likely becomes the Temple of Time--even though that screws up the Deku Tree's placement in OoT--while the Temple of Time in Lanayru Desert probably becomes Arbiter's Grounds in TP).

However if we are to go by the HH, there are a couple of games that precede OoT anyhow, and so SS's geography becomes the basis for what we see in TMC. The two landmarks that I think are clear would be Hyrule Castle and Lake Hylia, as they are pretty much in exactly the same placement from one another that Skyloft in the Sealed Grounds and Lake Floria were--IF you want to stick to SS's geography meticulously that is. Eldin Volcano (perhaps) could be Mt Crenel, however, I think it makes more sense to assume that Mt. Crenel is a separate mountain (and if anything, could be assumed as a mountain that was part of the range in Lanayru Desert). Death Mountain is traditionally located behind Hyrule Castle, and since the castle on TMC's map is located at the very top, Death Mountain is probably intentionally cut off on this map, and can be assumed as further North above the castle. The Minish Woods could be Faron Woods, but placement would be a little off then if Lake Floria is assumed to evolve into Lake Hylia. Also, considering the fact that Twilight Princess much further down still retains an area called "Faron Woods," it would be strange to assume that the Faron Woods in Skyward Sword had it's name changed to Minish Woods, and then something else such as Kokiri Forest, only to have its name returned to Faron Woods in TP. It makes more sense to assume that Faron Woods was retained as a separate location from the Minish Woods during this era, only that it is not shown on the map. If I were to make a guess, judging from Faron Wood's location above Lake Floria in SS, it's probably just right above Lake Hylia here as well; on the map, you can't actually see what's in the top right corner above Lake Hylia because it's occupied by Cloud Tops, which is not actually connected to the rest of the map since it shows what is high above that area's altitude, rather than the area on the ground underneath itself. The Minish Woods could perhaps connect to Faron Woods around the right side of Lake Hylia, but I suppose that's irrelevant since it isn't shown anyhow.

The map in Four Swords I wouldn't examine too closely since it's more a set of "stages" than connected overworld much like Skyward Sword's map was. It's worth noting however that "Death Mountain" makes its first appearance here, now having gotten its name changed from "Eldin Volcano" in SS (IF we are to assume they are the same volcano). Now Vaati's Palace in TMC had just been Hyrule Castle taken over, but honestly looking at Vaati's wind palace floating in the sky, I would assume that they have nothing to do with one another. If anything, you could try to assume that he created a castle on a remaining sky islet (left over from SS) using magic perhaps. (Although you could also assume that the Wind Tribe from The Minish Cap originally elevated this islet into the Heavens---if you are to assume it is related to the Palace of Winds). On the other hand, Sea of Trees does look like it could possibly be an evolution of Deep Woods, or an early formation of the Lost Woods. The waterfalls at Talus Cave are also reminiscent of Zora's Domain to me, but I wouldn't jump to conclusions on that one.

Ocarina of Time's map is the one everyone usually the one everyone defaults to. Transitioning FS's Death Mountain to OoT's is straight forward and even the Sea of Trees really does seem to be in the right position to evolve into the Lost Woods. As for the disappearance of FS's Talus cave, I can think of two explanations to explain it: (1) Talus Cave was demolished and Kakariko Village was built in its place (because the location of Kakariko Village does seem to coincide with it), or (2) FS's map is not actually geographically accurate and just serves as a "stage selection" menu, in which case the location of Talus Cave would be irrelevant to attempt deciphering.

There is the supposed timeline split that occurs here, and at least the original two-way split is something I believe in. This is on the child timeline with Majora's Mask, but since Termina's geography is irrelevant (unless you want to theorize something about how the geography of Termina in Majora's Mask somehow reflects a simultaneous evolution in Hyrule's geography because they are "connected" across the worlds since Termina is supposed to be an alternate Hyrule, but I think that's pushing it), the next evolution of Hyrule geography is seen in Twilight Princess. This is where there start to develop some serious continuity issues.
(1) Death Mountain seems a further distance away from Hyrule Castle now, although you could explain it by saying that that distance had been there in OoT to start with, only that this map fleshes out that distance and what's in between it better.
(2) Sacred Grove I'd be certain is an evolution of the Lost Woods. The Kokiri Forest I'd say either loses its name and merges with SS's Faron Woods (which had been left off the map up to this point) or still exists but is not shown on the map here, with this map returning to showing the "Faron Woods" part of the forest not seen since SS.
(3) I believe that the (unnamed) desert beyond the Haunted Wasteland where the Desert Colossus had been in fact refers to Gerudo Desert here. Either that or the arid area beyond Gerudo Fortress became a desert and hence the "Gerudo Desert" here, while the Desert beyond the Haunted Wasteland could either be an evolution of, OR simply connect into the desert referred to in SS as "Lanayru Desert."

Now, if you'll notice, the gaps between locations seem to have expanded in some places, and shrunk in others. While that may be, and while that may seem like a lot of discontinuity ontop of how far some locations seem to have moved since Ocarina of Time, if you actually rotate TP's map a bit, you'll notice that the relation between most areas barring the desert aren't as different as they might seem at first:

The relations between areas are pretty much the same, just that the distances between them seem to have grown or shrunk. You could explain that in the following ways:
(a) Hyrule's cartographers are terrible at measurements so the distances in both maps are inaccurate and the actual distances between areas is the same as its always been.
(b) Hyrule's tectonic plates moved......a lot?
(c) It's not that anything is inconsistent, just that the map fleshes out certain areas more and other areas less in a way that makes it seem as though places have moved.

As for the location of the desert, although it is placed in the bottom left of TP's map, I think its location can be interpreted loosely since the means of getting there is through a canon blast from Lake Hylia, meaning the distance between Lake Hylia and Gerudo Desert is fairly unspecified, and can be larger than depicted on the map. This means that Gerudo Desert's actual location could be closer to connecting into the desert that OoT's Desert Colossus was part of.

I always assumed that Four Swords Adventures took place directly after Four Swords, so HH's placement after TP was not something I would have ever expected. In fact....I don't think it makes much sense at all.

No matter how you orient TP's map, it's difficult to make sense of the altered relationship between key locations. Kakariko Village and the Lost Woods are now on the opposite side of Death Mountain....in fact the entire map seems to have been flipped horizontally. Although, if you compare, you'll find that the Death Mountain---Hyrule Castle---Lake Hylia triangle is still there (albeit stretched) but with the Lost Woods and Kakariko village being on the other side of that triangle. Is there a way to make sense of this?









Here are the possible explanations I see:
(a) This is a "stage select" map, meaning the geographical location of the different areas is not reflected here, and so cannot be determined.
(b) Hyrule's Cartographers......wrote part of this map up backwards. =/
(c) Okay, here's an actual theory. You'll have to excuse the convoluted explanation.
> The Lost Woods in this FSA map is a different Lost Woods than the one referred to in TP (will elaborate on this later)
> Kakariko Village was demolished and rebuilt on the other side of Death Mountain due to convenience, problems that were occurring within the other location, or the fact that the village was destroyed/abandoned at some point and so rebuilt elsewhere.
> Snowpeak may or may not be frozen Hyrule. (Side Note: The Tower of Winds seems to be a direct reference to The Minish Cap's Tower of Winds, along with the Palace of Winds in the Realm of the Heavens, something worth noting.)
> The Desert of Doubt may or may not be an evolution of Gerudo Desert. A this point on the timeline, there have been so many other deserts (that I tend to feel off-map connect into one another anyhow) that this could be an evolution of any one of them.

>>>>>>>> This would be the end of the evolution of Hyrule's geography thus far on the child timeline <<<<<<<<

Now with regards to Hyrule's geography on the invalid third timeline, we'll have to jump back to OoT's map to do a comparison between that one and ALttP's. And when we do that......well, there are some rather familiar inconsistencies. If you look at the Death Mountain---Hyrule Castle---Lake Hylia triangle, it's pretty consistent (after you tilt one of the maps of course) but yet again, Kakariko Village and the Lost Woods have switched to the other side of the map. Interestingly, this is the EXACT same inconsistency that occurred on the OTHER timeline between TP's map and FSA's. And while I could hence try to explain this in the same way I explained that inconsistency, it is rather curious for this identical parallel geographical shift to occur on two separate timelines. As a result, it brings a little bit more unorthodox theories to mind for me:

(1) An extremely unorthodox geographical shift of two identical locations (Kakariko Village & the Lost Woods) is identically occurring on two completely separate timelines. Convoluted Theorizing: Is this hinting at some sort of cross-timeline divine phenomenon that is affecting Hyrule's geography to be altered in the same way across the divisions of time and space? The divine intervention of the Ancient Goddesses? Is there something pre-apocalyptic occurring in Hyrule on both timelines at this spot that requires them to for some reason counter by altering the location of Kakariko Village and the Lost Woods? // Ok end convoluted theorizing.










(2) Confirmation that this third timeline split must be incredibly faulty and is thereby completely nullified ( I APPROVE ). Rather than the above convoluted theory to explain why the same geographical inconsistency is occurring on two separate timelines, it would make a hefty amount more sense to assume that FSA and TP are on the same timeline. There is an impressive amount of consistency between their maps:



(3) Kakariko Village I cannot really explain outside of it being demolished and rebuilt elsewhere. However with regards to the Lost Woods, there's an interesting theory I have come up that could explain this apparent shift of it from one side of the map to the other:
Perhaps there are actually TWO separate locations referred to as the Lost Woods, one on the left side of Hyrule, and a different one one the right. They may alternate between games which "Lost Woods" gets to appear on the map.

This thinking sprouted from something along this thought process:




Child timeline:

LEFT Lost Woods: Portion of Lanayru Desert? (SS) ---> Royal Valley (TMC) ---> off the map (FS) ---> Gerudo Valley? (OoT) ---> off the map (TP) ----> Lost Woods (FSA)

RIGHT Lost Woods: Deep Woods (SS) ---> off the Map (TMC) ---> Sea of Trees? (FS) ---> Lost Woods (OoT) ----> Sacred Grove (TP) ----> Near the (Eastern) Fields/Off the Map (FSA)

The RIGHT Lost Woods would be the traditional one (with OoT's Lost Woods and TP's Sacred Grove, because traditionally speaking the Lost Woods has always been on the right side of the map) while the LEFT Lost Woods is the one I'm theorizing about. The reason I think it could have possibly started as a portion of Lanayru Desert actually has to do with the Royal Valley in TMC. The Royal Valley is speculated to have been a Lost Woods because it has the same nature of puzzling navigation (in this case being that you have to follow the directions of the signs to get through it). In addition, the trees in the Royal Valley are rather....barren. It strikes me as an area that could have grown out of a desert-like area, and that is what coincides with SS's left side of the map. I would then say it was probably off the left side of the map in FS, and then maybe reappeared again as Gerudo Valley in OoT (still a valley, plus it would be in-line with SS's Lanayru Desert) then was off the left side of the map again in TP, and then reappeared in FSA as the Lost Woods.

Third Timeline:

LEFT Lost Woods: Portion of Lanayru Desert? (SS) ---> Royal Valley (TMC) ---> off the map (FS) ---> Gerudo Valley? (OoT) ---> Lost Woods (ALttP)

RIGHT Lost Woods: Deep Woods (SS) ---> off the Map (TMC) ---> Sea of Trees? (FS) ---> Lost Woods (OoT) -----> Off the Map (ALttP)

Similarly on the third timeline, the LEFT Lost Woods would primarily grow out of the Royal Valley, then (perhaps) Gerudo Valley (or it could just be off the left side of OoT's map) and then become ALttP's Lost Woods on the left side (while the traditional Lost Woods on the right side would be off the map at this point).

Of course, the one main issue with this theory is the Master Sword's placement in ALttP in the Lost Woods, which seems to assume that it is the same "Lost Woods" as TP's "Sacred Grove," which had the ruins of the Temple of Time from OoT (and also the Sealed Temple from SS). This can be interpreted as more invalidation of the third timeline split.

Anyhow, I could go further analyzing the maps of Zelda I and Zelda II, but I think that would be for another time, another day.

Essentially, attempting to explain the changes in Hyrule's geography brings me to one conclusion: there isn't much value in doing so, because it's evident that Nintendo doesn't care too much about the consistency of the geography to begin with. Their focus of interest every time they create a new Zelda is its gameplay and "fun" value, so consistency in geography is something they will easily overlook in favor of that. Sadly, attempting to decipher the reasoning behind changes in Hyrule's geography appears in and of itself to be overanalyzing. Still was worth a shot though, I'd say.
 
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Jirohnagi

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Guys think about it, the master sword is a turning point in most of the games right? and in the games it doesn't show it can be assumed it isn't being used at that time and is in it's dormant state, so if you were to use the location of the ALTTP, OOT, TP, WW Master Swords, we can pivot the maps around that one point because the sword can't be moved can it. (going on the assumption that it can't). I will happily bet that the entirety of hyrule either moves focus' further in each of the compass direction following a different part of hyrule each time. In the case of TP we can assume that hyrule was moved farther north and closer to the mountain, Wheras ALTTP seems to move more south easterly and further from the mountains (the true mountains) This is of course assuming you use OOT as a baseline. You could in fact speculate that the events of OOT heavily influenced the development of hyrule. WW Hyrule is literally OOT Hyrule but flooded this is due to adult Link's victory. TP is after Child Link's success in telling the princess of Ganondorf's plans. Whereas ALTTP happens after links defeat. After these three world changing events hyrule is Flooded or moved in a new compass direction. (I uses OOT, WW,TP and ALTTP because it's easy to see the changes) If you look at ALLTP map it fits almost exactly with a few minor differences, same with TP.
 
Joined
Aug 18, 2011
Wow... I'd almost forgotten about this thread...

Sarianae, You make a lot of great points, several I hadn't thought of. Your idea of Mt. Crenal being a western mountain as opposed to being part of Death Mountain also fits when you think about the Royal Valley and Gerudo Valley possibly being the same.

I've personally taken to seeing how Labrynna and Holodrum fit in accordance with Hyrule, and thanks to SS have a few extra points to make.

First, Talus Cave. I found it interesting that there are two locations with similar names that have not been associated except by me (I spent several hours searching for similar finds) and that is Talus Cave and Talus Peaks. Talus Peaks is depicted as a twin peak mountain with a river flowing from it. Strangely, for a river flowing there it is barren. Almost no vegetation. On FS map, Talus Cave appears to be situated in an icy, barren, twin peak mountain. Very similar, and then leads to my next finding. Each area of FS map is separated by a river. Because of this and the fact that it is a level select screen, I assume that areas not important to the story are left out, namely the castle and villages. When we look at the Sea of Trees we can notice that it lies right along water to the east and has a bridge to the north going to an unvisted land. The only time we have seen a forest area like this was in the original game, on the south east side of the map. Between there and Death Mountain there is a river, in both games. directly north of this forest area in AoL is a bridge that leads to the 'Western Hyrule' area. Thus, I believe that FS takes place in both LoZ's Hyrule and the northern part of Labrynna.

Now, Holodrum is a bit more speculative, but only because we don't have a lot of info. Most of the games taking place in Hyrule really under use their western halves, especially with a desert being there almost every time. However, Holodrum features a bit of desert to it's east, which contains an old sailing ship, quite similar to SS Lanayru Desert. I think this ship is either the Pirate Stronghold, or the Pirate Ship. We may never have more info to work off.

FSA taking place after TP was a sucker punch for everyone I think. I always related it to ALttP's map, which gives the most similarity's.

I find it interesting that your TP map has the OoT map under-laid, showing how Gerudo Valley and Haunted Wasteland might relate to Gerudo Desert. Another interesting note would be to assume, if OoT was played on the TP map, that to get to Kakriko we would go north of the castle, and then through the mountains to Death Mountain. Almost makes the map fit better...

Ganon, your idea that the maps could actually be rotated around the location of the Master Sword is interesting, and I'll give it a try a little bit later.

I was going to wait to show this off, as it's not ready to my tastes, but this is my current visulization of Hyrule before reading your posts.
iVJfUl.jpg
 
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